WWI Naval Battles

SsgtC

Banned
Something I've been wondering about, with an earlier American Declaration of War, say in 1915, would the High Seas Fleet have ever sortied in strength against the Grand Fleet or would they have spent the rest of the war as a Fleet-in-Being? Alternatively, would von Scheer decide to challenge the Grand Fleet BEFORE it could be reinforced by the US battle line?
 

cpip

Gone Fishin'
Something I've been wondering about, with an earlier American Declaration of War, say in 1915, would the High Seas Fleet have ever sortied in strength against the Grand Fleet or would they have spent the rest of the war as a Fleet-in-Being? Alternatively, would von Scheer decide to challenge the Grand Fleet BEFORE it could be reinforced by the US battle line?

I suspect they'd still do what they did historically: sortie and try to lure out parts of the Grand Fleet to bait them into being hit with more of the High Seas Fleet at a time. Depending on when it happens, the Kaiser's fretting and attempts to restrain his Admirals lest his prized toys be damaged might not have occurred.
 

SsgtC

Banned
I suspect they'd still do what they did historically: sortie and try to lure out parts of the Grand Fleet to bait them into being hit with more of the High Seas Fleet at a time. Depending on when it happens, the Kaiser's fretting and attempts to restrain his Admirals lest his prized toys be damaged might not have occurred.

But with an earlier DoW, wouldn't the USN send more than just a single squadron of BBs? I'd think that they'd likely send 2 full BatDivs to Europe. In which case the Grand Fleet will outnumber the HSF nearly 2-1. Would von Scheer ever risk it knowing the Grand Fleet could send only half their ships and match him in numbers?
 
But with an earlier DoW, wouldn't the USN send more than just a single squadron of BBs? I'd think that they'd likely send 2 full BatDivs to Europe. In which case the Grand Fleet will outnumber the HSF nearly 2-1. Would von Scheer ever risk it knowing the Grand Fleet could send only half their ships and match him in numbers?

Because of shortage fuel oil the British requested only coal-fired BB from the U.S.
 
But with an earlier DoW, wouldn't the USN send more than just a single squadron of BBs? I'd think that they'd likely send 2 full BatDivs to Europe. In which case the Grand Fleet will outnumber the HSF nearly 2-1. Would von Scheer ever risk it knowing the Grand Fleet could send only half their ships and match him in numbers?

He risked it knowing that he was outnumbered and outgunned historically. The German plan for Jutland involved legging it as fast as possible if they got into an unfavourable situation... such as coming out of drifting smoke and mist to find that your scouting battlecruisers have failed their mission and the entire Grand Fleet is crossing your T! So they were certainly aware of the risks and had a decent and effective plan to mitigate them, even in the bad-case scenario of the failure of their scouting forces.

They may be somewhat more cautious though, and not head as far north. But, as happened OTL, if they meet the BCF and the BCF runs north, then they'll have to chase, and simply run the risk of being lead by the nose on to the GF.
 

SsgtC

Banned
He risked it knowing that he was outnumbered and outgunned historically. The German plan for Jutland involved legging it as fast as possible if they got into an unfavourable situation... such as coming out of drifting smoke and mist to find that your scouting battlecruisers have failed their mission and the entire Grand Fleet is crossing your T! So they were certainly aware of the risks and had a decent and effective plan to mitigate them, even in the bad-case scenario of the failure of their scouting forces.

They may be somewhat more cautious though, and not head as far north. But, as happened OTL, if they meet the BCF and the BCF runs north, then they'll have to chase, and simply run the risk of being lead by the nose on to the GF.

Fair points. So to me, it sounds like the consensus is he would risk battle regardless. With a US DoW in 1915, the USN could send a maximum of two BatDivs made up of four ships each. The New York, Wyoming, Florida and Delaware classes. Carrying 10x14" on the New Yorks, 12x12" on the Wyomings and 10x12" on the Florida and Delaware classes.

By 1916, they could add the Nevada and Pennsylvania classes with 10 and 12x14" guns respectively. So that would give them either 10 or 12 BBs in theater depending on whether they kept them all there or sent the two Delawares home.

So, let's say in an ATL where the US has added 12 BBs to the Grand Fleet, and von Scheer is a bit more cautious in his operations because of the increased strength facing him, so no Jutland in 1916, what would TTL Jutland look like in say, 1917?
 
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