Land of cotton, old times there are not forgotten : Redux

Johnrankins

Some people sounded interested in this TL so I am starting it up again. I will appreciate any help when I hit WWI as I did that poorly and that is when people seemed to lose interest.

"This is WXCH Chicago and you are on the air" says the sultry voice of Alice Johnson .A rough voice says "I am sick of all these Confederates coming up here and dragging down American wages. They do little more than get drunk on moonshine, sleep until noon and collect welfare checks while decent American taxpayers have to work for a living." Radio broadcast Nov 4, 2010


The CSA economy was in terrible shape after the War of Southern Independence being hip deep in debt at all levels with ruined infrastructure and a need for a large army both to keep an eye on the USA and to recapture escaped slaves. The Beauregard Administration had its hands full from the beginning of its term having to deal with a broke treasury , a very hostile US to the north and west and pariah status abroad. Although he certainly worked hard at it he was always a step behind.

The UK blockade and plantation raids after the CSA default on its debt didn't help. A deal was finally negotiated, after the British government was finally convinced that there was no way that the CSA could possibly pay back all its debt quickly, that for a 2% point increase in the interest rate all CSA debt would be extended 30 years.

To be fair it made a number of reforms. The price controls on rail shipping, various food items and salt were slowly lifted. This didn't save the railroads from bankruptcy but at least it made the new railroads worth something when they bought the tracks. He also pushed through an amendment to allow direct taxation so that the CSA could have some revenue as virtually all its tarrif revenue was being used to pay back the loans.

A History of the Confederacy John C. Washburn University of Virginia Press 1994
 

Johnrankins

My biggest difficulty with dealing with the CSA is pretending their ambassador was anything more than a puppet of Washington, or perhaps more accurately, Wall Street. With almost everything of real importance owned by US corporations and CSA lasting only as long as Washington would allow it the real power was in New York.

Banks, refineries, textile mills, cigar and cigarette factories, coal mines, iron mines and steel mills all had Southern names but had the vast majority of its stock owned by people living in New York, Chicago, Philadelphia. and Boston etc. Same thing with railroads, TV stations , radio stations and publishing houses.

Its armed forces were a joke compared to the US Army. The US Army had more battle wagons than they had armored cars and were 30 years newer to boot. Their planes were newer, faster , more agile and better armed. The logistical systems were such that the US could return artillary fire with the CS Army at least ten fold. On top of all that the USN is the most powerful in the world while the CSN is a bunch of frigates and corvettes.


Still with all that, diplomatic necessity demanded I speak to the CSA ambassador instead of the people actually in charge in Washington. This caused frustrating delays as when he had to get permission for something he would have to contact Richmond who then would have to call Washington or New York for instructions on anything that was truly important.

Albert C Stapleton Diary of an English Ambassador Oxford Publishing 2000


The Nathen Bedford Forrest presidency was an important one in history. He solidified the power of the presidency of the CSA. Forrest changed his residency from Tennessee to Mississippi after the war as the Treaty of Washington conceded Tennessee to the Union in 1866. He bought a big plantation house that was saved from Sherman's troops before it could be burned. However the crop wasn't saved and the owner slowly sank into bankruptcy.

Forrest adopted a populist message during his campaign stressing his rise from the bottom to the very top of Southern society. Due to the massive unrest since the War of Southern Independence he was able to convince the planters to have their taxes slightly to pay for somewhat higher army pensions and a tax break to small farmers. As he told them "Would you rather pay 15% more in taxes or risk losing it all?" This move greatly reduced the chances of a Communist Revolution that seemed so likely the previous two or three years. He also used the money to help tighten the borders.

Of all the CSA Presidents he was the most ruthless enforcer of the Slave Code. He significantly increased the size of the cavalry specifically to hunt down escaped slaves. The US naturally increased the size of its cavalry to compensate.


The Forrest Presidency William Hanson II Virginia University Press

Since the beginning of the war there was an increase in the number of escaped slaves. Small numbers at first but quickly rising with each success of the North the number of escaped slaves rose quickly. The Fugitive Slave Law was repealed in 1866 as the new Republican majority passed it.

President Pendleton became one of the most hated presidents in US History after he ended the war after McClellan's death. Since Sherman reached the Atlantic Ocean just days after McClellan's death it seemed to everyone that Pendleton , in the words of the Republican Party of the time, "He snatched defeat from the jaws of victory." After that he was considered little more than a traitor. He moves to Havana and later Madrid after leaving office surviving no less than 5 assassination attempts during his presidency and one afterwards It looked like the war might be renewed when the Republicans came back to office but President Hooker wanted to reform the army first. As he said "It would do no good to refight the war before we were ready" (Most think that Grant would have been elected if it weren't his untimely death when he died in a train accident in early 1866.) He was almost ready when a war scare with GB stopped it.

