Your AH thoughts alternate battle of the bulge

I have been doing some interesting reading on the plans leading up to operation autumn mist.

one option offered by generalobert jodl was to launch an antwerp aimed offensive from velno in holland. this of course would involve a much shorter trip to antwerp.

this offensive would end up being primarily against montgomery's forces. the brittish at this point had reached the limit of their manpower and where breaking up existing brigades and divisions to keep the remainder at full strength.

how does the board feel this version would differ from otl. would the brittish be completely done as a land power on continental europe if they suffered heavy losses in a winter 1944 campaign. could it lead to an armistace?

your thoughts?
 
This could have seriously hurt the British, but the Germans would still have had a powerful American force on their left flank. Most likely this would have made its easier to capture the Germans within a pocket near the coast and thus have cost them more men overall.

With Britain totally battered they would have become an even more junior partner to the US. This may have opened the way for Patton to be given free reign along a narrow front, especially if a large German force had been bagged. The Germans did about as well as they could have possibly done by that point in the war. Any differences would most likely have meant a shorter war and a faster collapse for the Germans.

Benjamin
 
If the British had taken heavy losses they would have been severly diminished as a force but it's hard to see the Germans achieving this also they'd be fighting stronger more experienced forces earlier on and along with the Americans in the South and the skies eventually clearing the Germans are likely to cause much less damge than the original counter-offensive did.
 

Deleted member 1487

I'd say forget the Western Battle of the Bulge; I'd rather see an Eastern version TL and be interested about how that could go. Imagine an earlier Fruehlingserwachen:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Frühlingserwachen
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_bulge
But with the forces that were at the Bulge+whatever the local reserves are. Blow the Rhine bridges early and more effectively while keeping your troops ready to go in the East where they could make somewhat of a difference.

German strength from both offensives:
Wacht am Rhein (Bulge)
500,000 men[1]
500 medium & heavy tanks,
1,900 artillery guns and Nebelwerfers

Fruehlingserwachen (Spring Awakening)
140,000
900 AFVs

So something around 640,000 men (at least. We don't know how many men extra might have been available in '44 in the East that were gone by '45 for the historical Spring Awakening), 1,400 Panzers, and 1,900 artillery pieces. Hefty offensive. Combine that with whatever else is lying around and one could have +1 million men, 2,000 Panzers, 2-3,000 guns, and, if Bodenplatte never happens in the West:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unternehmen_Bodenplatte
About 1,035 aircraft, including 929 fighters and fighter bombers.

Even for the Eastern Front that is a heafy some of forces that might be able to make a signficant dent in the Russians. Obviously not enough to change the ending of the war, but perhaps enough to save some civilians and hurt the Russians pretty bad. Not only that, but Berlin might even hold out longer, creating all kinds of butterflies.
 
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