How would you punish the rebel leadership after the American Civil War

[Derek Jackson]

I think that had changes happened in the Spring and summer of 1865 much could have been achieved. Land could have been redistributed. Radical Conventions could have been elected by all "Loyal men" mostly former slaves. The US Constitution might guarantee political rights for former slaves and their descendants in former rebel areas. Juries would include former slaves and any person would be allowed to require anyone who had supported the rebellion NOT to be a Judge or Jurror.

I think a decision to allow former rebels not to be prosecuted might well be successfully proposed as a mercy.

 

[Don Corleone]

Yes they were. The CSA was NEVER legally a seperate thing. This was literally Lincoln’s entire policy.

Anyhoo, mass land confiscations and distributions. And trials for upper level officers and officials who could be proven to have engaged in the worst behavior. Hang Forrest for Fort Pillow. Hang Lee for his army’s depredations in the. Roth. Hang Davis for his orders to enslave American citizens. And etc.

Might be an own goal. In OTL Davis was reviled in the South - the defeat was blamed on his incompetence.

The inhumane treatment of Davis at Fort Monroe turned him into a sympathetic figure - the head of the John Brown Society contributed to his bail.

Best move would be to say you're going to hang them if you catch them, then say "awwww, that's a shame" when they flee the country. Then you have no opposition when it comes to controlling the narrative. Portray the Confederate leaders as the idiots who led the South on a fool's errand, then ran away like cowards and left the ordinary folks to suffer the aftermath.

 

[Azureora]

Whatever you do, your going to have the lost cause myth. Just look at otl and how lenient the Union treated them (along with the domestic terrorism they started KKK), and so with benefit of hindsight I would favor the following:

1. Hang the President of the CSA and have everyone else swear an oath to the Union decrying the CSA as an illegitimate attempt at secession.

2. Commit to reconstruction and strip land from slave holders as payment to their former slaves.

3. Ensure a clean withdrawal of Federal troops AFTER a fair and equitable elections, so that the white planter class doesn’t just terrorize their way into the halls of power again.

 

[9 Fanged Hummingbird]

See the following from wiki

Hmm, seems the issue was based more on whether due process was followed than whether expropriation was justified or not. Regardless, I'm not going to be swayed on my opinion regarded how certain prominent rebs deserved to lose everything just because a Supreme Court decision, they've been wrong before and since and as far as I'm concerned they deserve some of the blame for the crisis leading up to the war.

I noticed a trend with some historians that seem to conflate the more caustic shall we say wartime messaging of the time with actual wartime views. I find the opinion pages in newspapers are a better record of opinions as the ordinary people tended to fluff off the presentation of each other as devils as propaganda.

Yes, Lee liked to portray himself as a kindly gentleman. Despite the fact that he was a bloody tyrant towards his own slaves and allowed his army to enslave free people in the North during the war. And opinion pages in newspapers aren't as indicative as actual wartime actions. Besides which you can find plenty of bloodthirsty rhetoric from even civilians during the war, people just like to preserve and cherry pick the more gentle quotations because there's been a popular romanticized image built up surrounding the war by people who also have the habit of ignoring the war's underlying cause.

 

[Pergington]

The complete and utter destruction of the prewar elite and political leaders of the area. This is going to ignore any long term problems that may come out from this.

By decree, all military and political leaders of significance are to be trialed by a court not made of any Southerners. If sufficient evidence is found of their innocence, they will be subject to a massive fine and given a small property to live. If not, they will be hung.

All landowning elites with property over 40 acres are to have their lands seized by the Federal government, have all their slaves be declared freedman, and they will be subject to trial under a court made up of freedmen.

All freedmen shall receive 10 acres of land along with sufficient equipment and be given the same rights afforded to white men with the same liberties.

The Traitor states will pay 75 million dollars to the Federal government as war reparations and will be under occupation by the Federal army until this sum is payed. The occupation force will also be paid by the Traitor states during this time until the reparations have been made.

The Federal Government will be given every fort or military installation in the Traitor states. No Traitor state is allowed to bear arms or form militias without express approval from Washington herself.

All statues or memorials of any Traitor from the Traitor states will be torn down and smashed. Not a single effigy or art is to remain that attempted to rewrite the Civil War as one of Northern Aggresion or as one of State rights.

