Would the Germanic tribes have converted to Christianity if Rome had not?

However that is another interesting bit. Some here say that the germans converted to be part of the civilized world of rome and that it would provide some protection. The problem is that in they (most of them) ended up the wrong kind of christian and stuck with it even when it became evident that was the case. That made them heretics in the eyes of the romans and to many thats worse than being pagan. So if it was a "wanted to join the club" conversion why didnt they adapt to the new rules?

I've seen it argued that the post-Roman barbarian rulers maintained Arianism partly as a means of differentiating themselves from their Catholic Roman subjects.
 
Maybe maintaining Arianism became a way for Germanic rulers to claim equality to the Catholic Romans while also keeping a cultural distinction.

We are “equals” but not “ the same”
 
Maybe maintaining Arianism became a way for Germanic rulers to claim equality to the Catholic Romans while also keeping a cultural distinction.

I think they were more likely to claim superiority -- they were the rulers, after all. You are however right that maintaining Arianism played a role in maintaining Germanic cultural distinctiveness from their subjects.
 
I would say it depends on what Rome converts to, if anything, along with the nature of Barbarian invasions of Rome if they still happen.
 

Its usually considered polite, if you are going to respond in the negative to a question, to explain your reasoning and to add to the general conversation. In fact, this board used to have a minimum character limit to posts for just this reason.

I would love nothing more than to comment on your ideas, but it is difficult to do so when little is given. In any case, I'm going to suggest that "no" is not that correct answer. A better response would be "maybe, though its unlikely." The Germans converted to Christianity largely due to their connections to the larger, Christian, Roman culture. That, however, does not necessarily mean that they would not have done so without the Romans adopting Christianity. For instance, they might have adopted it for much the same reason the Khazars adopted the Jewish faith centuries later - to find a religion which was on an equal playing field with their neighbors, but which allowed them to stay out of a religio-cultural orbit at the same time (as well as to play two faiths against one another). I can imagine a scenario where there are two different Monotheistic faiths in the Eastern and Roman Empire, and Christianity allows the Germans to say "hey, look! We're Monotheists too. Just not like you two. Deal with it."

Also, its important to realize that, no matter how important the Roman cultural sphere was to the Germanic tribes, it was not the only important factor which drove their behavior. Perhaps Christianity takes off amongst a tribe because it meets an internal need of their people (be it cultural, political or economic). In the latter case, the religion of the Roman Empire doesn't mean a thing.

So, no, "No" is not a valid answer to this question. I still by my assertion of "Unlikely, but maybe?"
 
Its usually considered polite, if you are going to respond in the negative to a question, to explain your reasoning and to add to the general conversation. In fact, this board used to have a minimum character limit to posts for just this reason.

I would love nothing more than to comment on your ideas, but it is difficult to do so when little is given. In any case, I'm going to suggest that "no" is not that correct answer. A better response would be "maybe, though its unlikely." The Germans converted to Christianity largely due to their connections to the larger, Christian, Roman culture. That, however, does not necessarily mean that they would not have done so without the Romans adopting Christianity. For instance, they might have adopted it for much the same reason the Khazars adopted the Jewish faith centuries later - to find a religion which was on an equal playing field with their neighbors, but which allowed them to stay out of a religio-cultural orbit at the same time (as well as to play two faiths against one another). I can imagine a scenario where there are two different Monotheistic faiths in the Eastern and Roman Empire, and Christianity allows the Germans to say "hey, look! We're Monotheists too. Just not like you two. Deal with it."

Also, its important to realize that, no matter how important the Roman cultural sphere was to the Germanic tribes, it was not the only important factor which drove their behavior. Perhaps Christianity takes off amongst a tribe because it meets an internal need of their people (be it cultural, political or economic). In the latter case, the religion of the Roman Empire doesn't mean a thing.

So, no, "No" is not a valid answer to this question. I still by my assertion of "Unlikely, but maybe?"
The Kazhar did not adopt Judaism, not in a widespread fashion.
 
The Kazhar did not adopt Judaism, not in a widespread fashion.

It doesn't really matter for the case of the analogy - the rulers did for the reasons I laid out. The situation doesn't really habe to be a direct analogy; just a similar situation that could cause the Germanic tribes (or rulers) convert to Christianity even if Rome wasn't Christian.
 
Its usually considered polite, if you are going to respond in the negative to a question, to explain your reasoning and to add to the general conversation. In fact, this board used to have a minimum character limit to posts for just this reason.

