Wrapped in Flames: The Great American War and Beyond
- Thread starter EnglishCanuck
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The period term is "dough face" as I understand it, but absolutely there will be those who ascribe him to be some kind of treacherous rodent...
In some circles "Benjamin Butler" will be synonymous with "Benedict Arnold" for quite a while...
And I think you mentioned there will be some presidents who will be viewed as worse than McClellan. If I didn't misremember, that's going to be a rough few years for the United States.
Been a lurker for awhile but I'll mention with how bad of a president McLellan is how much worse of a president his successor is and trend of democratic presidents being trashfires with Buchanan, McLellan, and likely a democratic successor could this be the breaking point of the democratic party breaking apart allowing the Republicans or the populist retaking control of the White house and steering the nation away from this mess. Just speculation not anything really
Given all that is happening in the US and will happen in the future of this story, I'm surprised that the US hasn't collapsed into different nations because of a series of bad Presidents. I know the US becomes an economic powerhouse by the turn of the 20th century but the author did not state for how long. I still think that it would collapse after the Great War, else Churchill would not have titled his AH story 'If there was a United States', suggesting that it ceased to exist until reunification in the 1960s based on a previous post. I mean, that is the only way Canada can be truly safe with dismemberment of the US, not just a military defeat.
Holy smokes!
This is shaping up to be one hell of a rising, and not in a good way!
Whatever happens, even if only half of the Fenian plan is carried out, the consequences are going to be enormous. I just hope it won't be an absolute bloobath...
This is shaping up to be one hell of a rising, and not in a good way!
Whatever happens, even if only half of the Fenian plan is carried out, the consequences are going to be enormous. I just hope it won't be an absolute bloobath...
Yeah, between 1864 and 1874 are going to be a rough decade for the United States.
Then we come to the Rise of the New Men.
It's not bad speculation! Though the Republicans are currently divided and largely disunited over issues like foreign policy, monetary policy and the end of the war, the Democrats are not using their unity to do much better. How this shapes the political parties we know and love from OTL will be interesting to say the least! The building blocks of a successful Democratic Party are there, but can McClellan and his successors really implement them?
I wouldn't put too much stock in the alternate history stories as an inspiration for the future. They relay only some of what the world at their time of writing looked like.
Only the broadest strokes can be taken away from there, and I did design those stories intentionally that way where I wasn't basing them off real world novels or authors and their styles.
On the one hand, it's the most ambitious plan the Fenians ever carried out. One only possible because of the bad blood existing in the US and the willingness of the different factions of Fenians to leverage that into overlapping support for their cause. That means that they have the potential to get a lot done, much of it terrible, and much of it short sighted. The fact that the two sides are still a bit combative and not completely mutually cooperative in their plans, they can certainly leverage it into a broader international incident!
As for how bad the aftermath may be, well, I've been listening to a lot of the Revolutions podcast by Mike Duncan, recently so take that as you will!
With McClellan track record and your hints at his successor I'm gonna say no and with all the bumbling his administration Is doing right now and all the stuff that happened with the Indians and with butler and the fenians I don't think little Mac is gonna be the remembered as a Rutherford Hayes type figure more a Andrew Johnson or his previous democratic presidential counterpart Buchanan as being one of the bumbling/worst next to his successor. Oh well that's just speculation but what's going on with US grant cause I want him to save the Union from the stupidity of little Mac and his successor. But one can dream or speculate.
Also if the Era of hard feelings is predominantly leaded by democrats I think the people of the union will probably get very disillusioned with the democrats as a party if it's that harsh will either gravitate back to the Republicans who see it as a chance to take back the reins of the nation from democrats and trumpet it as a new and better way than what the democrats did in Era of hard feelings. Or they create there group probably the populist to try a new thing bring the old down change it to something new and better.
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I've been wondering who is the US President after McClellan but is George Pendleton going to be the next President? I mean, with the coming Emergency of 1867 and how it would tie back to the McClellan Administration, his chances are probably quite low but he might still command influence among the Copperheads and some Democrats to edge out a win in 1868. There is also Horatio Seymour but he also runs into the same problem of being tied to McClellan. As for the Republicans, I can't think of anyone from that side who could be President and is worse than McClellan.
Also, I wonder if the 'Cursed Amendment' is the opposite of the OTL 13th Amendment and legalises slavery in the US. That would definitely be considered cursed for years to come.
And one more thing, I know this is a bit late but if States Rights Gist does not become CS President, I guess he could always become the CS Army Chief of Staff, General States Rights Gist and people not in the know would ask, "Do you refer to states rights in general or the general named states rights?" That would be pretty funny.
Also, I wonder if the 'Cursed Amendment' is the opposite of the OTL 13th Amendment and legalises slavery in the US. That would definitely be considered cursed for years to come.
And one more thing, I know this is a bit late but if States Rights Gist does not become CS President, I guess he could always become the CS Army Chief of Staff, General States Rights Gist and people not in the know would ask, "Do you refer to states rights in general or the general named states rights?" That would be pretty funny.