a truly Spanish Civil War
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GiantMonkeyMan
Banned
Quicker victory for the Nationalists. Without material support from the Soviets, the Republican war effort would have ran out of guns. People always make out that the Soviets were the main reason the war fell apart for the Left Front and that may have some credence if you look at Catelonia alone through Orwell-tinted glasses but in Madrid it was the arrival of the international brigades, often armed and supplied by the Soviets, that was all that was in between a fascist takeover. The Soviets had the Republicans' only tank brigade, their only bomber wings and thousands of artillery and small arms supplied throughout the war. While the Soviets were arming the Republicans, the British and French were actively preventing arms shipments.
Or, with Germany not being a threat due to it's civil war (and in OTL Germany's possible threat was a big factor in this), the French government may supply the republic with arms to defend itself - maybe even troops.
Depends on how much help the Italians give the Nationalists. If for some reason they don't, it becomes more of an eventually more even-handed slugging match between the Loyalists and Republicans. The initial Nationalist inroads of the early Civil War would still happen OTL as this was before any significant material aid was coming from outside the country. Although the Germans had some role in the transporting of Franco's army from Morocco, so maybe that army either finds other means or is slower to deploy in Spain.
Yes, but the inital batch of troops from Morocco came over in German Ju-52's as the Nationalists were (un-necessarily as it turned out) worried about the Republic's navy intercepting troop ships.
Actually, the Republicans may pull a win here, or at least a stalemate. People often forget that in the initial months of the Spanish Civil War, Anarchists were able to hold off the Nationalist advance with nothing but small arms they forcefully got from the state.
So here? The Nationalists won't have foreign support, unless Italy is still in. If Italy is still in... issues will arise.
So here? The Nationalists won't have foreign support, unless Italy is still in. If Italy is still in... issues will arise.
Stalemate yes. Victory, not necessarily so. The Anarchist militas were fine at defending their homes and factories, but lacked any of the disciplines to properly attack. Their assaults on Army barracks etc were very heavy in casualties as they substituted bravery for tactical sense.
EDIT: And if the Italian's are tied up in Germany, then I'd wager that the French would certainly be willing to help out the Republicans. Which makes it pretty much certain that they'll triumph fairly quickly.
EDIT: And if the Italian's are tied up in Germany, then I'd wager that the French would certainly be willing to help out the Republicans. Which makes it pretty much certain that they'll triumph fairly quickly.
And Soviet help or no Soviet help, there still are socialist and communist militias. The latter will still not get along with the CNT/FAI militias and vice versa.
Dominance? No. But survival. & influence. If the Republicans can only win.
Communist (Stalinist), Communist (Trotskyite), Socialist, Anarchist and regional (Catalan, Basque, etc).
But they really only started falling out and pointing fingers/guns at each other once the war turned against them.
But they really only started falling out and pointing fingers/guns at each other once the war turned against them.
Well, the first question must be: how is the situation in Spain and how does the civil war starts in this TL. For starters, no Nazi ruled Germany means no Popular Front. This causes industrial size butterflies in a number of countries... Will the republicans even win the '36 election ? The electorial system (sorta like the current Greek system) heavily favored the largest coalition. If the communists are still playing deaf, dumb and blind, waiting for the revolution, that may just push the bonus to the other team... Now I have no doubt that something nasty is in store for Spain in this TL, both sides were far too apt to see politics as a Zero sum game, and generally very good at pissing the other side off just for the heck of it.
If you deny ALL foreign intervention, Britain doesn't provide the Nationalists with telegraph facilities via Gibraltar.
Which means Franco has less chance of getting to Spain from Morocco. His troops absent mean a longer, more incoherent conflict.
Of course no foreign intervention is ASB, realistically without Germany and Russia, its Italy vs Mexico in terms of support. Most likely OTL result but the International Brigades aren't totally written off without Stalin.
Which means Franco has less chance of getting to Spain from Morocco. His troops absent mean a longer, more incoherent conflict.
Of course no foreign intervention is ASB, realistically without Germany and Russia, its Italy vs Mexico in terms of support. Most likely OTL result but the International Brigades aren't totally written off without Stalin.
So, that beg the question.. anti-communist freaks in Uk or USA, helping Franco by gibraltar?
This actually may be the case... however this has little to do with ideology, and much more to do with lacking experience in previous conflicts, along with a completely new military structure.
Additionally, the Nationalist faction really wasn't any better at first.
Tsao
Banned
It probably helped that the Nationalists had actual generals who had experience in combat.
Had Spain been in a conflict before this particular one for this generals to gain experience in? Specifically, one reflecting World War 1 style warfare?
Because really, the first phases of the Spanish Civil War were basically WW1 style with trenches and stuff, because of how bad the weapons technology on both sides was actually. If they don't have experience in that, they could be a liability if they're too clinging to old style doctrines, however this didn't appear to be the case, however not a particular advantage either.