As we all know, the late 1930s to the early 1940s were defined by a series of wars which some have called the "Second Weltkrieg" and ended with a three way division of the world into the left-leaning but fairly democratic "Eurasian Alliance" of the Russian Empire, the Japanese Empire, the Republic of China, Korea, Indochina, Imperial/East Germany (the Russians created a puppet German Empire in the areas of Germany they controlled), Mongolia, and Poland as founding members with Austria joining in the 1960s and the US along with the Cairo Pact leaning towards the Eurasian Alliance, the Third International of France, Britain, Italy, Spain, Brazil, Centroamerica, Syndicalist/West Germany and Turkey (the Ottomans were overthrown in a syndicalist coup after being defeated by the Cairo Pact), and the right-wing Entente of Canada, Australasia, India (with left-wing and nationalist elements wanting to jump ship to the Eurasians), South Africa, and France-outre-mer. Today, as we mark the 70th anniversary of the day that many historians view as the end of the Second Weltkrieg, when the Qing Empire formally surrendered to the Russians, Japanese, and Republican Chinese, we ask if there was no Second Weltkrieg? What would a world without a "Second Weltkrieg" look like?
Kaiserreich DBWI: No Second Weltkrieg
- Thread starter Whiteshore
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Interesting...
Not entirely sure if we can avoid the Second Weltkrieg altogether - too much bad blood between the Germans and the old Entente powers. But assuming...
One difference would, of course, be Asia. The Second Weltkrieg permanently put the nail in the coffin of European colonialism in the Far East. After the Japanese took Indochina and German Singapore and Malaya, that much - and Japanese economic and political hegemony in the region - was guaranteed. Without the Japanese attack on German possessions, colonialism might have endured far longer.
Incidentally, don't forget Thailand, Burma, Sarawak and the Philippines
Japan got them on-side too. Even if America sometimes gets narky about how Japan occupied the Philippines and Hawaii during the Civil War, the Republic that Japan helped set up is an extremely democratic nation.
Not entirely sure if we can avoid the Second Weltkrieg altogether - too much bad blood between the Germans and the old Entente powers. But assuming...
One difference would, of course, be Asia. The Second Weltkrieg permanently put the nail in the coffin of European colonialism in the Far East. After the Japanese took Indochina and German Singapore and Malaya, that much - and Japanese economic and political hegemony in the region - was guaranteed. Without the Japanese attack on German possessions, colonialism might have endured far longer.
Incidentally, don't forget Thailand, Burma, Sarawak and the Philippines
Japan got them on-side too. Even if America sometimes gets narky about how Japan occupied the Philippines and Hawaii during the Civil War, the Republic that Japan helped set up is an extremely democratic nation.Considering that dozens of soldiers die each year in "skirmishes" between the German Empire (East Germany) and the Syndicalist Union of Germany (West Germany), how likely is it that the Third Weltkrieg is started by either German state? Also, what impact would no Second Weltkrieg have on Europe? Would the German Empire maintain dominance over Europe or would it gradually decline due to Russia and France funding anti-German rebels in Mittleeuropa?
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I'd say that no Russian Restoration, and thus no ascension of Vladimir the Great, would do it. If Germany has to fight a one front war with the Commune, they'll kick their ass, no question; heck, they even did launch an offensive that was fairly successful in the week before the Russkies and Japs declared war. Another way might be to avoid the rise of America First. Canada simply couldn't devote enough energy to reclaiming Britain when Long and his crazies were knocking on the door.
Yes, if the people who took over Russia after Kerensky's desth were pro-German conservatives instead of the SR-Kadet coalition who reluctantly restored the Tsar if only to provide a figure to unify Russia, the Second Weltkrieg could have been averted. And I could argue the Canadian intervention in America probably ensured the rise of the Syndicalist International as the Entente was busy propping up President Garner's government which eventually crushed Long in 1940. Also, what countries do you think are the main threats to world peace? Finally, which battle do you think "doomed Mittleeuropa"? Operation Suvorov, where a Russian army of 600,000 men crushed a German army thrice it's size using superior armor like the T-34 and better tactics?
Operation Suvurov isn't quite as impressive as it sounds, given that the majority of those German troops were Ukrainian and White Ruthenian troops who were mostly loyal to the Tsar (especially after the Prime Minister promised them autonomous provinces) but it certainly was big. I think, however, that in the East the Battle of Warsaw ensured that the Russian grand offensive would not collapse; in the West the massive tank battle at Strausborg gave the French the strategic edge, while in Asia the Japanese defense of Korea (granted autonomy under its own king and Parliament, but still economically tied to Japan) ensured that the Qing would be unable to focus their full energy on Tukhachevsky's tank brigades, ultimately giving the Russians the initiative.
OOC: Sorry, that didn't show up in my alerts for some reason...
IC: Well, an obvious one is the border between 'Gangetic India' and the Princely States. The North has always wanted to unite the subcontinent, and the regime there's propped up by the Royal Commonwealth, (OOC: Canada; Australasia; South Africa, the Caribbean) so they've always been pushy. But with Japan supporting the princes...it's a potential flashpoint for a Japan-Commonwealth War.
What about the crazy Totalists in the Syndicalist Union of Germany (West Germany), who constantly threathen East/Imperial Germany with war and are rumored to have nukes?
Well the Mélenchon government in Paris always restrains them, the only reason they exist is because they're backed by France. Other than that Chairman Baader is one crazy dude.
Yes, the fact that West Germany constantly threatens the East is probably the reason why the rump German Empire (OOC: North Germany in this map+Upper Silesia) is so loyal to the Russians and allows 400,000 Russian soldiers and 150,000 Japanese soldiers to be stationed in it's borders.
When do you think did the three-way "silent conflict" begin? When the Russians and Anglo-French alliance abandoned plans for a neutral German Republic and set out seperate regimes in their zones with the Russians establishing a puppet German Empire and the British and French creating the Syndicalist Union of Germany?
*ah-hem!* Pardon the Interruption (and Return to our boring Reality) but I have a Question for those of you who have Played Kaiserreich: do any of you Know if Kaiserreich can be Installed on the Steam Version of Darkest Hour: A Hearts of Iron Game Version 1.4 that I have and, if yes, where can I find Instructions for Installing?
chankljp
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https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/kaiserreich.529944/
You are going to need Darkest Hour 1.8 in order for the mod to work.
Ah, thank you for the Link. How would I get 1.8 Version and do you Know where I can Find Instructions for Installing/Downloading?