The aftermath of the War of Southern Rebellion Smithers Books 1925
 
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Not Henry G.

Awesome to see this back. This is quite an unique TL in terms of what happens to the CSA, and I'm hoping this time you can take it to the end.
 

Admiral Halsey

Banned
If Sherman was at the ocean at that point wouldn't Congress override any attempt by the president to end the war without the surrender of the CSA? Hell even the most anti-war newspapers would see the writing is on the wall for it as well and the Northern Public would be pissed at those they elected.
 

Darth_Kiryan

Sherman also seems to have taken longer to reach the sea, because if McClellan died as President-elect, it makes no sense that he would have the authority to order a ceasefire.
 

Johnrankins

Admiral Halsey said:
If Sherman was at the ocean at that point wouldn't Congress override any attempt by the president to end the war without the surrender of the CSA? Hell even the most anti-war newspapers would see the writing is on the wall for it as well and the Northern Public would be pissed at those they elected.
Click to expand...

Congress has no power over the army and the Northern Public was pissed. The Democrats get massacred in the next election.
 

Admiral Halsey

Banned
Johnrankins said:
Congress has no power over the army and the Northern Public was pissed. The Democrats get massacred in the next election.
Click to expand...

Except legally Congress can still declare war so if the CSA is on the verge of loosing then Congress can just redeclare it ASAP overriding any presidential veto. Basically if the CSA is about to go down and the President orders a halt to the war then Congress is going to override it.
 

Johnrankins

Admiral Halsey said:
Except legally Congress can still declare war so if the CSA is on the verge of loosing then Congress can just redeclare it ASAP overriding any presidential veto. Basically if the CSA is about to go down and the President orders a halt to the war then Congress is going to override it.
Click to expand...

And if he doesn't move the army after Congress declares war? I agree it is one hell of a longshot but the South winning is one hell of a longshot in and of itself.
 

Johnrankins

Admiral Halsey said:
I have a feeling the army might break the oath at that point and move on its own.
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True, I admit it is one of the weak points of the TL. I did want to kill off the Democratic Party up north and replace it with a new one. If the Democrats snatched defeat out of the jaws of victory that could do it.
 

Johnrankins

The CSA has voted to finally end the Albert Laws (Think Apartheid) today bowing to international pressure and rioting Blacks. The agreement reached guarantees the validity of private property and limits to taxation.
This station hopes that it is the start of the major reforms that is needed in the Confederacy. It needs to catch up to at least the mid 20th century to successfully enter the upcoming 21st.
WMXT New York television broadcast Jan 6, 1999

The were high hopes for the Lee presidency. George Washington Custis Lee being the eldest son of Robert E Lee was elected in a landslide.

Sadly for him cotton prices were on the slide and GB increased pressure on the CSA to end slavery. Meanwhile trade with the US was almost completely cut off for half his presidency as punishing the South was the order of the day for the USA.

He finally got trade opened up with the United States in 1883. Trade was restricted strictly raw cotton and foodstuffs at the time. The US allowed banks to legally loan money to CSA residents (A lot of illegal loans were made previous to the legalization however) but they could not accept slaves as collateral. It became increasingly common for planters to deal with two banks , a CSA one which could accept slaves as collateral and a US one for cheaper loans backed by land and cotton.

However this failed to save the Custis Lee presidency from being perceived failure, partly due to the high hopes given to it by virtue of his being the son of Robert E Lee. This book tries to show that this a bit unfair. Although Lee made his share of mistakes he inherited a situation fraught with difficulties
It is a near miracle that it survived at all.
The Presidency of Custis Lee by Albert Stuart Birmingham University Press 1928
 

TFSmith121

Banned
Fair enough... interesting minor point there is that

Johnrankins said:
More like Mexico, without nukes, with most of the their military tech at around the Vietnam War era or so in 2016.
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Fair enough... interesting minor point there is that even today (2016) much of Mexico's ordnance and equipment is second-hand US standard, with a mixed bag of locally- and licensed-produced equipment and material purchased from various European nations post-Cold War.

One of the questions that would come to mind in a "broken-backed confederacy survives" scenario is who said power's trading partners would be; the US is obvious (because the Europeans can get cotton and tobacco elsewhere) and so the realities are the cornfeds are something akin to (as you point out) a US proxy.