A war guilt clause stating that it is the Traitor states who triggered the war and therefore will bear the burden of the Reconstruction of America along with an acknowledgment that they were in the wrong.

The Traitor states will not be allowed to have their own elections for offices on the state level until 40 years have passed and all candidates will be reviews by a committee to test their moral fiber and their worthiness as an American citizen. These positions will be filled by Federal appointment and cannot be removed unless ordered from Washington.

All enlisted men will be allowed to return to their farms and will be given one year of tax free and three years of half Tax.

Finally, History will be written and not be subject to change here. The Traitor states declared war on the northern states over matters of Slavery and their unwillingness to right a crime that man should not allow. They fought under the banner of moral evil and showed no hesitation in denying fellow Americans the rights they should have. Let no man ever deny this as a fact and if so, will be subject to jail or under more extreme circumstance, be hung or killed in the name of justice,


Definitely unrealistic but I would like to hear how y’all think of this.

 

[James Ricker]

Hang Jefferson Davis and the Unapologetic fire eaters
Imprison the rest for 20-30 years
Hanging Jefferson Davis would not upset too many people in the south they'd probably supply the rope

 

[James Ricker]

Hmm, seems the issue was based more on whether due process was followed than whether expropriation was justified or not. Regardless, I'm not going to be swayed on my opinion regarded how certain prominent rebs deserved to lose everything just because a Supreme Court decision, they've been wrong before and since and as far as I'm concerned they deserve some of the blame for the crisis leading up to the war.

Yes, Lee liked to portray himself as a kindly gentleman. Despite the fact that he was a bloody tyrant towards his own slaves and allowed his army to enslave free people in the North during the war. And opinion pages in newspapers aren't as indicative as actual wartime actions. Besides which you can find plenty of bloodthirsty rhetoric from even civilians during the war, people just like to preserve and cherry pick the more gentle quotations because there's been a popular romanticized image built up surrounding the war by people who also have the habit of ignoring the war's underlying cause.

Lee was also brutal to his own soldiers later in the war to prevent desertion
If they put him in front of a firing squad you would have no problem finding volunteers among the former members of the army of Virginia

 

[Aghasverov]

Hang Jefferson Davis and the Unapologetic fire eaters
Imprison the rest for 20-30 years
Hanging Jefferson Davis would not upset too many people in the south they'd probably supply the rope

I don't know if I'd hang Davis... would rather see him pickin' cotton alongside N B Forrest but the Lost Cause Myth did make everyone forget just how thoroughly detested he was across much of the South...

 

[Admiral Spaun]

The Traitor states will pay 75 million dollars to the Federal government as war reparations and will be under occupation by the Federal army until this sum is payed. The occupation force will also be paid by the Traitor states during this time until the reparations have been made.

The Federal Government will be given every fort or military installation in the Traitor states. No Traitor state is allowed to bear arms or form militias without express approval from Washington herself.

Seems like a way to disempower Southerners without addressing any systemic issues. Under this system the southern poor (Blacks and Whites) would be forced to pay a massive financial and political price for decisions they had no control over. These kinds of policies would just breed a new kind of Southern resentment, the kind that would transcend traditional social barriers.

 

[Admiral Spaun]

The Traitor states will not be allowed to have their own elections for offices on the state level until 40 years have passed and all candidates will be reviews by a committee to test their moral fiber and their worthiness as an American citizen. These positions will be filled by Federal appointment and cannot be removed unless ordered from Washington

This is just tyrannical. Such a law would kneecap the political power of freedmen for half a century at least, not to mention anyone else south of the Mason Dixon line.

 

[Pergington]

Seems like a way to disempower Southerners without addressing any systemic issues. Under this system the southern poor (Blacks and Whites) would be forced to pay a massive financial and political price for decisions they had no control over. These kinds of policies would just breed a new kind of Southern resentment, the kind that would transcend traditional social barriers.

Then what would be a better option to get the South to pay reparations? I’m sort of ignoring long term consequences but I would like to see them pay for all the damage they caused.

This is just tyrannical. Such a law would kneecap the political power of freedmen for half a century at least, not to mention anyone else south of the Mason Dixon line.

Fair, I would probably remove that and instead have a sort of temp committee made up of freedmen, Northerners and any remaining Southern political leader.

