A brave new world: the dinosaurs not quite wiped out.....

Jason222

Banned
Archon of Thessaly said:
The cold isnt really the problem. The fact that the southern hemisphre where they are mostly distributed IS a problem as its major food sources die off. And these pack animals cannot sustain themselves up north and south on just seasheels and small animals. They would die out. So when we look at the ice age, we see the same problem: it wasnt the cold that killed them, but the lack of food and ironicly enough, the oversuccess of certain hominids.
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It have be place tough first place surival but tough Dinosaurs area enough to able to survival were ever hit them. Island require them to have hibernation making near by volcano another island left made so must planets would died out combine acid rain might create tough group dinosaurs to survival.
 

Archon of Thessaly

Jason222 said:
It have be place tough first place surival but tough Dinosaurs area enough to able to survival were ever hit them. Island require them to have hibernation making near by volcano another island left made so must planets would died out combine acid rain might create tough group dinosaurs to survival.
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Thats partly why this small colony of troodon are still surviving in alaska. The remotness of this location both stoppes more carnivores moving in, and also breeds the perfect conditions for an intelligent therapod to develop in an already challlenging area. The natural harshness of the area may well have slready created more rugged troodon, so here they can fight of the after effects of as catastrophic global tempreture change and the ash and space derbis better.

So i've created a ( kind-of) butterfly net. And so the background POD can now develop.
 

Archon of Thessaly

zoomar said:
Then it seems I misread or mis-interpreted some of the comments. Somehow I got the idea that, in your TL, there are both intelligent bird-like dinosaurs AND human-like hominids. This is something that seems virtually impossible.

What I do accept as reasonable and plausible is the possibility that something roughly equivalent to human intelligence could have evolved over time among social of bipedal theropods endowed with grasping forelimbs capable of manipulating their environment.
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As will happen in this TL. Obviously these troodon decendents have somway to go yet, but given time and the certain enviromental conditions, we could well see some description of intelligent therapod developing.
 

phx1138

Archon of Thessaly said:
A world were the not all the dinosaurs died out
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I hate to break it to you, but, they didn't OTL, either.:rolleyes: Contrary to common belief. (That's not even counting birds, which evolved from dinos.:rolleyes:)

Which has sparked some debate over what really killed them off...

Even so, an intriguing start.;)
Archon of Thessaly said:
the fact that they care for there young forces them to settle in one area and not migrate
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It really doesn't. How mobile are the young right after birth? How developed? If they're like giraffes or horses, or even monkeys, it's possible to be on the move in a matter of hours, or at most days. Born from eggs, who says they can't be brooded to a size able to move on just as fast? Like a rookery, to which the parents return seasonally or annually?
 
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Archon of Thessaly

phx1138 said:
I hate to break it to you, but, they didn't OTL, either.:rolleyes: Contrary to common belief. (That's not even counting birds, which evolved from dinos.:rolleyes:)

Which has sparked some debate over what really killed them off...

Even so, an intriguing start.;)

It really doesn't. How mobile are the young right after birth? How developed? If they're like giraffes or horses, or even monkeys, it's possible to be on the move in a matter of hours, or at most days. Born from eggs, who says they can't be brooded to a size able to move on just as fast? Like a rookery, to which the parents return seasonally or annually?
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For your first quote, yes, you are indeed correct. Another article in this thread is from a magazine that claims their is evidence that certain Maiasaura survived well into the early Paleogene before eventually lack of food, and the decrease in population numbers eventually forced them into extinction. And obviously birds are dinosaurs-and very successful ones at that.

However, this TL is about where troodon decedents survive into the Eocene and beyond, splitting off into different lines and dominating the planet.
Obviously, "dinosaurs not quite wiped" is more catchy then" all dinosaurs except birds, troodon and those little Maiasaura but they die out in the early Paleogene.":)

Now, about your second point, the significance of staying in one place is that young Agilodon spend more time learning about their surroundings, while clans develop into more closely nit social groups. Obviously their is still a large amount of nomadic movement, but because the climate is more stable in this period, these clans will be more settled and thus in a position to multiply and develop ( this is why settled communities are larger and tend to be more developed then nomadic groups: nomads can only carry one baby at a time and are too busy surviving to have time to set up roots and think about art or building.)

