Cuban Missle Crisis Leads To Nuclear War

shane

What if John Kennedy was as hot headed as the Generals around him and decided to launch airstrikes on Cuba in October of 1962, followed by an all out invasion of the Island which was repulsed by the use of tatcial nuclear weapons on the beaches?

What next? Would the Soviets launch an attack on Western Europe and be met by America responding with tatical nuclear weapons of it's own ?

Would Kennedy launch nuclear weapons at Cuba?

Would the Soviets have looked the other way?

Would the Soviets have launched what they had at the United States ?

Would both sides have launched all their nuclear weapons at each other?

Would Kennedy simply bring what was left of the invasion taste force home and seek a truce ?
 

Odin

Interestingly theres a cuban missile crisis pc game coming out soon. or should I say alternate cuban missile crisis game, ie in which the missiles were launched.
 

hexicus

IIRC there was a belief in the White House at the time that Krushchev had lost full control over the more aggressive generals in Moscow. If Kennedy nukes Cuba (hence killing Soviet military advisors) then I would guess that the hawks would take over pretty quickly in the Red Army. This would lead to the invasion of Berlin almost certainly as a first response - from there NATO would likely be forced to respond with nukes or give up Berlin.

At which point there would be alot of people suggesting that they give up Berlin. The European NATO allies would likely think that Kennedy had over reacted and wouldn't be keen on playing along with the stakes so high.
 

Suit_N_Tie

Odin said:
Interestingly theres a cuban missile crisis pc game coming out soon. or should I say alternate cuban missile crisis game, ie in which the missiles were launched.
Click to expand...


Do you have the link for the game? And when exactly does it come out?
 

DMA

Actually it need not need a hot headed Kennedy or Krushchev to start the shooting - that could have started all by itself thanks to the naval blockade. At one point, when USN ships were in their positions to stop Soviet ships, the Soviet ships in question could have simply ignored the USN ships forcing them to open fire, albeit across their bows & all that. However, Soviet subs were being organised to escort the merchant vessels should anything happen. Thus, all a Soviet sub has to do is think that the sub, &/or the ship they are escorting is under attack, and fire a torpedo at the USN ship.

Now that the firing has started in the Gulf, with shells, depth charges, & torpedos going off, it's going to be hard to ensure that it doesn't esculate into WWIII. It will certainly make it impossible for a peaceful negotiation to take place akin to the OTL. Furthermore, if there has been such a naval engagement in the Gulf, even a brief one, you can bet your bottom dollar that Castro &/or the Russian commander on Cuba will have their finger on the button ready to launch their IRBMs.

As a result, it only takes one U2 to be mistaken as the prelude to an air strike or, more importantly, a low level flash & dash mission, and several IRBMs are heading towards the USA. Nuclear holocaust takes place about 60 minutes later.
 

Wendell

DMA said:
Actually it need not need a hot headed Kennedy or Krushchev to start the shooting - that could have started all by itself thanks to the naval blockade. At one point, when USN ships were in their positions to stop Soviet ships, the Soviet ships in question could have simply ignored the USN ships forcing them to open fire, albeit across their bows & all that. However, Soviet subs were being organised to escort the merchant vessels should anything happen. Thus, all a Soviet sub has to do is think that the sub, &/or the ship they are escorting is under attack, and fire a torpedo at the USN ship.

Now that the firing has started in the Gulf, with shells, depth charges, & torpedos going off, it's going to be hard to ensure that it doesn't esculate into WWIII. It will certainly make it impossible for a peaceful negotiation to take place akin to the OTL. Furthermore, if there has been such a naval engagement in the Gulf, even a brief one, you can bet your bottom dollar that Castro &/or the Russian commander on Cuba will have their finger on the button ready to launch their IRBMs.

As a result, it only takes one U2 to be mistaken as the prelude to an air strike or, more importantly, a low level flash & dash mission, and several IRBMs are heading towards the USA. Nuclear holocaust takes place about 60 minutes later.
Click to expand...
Assuming the Russians don't miss their targets;)
 

DMA

Wendell said:
Assuming the Russians don't miss their targets;)
Click to expand...


I doubt it as the Soviets, in the 1950s & 60s, basically aimed their missiles at major cities, major bases, etc. Plus they were usually armed with thermonuclear warheads in the megatons. So even if their aim was off, by say 2km, it really wouldn't matter, because one flash and you're still ash!
 

Aldroud

Banned
I have a book at home, the name of which eludes me, that is basically an anthology of ATLs written by a few historians. The Cuban Missile Crisis was an interesting one.

Soviet commanders had recieved release orders from Moscow, something we didn't know at the time. A Soviet submarine could employ a nuclear torpedo without requesting authorization and the Soviet commander in Cuba could have launched his IRBMs the same way.

The POD for this ATL was that a Soviet submarine DID launch it's nuclear torpedo when it was pinged by an American destroyer. (In OTL, the commander held his fire, although he had prepared the torpedo for launch.)

The resultant nuclear detonation over the horizon led to immediate air strikes by the USAF in an attempt to knock out the missiles in Cuba before they could be launched, an effort that failed. Four missiles flew, one that detonated over Washington DC, one that missed and landed in farmlands in western New York, one in (IIRC) Atlanta, and one dud. With Kennedy and most of the government destroyed, command fell upon the commander of NORAD who ordered a total nuclear retaliation. The Speaker of the House was located later that day, who confirmed the actions of generals.

American response was a total launch of IRMBs out of Italy, Turkey, and Great Britain, followed by ICBMs out of the US and bomber fleets winging towards the Soviet Union. At this point, the Soviet leaders did not even know about the launching of nuclear weapons by their forces in Cuba (Soviet communications systems were poor at the outset, a loss of contact for periods of time was nothing out of the ordinary).