 

[Admiral Spaun]

Then what would be a better option to get the South to pay reparations? I’m sort of ignoring long term consequences but I would like to see them pay for all the damage they caused.

At the end of the day its two regions of the same country, the federal government is just going to have to suck it up and start rebuilding without any. Remember, the South was the region in most need of help at the end of the war.

 

[NedStark]

The Federal Government will be given every fort or military installation in the Traitor states. No Traitor state is allowed to bear arms or form militias without express approval from Washington herself.

The Traitor states will not be allowed to have their own elections for offices on the state level until 40 years have passed and all candidates will be reviews by a committee to test their moral fiber and their worthiness as an American citizen. These positions will be filled by Federal appointment and cannot be removed unless ordered from Washington

This is Rule of the Major Generals 2.0

If you can even get to do so, you'd better off using your political capital to carve up Southern states into black-majority ones.

 

[Roland Traveler]

Haven't disagreed with that. Only pointing out that the CSA while industrially inferior to the Union was very much an industrial power head and shoulders above 90 percent of the rest of the world.

Ranking doesn’t matter, raw output does.

Let’s say you have 100 people who are going to run a mile/kilometer. The top three run it in between 5 and 12 minutes. The next three run it between 12 and 20 minutes. The seventh (pst, this is the CSA) runs it in over an hour. Everyone after that takes even longer. Would you really say that the person in seventh place is in any way comparable to the top six just because of their ranking? It’s clear they’re totally outclassed and are only placing that high because everyone else is worse. That’s called damning with faint praise, and it’s not a good thing.

 

[The Ranger]

No hangings except those who ran the most dreadful concentration camps, (one, Wirz, was hung in OTL) but making people like Forrest pick cotton for five years with blacks guarding them and making them work would be a good punishment. I'd give the blacks enough land to live well on as compensation for being enslaved, without being so harsh that it started another large scale rebellion.

 

[Mikestone8]

Hmm, seems the issue was based more on whether due process was followed than whether expropriation was justified or not. Regardless, I'm not going to be swayed on my opinion regarded how certain prominent rebs deserved to lose everything just because a Supreme Court decision, they've been wrong before and since and as far as I'm concerned they deserve some of the blame for the crisis leading up to the war.

Please make your mind up. Is your Constitution the supreme law of the land or isn't it?

You can't have it both ways. If it's ok for you to disregard the clauses which ban permanent forfeiture when you happen to find them inconvenient, then how were the Confederates wrong to similarly disregard the Supremacy Clause, or any other part of he Consstution which could be construed to forbid secession?

The SCOTUS may indeed have erred on other matters, but it was entirely correct as regards Arlington, since the Federal Government, through imposing a tax and then setting conditions clearly designed to make it impossible for the tax to be paid, had in effect sought to secure a permanent confiscation by the back door, a bare-faced atempt to evade the Constitutional prohibition on this. The Justices quite rightly slapped them down.

 

[mspence]

Make Reconstruction funding and readmission into the Union conditional on former Confederate politicians publicly renouncing the Confederacy. Strip officers of their ranks and make them start over if they wanted to rejoin the Army. A public trial for Jefferson Davis, followed by imprisonment for treason and sedition. Support the Freedmen's Bureau as a Federal agency & give them authority over former slaveowners and their property in the form of reparations and trials for former owners.

 

[PrinceofApathy]

Expropriate every single penny and every single blade of grass from slaveowners, and redistribute them among the slaves. Not just 40 acres and a mule, but 40 acres, a mule, some farm equipment, and a few hundred dollars too. No re-admission to the Union until the black population is on equal grounds with the white population in every respect. Snuff out any Lost Cause notions before they start. Permanently disenfranchise any CSA officer or civillian slaveowner, and bar all Confederate veterans from bearing arms. Life in prison for all rebel leaders.

 

[Strategos' Risk]

Probably do something to turn the former rank and file against their aristocratic leaders. Massive wealth transfer not only to the freemen but also to Union loyalists, then Confederate citizens below a certain class. Make them swear oaths to the Union before distributing the money to them.

 

[Enigmajones]

I don't want to seem to radical, but I would have executed the leadership in both politics and military, and ban the surviving Confederate soldiers from voting.