Which makes for some interesting dynamics in statecraft; depending on how long it takes for the rapprochement and recognition of economic reality to take place, the CSA/PACS ends up becoming something like the ROKs and AFP (or the Indian Army/Brigade of Gurkhas) for the US - useful cannon fodder on the edges of the Cold War.

Not that the names would be the same, but be entertaining as hell to see a Colin Powell-like figure serving as the "advisor" for a CSA battalion of PWT types somewhere in West Africa in the 1960s, facing off against the local equivalent of the VC backed by some continental European enemy with an ideological "liberationist" bent (Fascists or Communists, you make the call) in a former British or French colony where the "old" imperial power took a Dien Bien Phu equivalent in the 1950s...

Lot more likely than the "CSA as Nazis" tropes that get kicked around; "CSA as the Filipinos or ROKs" isn't quite as moonlight and magnolias, however.

Best,
 
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Johnrankins

Not Henry G. said:
Awesome to see this back. This is quite an unique TL in terms of what happens to the CSA, and I'm hoping this time you can take it to the end.
Click to expand...

Well, since you stopped posting replies I thought you lost interest. The only way I know people are interested is if I get replies.
 

Johnrankins

The Hampton Presidency was fraught with difficulty. It started well as the restart of trade started a mini-boom in the CSA. Then in 1887 a bill passed parliament to cut off trade with the CSA until it outlawed slavery. This coupled with the introduction of the boll weevil devastated the CSA economy. The effect rippled through the economy. Land and slave prices fell like a stone causing many state governments to run deficits that they mostly covered by printing bank notes and inflation began to soar again.

However mining and forestry grew as both the mining and forest industries bought slaves in large numbers as did railroad industry. An increasing number of people in the middle class bought them as household servants as well.


However neither the US nor Mexico cut off trade with the CSA and both bought cotton. Both then re-exported most of the cotton to England taking the "middleman's cut" in the process. With the depressed prices of CSA assets the US and , to a lesser extent, Mexico started snapping up CSA property . Not so much plantations but warehouses , small factories, shortline railroads and mines. The CSA diversified a bit during this period.

This caused a mini-boom in Mexico as profits from the cotton trade helped the Mexican economy. Warehouses were built, the railroads were improved and small textile factories were built. The price of land in Mexico increased and wages started to go up. Mexico was still far from rich but it wasn't quite as dirt poor as it was before the Hampton Administration.


The depression of 1887 Jl Ustus Arlington Books 1915

Presidential candidate's AK Rowling's candidacy has been badly hurt by pictures of him and his Black mistress , Alice Hawking, were shown in the NY Times. They were shown kissing in the headline. He was the leading candidate who called for restrictions on US investments. This station feels this is to be expected from a Socialist like AK Rowling. These "Progressive Whig" Socialists believe in Free Love, interracial sex, and hedonism despite what they might say as proven by the actions of AK Rowling.

WGHT Houston TV Broadcast. 1991
 

Johnrankins

List of CS Presidents
Jefferson Davis 1861-1867
P.T Beauregard 1867-1873
Nathen Bedford Forrest 1873-1879
George Washington Custis Lee 1879-1885
Wade Hampton 1885-1891

"The Yankees seem to run everything down here. They own the factories, the railroads, the banks and the media. What have we got left? Our homes , our farms and our forests. We need to grab control of them" says a loud voice. "It seems that we have a free loving, godless Socialist on our hands. He'll probably get back to burning churches and having children in sin" says the anchor.

ZCCV Atlanta Radio Broadcast owned by American Broadcast Media based in New York Nov5, 1989


The Pendleton Administration was easily the weakest one in US history. When the 1866 elections loomed most Democrats wanted to distance themselves from the unpopular president. He accomplished virtually nothing during his entire presidency as congress basically ignored him . That doesn't mean things weren't accomplished but they were in spite of him not because of him. The Third Bank of the US was created as a permanent national bank over his veto in 1867.

The 13th amendment to the US constitution barring any state from having any "armed forces outside the control of the United States government including militia or state guard. Congress has the right to limit the type of weaponry that any state agency can acquire". The 14th amendment banned slavery and paid the slave owners $300 in US bonds at 3% interest over 10 years per slave.

The US borders were heavily fortified during this period. Some suspect that Pendleton was worried that if he didn't he would be impeached or overthrown in a military coup. As is he was spared by one vote from being removed from office by the US Senate with a number of senators explaining that they would not vote for his removal as they couldn't see an actual crime. A number of senator's diaries printed after their death stated they warned him if he didn't protect the US borders strongly they would have to vote to remove him for treason. ...

The Failed Presidency of President Pendleton Ace Books Chicago, Ill 1897
 
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