WI: Model T was electric?

phx1138 · Jul 26, 2013

Inspired by this thread.

This suggests Edison & Ford collaborated in the 1898-1900 period. Suppose this had continued until after the creation of FoMoCo?

Could Ford have built the first mass-produced electric car? Could this have led to a divergence in cars, between cheap electric city cars & more expensive IC "cross-country" cars?

JimTheB · Jul 26, 2013

The result would be just another barely remembered electric car, manufactured in the tens or hundreds, tops.

phx1138 · Jul 26, 2013

JimTheB said:
The result would be just another barely remembered electric car, manufactured in the tens or hundreds, tops.

Why, pray tell, would Ford's insistence on standardization & cost-cutting, coupled with a more driver-friendly power source, plus a more woman-friendly one (thus broadening the market over even the OTL Model T), lead to sales only in hundreds? Exactly?

JimTheB · Jul 26, 2013

Short range, heavy build (all those batteries). The internal combustion engine has a lot going for it.

The Kiat · Jul 26, 2013

JimTheB said:
Short range, heavy build (all those batteries). The internal combustion engine has a lot going for it.

Kind of my thought. WI? Well, you get a vehicle with a much shorter range.

phx1138 · Jul 26, 2013

The Kiat said:
Kind of my thought. WI? Well, you get a vehicle with a much shorter range.

You get, as already suggested, a possible split: cheap city cars & more expensive road/touring cars.

That doesn't answer why only a few would be made. Don't forget, before IC cars became the norm, electrics outnumbered them pretty substantially. Add Ford's production standards...

deathscompanion1 · Jul 26, 2013

phx1138 said:
You get, as already suggested, a possible split: cheap city cars & more expensive road/touring cars.

That doesn't answer why only a few would be made. Don't forget, before IC cars became the norm, electrics outnumbered them pretty substantially. Add Ford's production standards...

Someone else figures out that IC is better and it still becomes the norm except Ford does worse.

EWHM · Jul 26, 2013

It is really really hard to compete with the energy density of a gallon of gas at what---6 pounds to the gallon or thereabouts?

Bahamut-255 · Jul 26, 2013

EWHM said:
It is really really hard to compete with the energy density of a gallon of gas at what---6 pounds to the gallon or thereabouts?

But it's very easy to compete with just how painfully difficult the petrol-powered IC engined car was to operate at the time. The OTL Model-T was particularly difficult at low speeds IIRC due to it's control layout.

But the most likely scenario I see is that the Electric Car would remain dominant only until such time as the Austen 7 or a similar type of IC car is produced - although it's control layout was taken from the Cadillac Type 53.

MattII · Jul 26, 2013

This has two possible outcomes, either the Model T either A) doesn't sell well or B) does sell well:
A) Little effect, except that Ford doesn't get quite the same market share as OTL.
B) Electric cars remain accepted as inner-city transport even when ICE ones take over inter-city travel. With money in electric cars, money is invested in electrical technology, leading not only to better (but still trailing ICE) electric cars, but better electrical equipment in general.

phx1138 · Jul 27, 2013

MattII said:
This has two possible outcomes, either the Model T either A) doesn't sell well or B) does sell well:
A) Little effect, except that Ford doesn't get quite the same market share as OTL.
B) Electric cars remain accepted as inner-city transport even when ICE ones take over inter-city travel. With money in electric cars, money is invested in electrical technology, leading not only to better (but still trailing ICE) electric cars, but better electrical equipment in general.

That's the key question, isn't it?

Knowing Ford, I expect a successful Electric T. Not one dominant like OTL, but surviving, & stimulating others, as well as better battery and charging tech.

If electrics get, & stay, popular, what does that do to acid rain, as the power demand to keep them running rises?

And to the amount of toxic waste, as batteries wear out?

MattII · Jul 27, 2013

More acid rain, but less lead in the atmosphere. As for waste batteries, maybe they'll eventually start a program to try to recycle them. That (or something like it) might actually be an interesting TL, ford developing an electric car, and perhaps later a hybrid.

Johnrankins · Jul 27, 2013

Ford goes bankrupt. The problem is even today EC have very short ranges as compared to IC cars. The US is huge and lightly populated compared with almost all industrial countries. Sooner or later someone is going to come out with a cheap IC car and the EC car goes under.

Simreeve · Jul 27, 2013

phx1138 said:
You get, as already suggested, a possible split: cheap city cars & more expensive road/touring cars.

But then those "cheap city cars" would have to compete with the streetcar networks...

phx1138 · Jul 27, 2013

Simreeve said:
But then those "cheap city cars" would have to compete with the streetcar networks...

They did anyway, gas & electric.

Trolleys lost.

Johnrankins said:
The US is huge and lightly populated

What part of "city car" do you not understand?

Since you obviously don't know, electrics make a lot of sense for strictly in-city fleet use, where there's a central charging station, since it's possible to go most of a day on a single charge.

They're less credible for private use, but even then, seeing most people don't drive far on a single trip, or over the course of a day, they aren't as impractical as most people think.

And I say that as somebody who dislikes electrics.

Simreeve · Jul 27, 2013

phx1138 said:
They did anyway, gas & electric.

Trolleys lost.

Eventually. Partly because 'gas' cars, unlike the electric ones which they had largely displaced from the market already by then, were versatile enough to be used conveniently over longer distances too and were therefore more worthwhile as purchases than electric ones.[/QUOTE]

Whanztastic · Jul 27, 2013

Johnrankins said:
Ford goes bankrupt. The problem is even today EC have very short ranges as compared to IC cars. The US is huge and lightly populated compared with almost all industrial countries. Sooner or later someone is going to come out with a cheap IC car and the EC car goes under.

Bingo. Not much else to it.

Starkad · Jul 27, 2013

Would they be much cheaper than i/c cars anyhow ?
Yes, the engine will be cheaper, but you need a sh*tload of 1900's batteries to get any kind of range.

Also, this is long before electricity is standardized.
With Edison involved the charger will of course be DC only

That might be a problem in other (non NY) cities...

The Admiral Hook · Jul 27, 2013

I know nothing about cars from the era (and less about modern day cars) but what about a hybrid?

Could a hybrid Model T have been viable or even possible?

Johnrankins · Jul 27, 2013

phx1138 said:
What part of "city car" do you not understand?

The part where they are viable against cars that CAN go outside the city. People will want cars with more range and where it doesn't take hours to recharge. Eventually someone will copy Ford's assembly process for IC cars. Once that happens Ford goes under.