I would love nothing more than to comment on your ideas, but it is difficult to do so when little is given. In any case, I'm going to suggest that "no" is not that correct answer. A better response would be "maybe, though its unlikely." The Germans converted to Christianity largely due to their connections to the larger, Christian, Roman culture. That, however, does not necessarily mean that they would not have done so without the Romans adopting Christianity. For instance, they might have adopted it for much the same reason the Khazars adopted the Jewish faith centuries later - to find a religion which was on an equal playing field with their neighbors, but which allowed them to stay out of a religio-cultural orbit at the same time (as well as to play two faiths against one another). I can imagine a scenario where there are two different Monotheistic faiths in the Eastern and Roman Empire, and Christianity allows the Germans to say "hey, look! We're Monotheists too. Just not like you two. Deal with it."

Also, its important to realize that, no matter how important the Roman cultural sphere was to the Germanic tribes, it was not the only important factor which drove their behavior. Perhaps Christianity takes off amongst a tribe because it meets an internal need of their people (be it cultural, political or economic). In the latter case, the religion of the Roman Empire doesn't mean a thing.

So, no, "No" is not a valid answer to this question. I still by my assertion of "Unlikely, but maybe?"

Also, folks should bear in mind that Armenia and Ethiopia converted to Christianity either before Rome or at around the same time. Sure, neither state was particularly relevant to the Germanic tribes, but it does show that Christianity had some momentum independent of the Roman Empire.
 
Also, folks should bear in mind that Armenia and Ethiopia converted to Christianity either before Rome or at around the same time. Sure, neither state was particularly relevant to the Germanic tribes, but it does show that Christianity had some momentum independent of the Roman Empire.

And both went for different brands of it from the ones Rome and Byzantium eventually adopted.

Imho it is also significant that the Bulgars and other Balkan peoples were noticeably slower to convert than Franks, Irish and other Western ones. Bulgaria wasn't converted until the late 9C, and others took even longer. And even when Bulgaria went Orthodox, it insisted o having a Patriarch (ie Pope) of its own rather than coming under Constantinople. This suggests to me that the survival of the Empire in the East was in some ways a handicap to the spread of Christianity there, due to fears that adopting it might compromise ones political independence. With the WRE safely dead and gone the peoples of Western Europe were far less concerned on this point.
 
Its usually considered polite, if you are going to respond in the negative to a question, to explain your reasoning and to add to the general conversation. In fact, this board used to have a minimum character limit to posts for just this reason.

I would love nothing more than to comment on your ideas, but it is difficult to do so when little is given. In any case, I'm going to suggest that "no" is not that correct answer. A better response would be "maybe, though its unlikely." The Germans converted to Christianity largely due to their connections to the larger, Christian, Roman culture. That, however, does not necessarily mean that they would not have done so without the Romans adopting Christianity. For instance, they might have adopted it for much the same reason the Khazars adopted the Jewish faith centuries later - to find a religion which was on an equal playing field with their neighbors, but which allowed them to stay out of a religio-cultural orbit at the same time (as well as to play two faiths against one another). I can imagine a scenario where there are two different Monotheistic faiths in the Eastern and Roman Empire, and Christianity allows the Germans to say "hey, look! We're Monotheists too. Just not like you two. Deal with it."

Also, its important to realize that, no matter how important the Roman cultural sphere was to the Germanic tribes, it was not the only important factor which drove their behavior. Perhaps Christianity takes off amongst a tribe because it meets an internal need of their people (be it cultural, political or economic). In the latter case, the religion of the Roman Empire doesn't mean a thing.

So, no, "No" is not a valid answer to this question. I still by my assertion of "Unlikely, but maybe?"
I am very sorry, it won’t happen again. Anyways, the reason why I don’t think so is because they were converted by Romans. If the Romans never convert, then nether do the Germanic, Celtic, Baltic, or Slavic peoples. They were even hard to convert in OTL, just pointing that out.
 
I am very sorry, it won’t happen again. Anyways, the reason why I don’t think so is because they were converted by Romans. If the Romans never convert, then nether do the Germanic, Celtic, Baltic, or Slavic peoples. They were even hard to convert in OTL, just pointing that out.

Actually, in Western Europe at least, they were converted in large part by Irish monks. Ireland itself was converted by Christians from Roman Britain, including many taken as slaves, eg St Patrick. Since there would still be many Christians in the WRE, whether the Emperors were converted or not, there's no reason for this to change.

Indeed, as I mentioned before there were in any case relatively few places converted outside the former Imperial boundaries until after the WRE had collapsed.
 
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