Later on of course, as the climate collapses, these theropods will become more migratory, thus leading to the line breaking off as different agiliodon adapt and evolve to different environments.

Still, glad to find it interesting!
 

phx1138

Archon of Thessaly said:
suppose that the basis of religion is fire or the respect for the dead?
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It might also be an evolutionary advantage. Damon Knight suggests belief in things we can't see, like tigers in the bushes, means those who believe it when they're told survive, while those who don't get eaten: & so we get religions.:eek:
 

phx1138

Archon of Thessaly said:
Yet..... by holding the heart, it symbolises something else. it symbolises what we might call a ceremony, a ritual. By consuming the heart, the Agilodon female beleaves she is absorbing the soul of the Propalaeotherium
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You are joking. The very presumption this creature even has the concept of "soul", let alone "absorbing it", never mind knowing it's the heart, is so preposterous as to defy description.:eek::eek::rolleyes:

I was going to read the rest of this.

Not anymore.
 

Danth

phx1138 said:
You are joking. The very presumption this creature even has the concept of "soul", let alone "absorbing it", never mind knowing it's the heart, is so preposterous as to defy description.:eek::eek::rolleyes:

I was going to read the rest of this.

Not anymore.
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No it ain't

Wolves do something similar-ish

Besides theses creatures are very intelligent

Maybe souks was the wrong word but hey who cares
 

Archon of Thessaly

phx1138 said:
It might also be an evolutionary advantage. Damon Knight suggests belief in things we can't see, like tigers in the bushes, means those who believe it when they're told survive, while those who don't get eaten: & so we get religions.:eek:
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An interesting idea! Hmm....i could see that making very good sense. However, i'm also of the opinion that the idea of religion is drawn from what we see around us.

The idea of spirits may have resulted from the ( accidental) consumption of early hallucination. The idea of ancestor worship is already a concept that exists in the animal world, with elephants and birds doing the same thing. This was drawn from increasing reliance and the closeness of relationships between pack members; they no doubt began to feel emotions like grief and be determined that such a valued pack mate should receive some respect. The fact that many things in nature ( such as how fires start) are explainable, would drive animals to develop notions of what caused them that exist beyond their peripheral world. In short, being in a pack and having a desire ( and ability) to make connections between phenomena in nature is what fueled early beliefs.

Of course, i may well be wrong, but no theory can ever be truly correct. If anybody else wishes to say i'm nuts or propose their own theory.......be my guest!
 

othyrsyde

Is this the future of this TL?

0107_grdsuperfriends5.jpg
 

Archon of Thessaly

phx1138 said:
You are joking. The very presumption this creature even has the concept of "soul", let alone "absorbing it", never mind knowing it's the heart, is so preposterous as to defy description.:eek::eek::rolleyes:

I was going to read the rest of this.

Not anymore.
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Hmm....maybe using the word "soul" was partly misleading-for which i apologies. However, with retrospect, their really is no other way to describe what i'm trying to convey. Agilodon can think beyond their peripheral world. They're beginning to think "outside the box so to speak". This is due to their advanced ability to make connections between to two things in nature-something only really advanced animals like later hominids are able to do. They can recognize individual footprints when herd animals would just see one type of footprint. Agilodon can make a (basic) connection between the heart and life. It's not religion or ritual by any sense of the human imagination but rather agilodons way of enhancing its own life ( a natural assumption to make really-a bit like eating sheep's brains make us more intelligent.)

Of course, given time(lots and lots of time,) this basic idea, this connection made in this theropods brain, could be the basis of a more enhanced set of rules, rituals and even the basis of "faith" Just not yet. even an agilodon would be able to understand that.
yet.
 

Archon of Thessaly

I'm afraid dear readers i have good and bad news.
Good news: this is thread is not dead and will be continued in the near future.

Bad news: Its on a hiatus due to me being too busy at home at the moment and because i'm currently researching and preparing a new TL.........that will be unveiled soon.

Sorry about this-but fear not! It will return!
 
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