So I was wondering how a Confederate victory would affect southern demographics, on one hand blacks have a much bigger reason to escape but on the other hand slaveowners will likely want to keep them even more.
Thoughts?
Thoughts?
Anyone who is even familiar with Reconstruction knows that there were massacres, lynchings and other forms of violence by the Ku Klux Klan, White League, Redshirts and other organizations not to mention the Black Codes, Jim Crow aka segregation and sharecropping all of which led to the Great Migration of 6 million blacks from the South to the North.
Well still kind of racist though no worse than other examples but with no Reconstruction race relations are ironically better than OTL's South. But still the races aren't equal and blacks are not going to have many opportunities in a post-slavery Confederacy and thus it could lead to many of them going to America instead since in the 1880s-1890s they were experiencing immigration from Eastern Europe and Central Europe, Asia and the Middle East.Ironically, with less anger and resentment over what happened in the war and no Reconstruction, its possible that the CSA eventually ends less racist than the OTL South. There's racism but there ins't resentment and anger.
The ironing.
(bonus points if the CSA ends up being the less racist state while the North adopts a strong "White America" policy)
So I was wondering how a Confederate victory would affect southern demographics, on one hand blacks have a much bigger reason to escape but on the other hand slaveowners will likely want to keep them even more.
Thoughts?
Difficult to say. I wouldn't expect more black emigration to the North prior to the OTL Great Migration, as the greater incentives to go north would be counterbalanced by the greater restrictions on freedom of movement on slaves. And by the time you get to the point that black migration north really got going IOTL, you're something like 50 years past the POD and a number of different scenarios are possible. In general, however, I would expect a blacker south, as the extension of slavery and other restrictions on the freedom of black people and the existence of a border between the North and the South which could have movement across it restricted would make it more difficult in general for black southerners to emigrate to the North than IOTL.So I was wondering how a Confederate victory would affect southern demographics, on one hand blacks have a much bigger reason to escape but on the other hand slaveowners will likely want to keep them even more.
Thoughts?
Although the extent to which a successful Confederacy could manage to preserve slavery in the long term is often overstated IMO, I'm exceedingly skeptical that the Confederacy could or would abolish slavery a mere twenty years after it became independent. This is a time when most Southern elites would be be plantation owners and/or Civil War veterans who fought specifically to defend slavery, and the idea that such a group could reach such a strong anti-slavery consensus that abolitionists could muster the support among them needed to amend the Confederate Constitution to abolish slavery (and to abolish slavery outright, no less, not even a gradual abolition in the style of OTL NY or NJ where all existing slaves would remain slaves and their children would only be freed upon reaching adulthood), well, it strains credulity. Likewise, the idea that you wouldn't have black sharecropping in such a scenario is absurd--prior to mechanization in the 1940s, the Southern plantation economy needed black farm labor, and if slavery is off the table, sharecropping is the obvious solution.Depending on what scenario you choose for blacks in the Confederacy after the war ends, it's likely that slavery exists for a decade or two until it is abolished for pragmatic reasons (trying to catch up economically and industrialize like the other Western nations). In that case, the ex-slave blacks won't have any rights to begin with not to mention the yeoman farmers and poor whites will definitely not be happy seeing huge competition in the job market and the sharecropping system won't even exist at least not the extent seen in OTL and non-planter white owned companies would be reluctant to employ blacks and prefer their own kind over them instead.
You have a source for this offer? Because I've never heard of it and it's very difficult to imagine the Confederate government agreeing to such a deal, given that the only reason the CSA seceded in the first place was to preserve the institution of slavery.What if the Britain accepted the confederacy's offer of abolishing slavery during the war in exchange for recognition?
And possible actual White slaves. I can see situations were accusing your rival of having black blood and getting them enslaved would be something that's done.and even White slaves (by the standard of everyone outside CSA).
No this wouldn't happen, despite the existence of one drop rule as a concept people knew that many white people, even affluent ones, had black ancestry even if extremely minor, this was implicit.And possible actual White slaves. I can see situations were accusing your rival of having black blood and getting them enslaved would something that's done.
You have a source for this offer? Because I've never heard of it and it's very difficult to imagine the Confederate government agreeing to such a deal, given that the only reason the CSA seceded in the first place was to preserve the institution of slavery.
I have heard people on this site mention it IIRC. In the realistic Tl-191 thread it should be there. I personally think it would have been just lipservice though.I actually dont have a source I just have heard multiple people, even some people with strong anti confederate and anti lost cause leanings, say this
Nastier is one word for it.It's something I am having to tackle with the Communist CSA stuff... with an international border between North and South, the USA will never see the Great Migration, and save older black communities up north like Harlem, most of the urban black communities that formed up North are buttefied away. The USA's population of black Americans would be a fraction of what it was, given the only black folks heading north than the ones there pre-ACW will be the lucky escaped slave.
Meanwhile the CSA will be in the very precarious situation where blacks are a majority in half of its states and a sizable minority in all of them... one of the many things that will ensure slavery will only get nastier by the end.
It's something I am having to tackle with the Communist CSA stuff... with an international border between North and South, the USA will never see the Great Migration, and save older black communities up north like Harlem, most of the urban black communities that formed up North are buttefied away. The USA's population of black Americans would be a fraction of what it was, given the only black folks heading north than the ones there pre-ACW will be the lucky escaped slave.
Meanwhile the CSA will be in the very precarious situation where blacks are a majority in half of its states and a sizable minority in all of them... one of the many things that will ensure slavery will only get nastier by the end.