Major Soviet cities, military bases, and other assets were immediately destroyed by missiles. Eastern European countries saw their capitols go up in smoke, along with any Soviet military bases within their countries, but otherwise were untouched. Bombers patrolled over the Soviet airspace, looking for targets worthy of nuclear bombardment. This lasted for three days before the majority of American strategic assets had been exhausted and the pleas of European and Asian allies to cease firing were heard.

The following year, exploration teams from Europe entered into what was formerly the Soviet Union, finding less than 10% of the population still alive, the rest dead to either direct nuclear affects, radiation poisening, starvation, or societal collapse. The nuclear attack on the Soviet Union became known as the Second Holocaust.

The United States is ejected from the United Nations and demands for reparassions from the affected nations (Europeans mostly, suffering fallout) fall on deaf ears, as the United States felt it was the aggreeved party.

Was a very interesting ATL, scary in some ways, but I'm gratified to know that we could expect the US to have survived a nuclear exchange in 1962.
 

Darkest

Banned
That game looks flippin' awesome, man. Totally buying that (though the fighter jet and bomber animations look a little weird, especially when exploding).

So... cool.

BTW, it sounds to me that you think the USA would have just wooped up on the Soviet Union. Could the USSR have fought back at all? Done any damage other than their first bomb?

And, a third question, how could we have evened the odds between the US and the USSR in this World War III?
 

hexicus

Wasn't the US stronger in nukes and the USSR stronger in conventional forces in Europe at the time? This is when McNamara was still revamping the DOD. I think that if war in Europe had broken out NATO would have used nukes (maybe only tactical ones) or been overrun - at least in the short term.
 

Wendell

Aldroud said:
I have a book at home, the name of which eludes me, that is basically an anthology of ATLs written by a few historians. The Cuban Missile Crisis was an interesting one.

Soviet commanders had recieved release orders from Moscow, something we didn't know at the time. A Soviet submarine could employ a nuclear torpedo without requesting authorization and the Soviet commander in Cuba could have launched his IRBMs the same way.

The POD for this ATL was that a Soviet submarine DID launch it's nuclear torpedo when it was pinged by an American destroyer. (In OTL, the commander held his fire, although he had prepared the torpedo for launch.)

The resultant nuclear detonation over the horizon led to immediate air strikes by the USAF in an attempt to knock out the missiles in Cuba before they could be launched, an effort that failed. Four missiles flew, one that detonated over Washington DC, one that missed and landed in farmlands in western New York, one in (IIRC) Atlanta, and one dud. With Kennedy and most of the government destroyed, command fell upon the commander of NORAD who ordered a total nuclear retaliation. The Speaker of the House was located later that day, who confirmed the actions of generals.

American response was a total launch of IRMBs out of Italy, Turkey, and Great Britain, followed by ICBMs out of the US and bomber fleets winging towards the Soviet Union. At this point, the Soviet leaders did not even know about the launching of nuclear weapons by their forces in Cuba (Soviet communications systems were poor at the outset, a loss of contact for periods of time was nothing out of the ordinary).

Major Soviet cities, military bases, and other assets were immediately destroyed by missiles. Eastern European countries saw their capitols go up in smoke, along with any Soviet military bases within their countries, but otherwise were untouched. Bombers patrolled over the Soviet airspace, looking for targets worthy of nuclear bombardment. This lasted for three days before the majority of American strategic assets had been exhausted and the pleas of European and Asian allies to cease firing were heard.

The following year, exploration teams from Europe entered into what was formerly the Soviet Union, finding less than 10% of the population still alive, the rest dead to either direct nuclear affects, radiation poisening, starvation, or societal collapse. The nuclear attack on the Soviet Union became known as the Second Holocaust.

The United States is ejected from the United Nations and demands for reparassions from the affected nations (Europeans mostly, suffering fallout) fall on deaf ears, as the United States felt it was the aggreeved party.

Was a very interesting ATL, scary in some ways, but I'm gratified to know that we could expect the US to have survived a nuclear exchange in 1962.
Click to expand...
If its the one I read, then the only hits in the Warsaw Pact countries were strictly military, leaving their govwrnments and capitals in lace. Also, it wasn't New York, it was several failed attacks against Cincinnati nd Norfolk, but we may be tsalking about two different ATLs. Though, I doubt the Cuban missiles could reach New York.
 

Scomerger

shane said:
What if John Kennedy was as hot headed as the Generals around him and decided to launch airstrikes on Cuba in October of 1962, followed by an all out invasion of the Island which was repulsed by the use of tatcial nuclear weapons on the beaches?

What next? Would the Soviets launch an attack on Western Europe and be met by America responding with tatical nuclear weapons of it's own ?

Would Kennedy launch nuclear weapons at Cuba?

Would the Soviets have looked the other way?

Would the Soviets have launched what they had at the United States ?

Would both sides have launched all their nuclear weapons at each other?

Would Kennedy simply bring what was left of the invasion taste force home and seek a truce ?
Click to expand...


Why would Kennedy start a nuclear war?
 

Farnham

Aldroud said:
Was a very interesting ATL, scary in some ways, but I'm gratified to know that we could expect the US to have survived a nuclear exchange in 1962.
Click to expand...

I don't know if this projection is considered reasonably accurate or if my teacher was full of hot air, but my high school history teacher stated a casualty estimate for a Cuban Missile Crisis war. He said estimates were compiled that if war had broke out the US would have lost about 10 million people, mostly along the Eastern seaboard. The Soviets would have lost closer to 50 million, and been knocked back to the Stone Age a couple of generations standard of living wise.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top
Top