Wlad Goes Home: A Poland TL
- Thread starter Zorqal
- Start date
Thanks so much!
OTL Wladyslaw was chosen as king of Hungary in 1440, but Elizabeth of Luxembourg claimed the throne for her unborn son, the son of Albert II of Germany, the previous king. They started a civil war, in 1442, the Pope intervened to get Poland's help in the crusade against the Ottomans. In 1444, Wladyslaw dies at Varna.
In this TL, the Ottomans declare an invasion of Hungary against the rebels in 1442. This give King Wladyslaw the boost he needs to finish the war himself, reincorporating the rebel lords. The aggression of the Ottomans turns against the Poles, as they now rule Hungary.
I'm hoping to get into a PhD program in order to study the Polish immigrant community in Wisconsin. As such, I'm wanting to brush up on ly Polish history (partially because, when youbstudy immigration, you should know the history of the land of emigration, and partially because my Mom's family comes from that same Polish-American community). Really looking forward to this TL!
But that's not how it worked otl between Poland and Lithuania- so it's hard to assume that it'll go this way with this union. Anyway:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muscovite–Lithuanian_Wars#Second_war_.281500.E2.80.931503.29
IOTL in similar conditions Lithuania had to agree for a union (partial) in exchange for help- and they did so only after big territorial losses. Of course it hadn't came to it, but it's been initially accepted. All in all- You can't have semi- feudal kingdom acting like an absolute/ despotic one- nobles opposed to wars that weren't beneficial to them, which might be seen much later in PLC history.
Hey thanks man! I hope you can learn something about Poland through this, but I am coming at as an outsider as I'm not polish.
Your TL is great by the way, I was just catching up before I saw your comment.
Your link is to a war in 1500, the one before it in 1492, 50 years after the TL starts. And the Polish-Lithuanian union had been around since the 1385, after Jogaila, Grand Duke of Lithuania, is put on the Polish throne.
Yep. And even though this union lasted much longer and was much more beneficial to Polish nobles (Teutonic Order needed trashing) it was hard to convince them to act against Muscovy. In this case You're trying to make nobles help in war that benefits only their ruler- there's nothing to gain for them (Moldavia? It's been one of most backward regions in Europe due to being in such position).
Perhaps with money from the Pope, some promises and after the initial victories and good loot he can get some men in Poland and Lithuania
Sorry, but I've gotten slightly confused. You are talking about the Polish-Ottoman war yes? I never mentioned Lithuania in the update, a Imagined getting their troops would be more trouble than its worth. The two armies are Hungarian and Polish. And they don't gain anything from the war, other than an Ottoman concession of defeat.
Thanks, man! Glad you've been enjoying it; its been a lot of fun to write/research!
No, I meant Poland- IOTL it was very hard to make Polish nobles join war being of interest to them. How to achieve it now, in war being only beneficial to their king?
Agree with you. Poland in personal union with Hungary (which isn't even so solid) is going to act no different from the acts in personal union with Lithuania. Which as described above were "this is not our war".
I'm sure some kind of compromise can be arranged- but Hungarian nobles won't want deeper union at all (Carpathian mountains aren't beneficial for creating unified state), while Polish nobles may want some kind of privileges. All in all- it won't be: "-Let's kill some Turks!. -Yeeees!!".
While it may seem it's been easy so far, trust me, it won't be this way for very long. Hopefully you can see what I mean soon.
Wlad Goes Home: A Poland TL
II: Things Fall Apart…
II: Things Fall Apart…
Seven years after first returning home to Krakow as a double king, Wladyslaw ‘of Varna’ Jagiellon was marching to war once again. And once again he was accompanied by John Hunyadi, now Grandmaster of the Knights of the White Cape, a newly formed knightly order sworn to protect the king, his family, and the Sejm at all costs, and to be the last resistance if the nation was to fall to invaders. The ageing voivode was in turn accompanied by his two sons, Ladislaus Hunyadi and Matthias Corvinus Hunyadi, also Knights of the White Cape. King Wladyslaw was leaving behind a family of six: his wife Dorothea, his eldest daughter, eight year old Sofia, his six year old twins, Casimir and Dorothea, and his two youngest sons, Wladyslaw and John, three and two respectively.
Now though, instead of marching against the infidels on the Ottoman Sultanate, he was marching against his own disloyal subjects. His young heir Casimir was the cause of this war, though not by any direct means. The Hungarians had always been an independent minded people, not ones to sit idly by and be ruled by foreigners. And when their foreigner king declared that the Kingdom of Hungary would pass hereditarily from father to son, the more independent minded of those hungarian vassals didn’t receive the information very warmly.
So, in the early fall of 1453, the greater part of western Hungary declared that Wladyslaw was no longer their king, instead it was ruled by a council, much like the polish Sejm, who would choose a permanent ruler upon the war’s end. The next winter was spent planning by both sides, each choosing the best way to force their enemies to their knees. The Polish-Hungarians decided to follow their split and march plan that they had used to their Ottoman war, seven years prior. The King was to be accompanied by Matthias Corvinus and travel around the northern side of the rebels land, and hit the makeshift capital of Pest from behind, while John and Ladislaus Hunyadi would march through the heart of the rebel lands, and besiege the capital city from the front.
Their plan worked well enough for the first half of 1454, the two armies marching through the countryside, seizing back any castles or cities they could. All of this ended with the Battle of Esztergom in July of 1454. King Wladyslaw and Matthias Corvinus’ army, the smaller of the two Polish-Hungarian armies, are attacked in the night by the entirety of the rebel army. The battle, know in Poland as the Esztergom Slaughter, kills seventy-five percent of King Wladyslaw’s army, including Matthias Corvinus, who died from an infected wound after protecting the King from an attacker. Matthias Corvinus is remembered as a great White Cloak, who died doing his duty to King and Country. The Knights of the White Cloak’s hall, built in Krakow in 1490, is named Matthias Corvinus Hall after him, a statue being raised in his honor in the front of the building. Thanks to Matthias Corvinus’ sacrifice, King Wladyslaw manages to escape Esztergom, and he and his remaining men ride hard for John and Ladislaus Hunyadi’s army’s location, halfway in between the friendly border and Pest.
After King Wladyslaw’s loss at Esztergom marks the turning point in the war, where everything turns for the worse. The rebel army manages to drive John and Ladislaus’ army, now with the remnants of Wladyslaw’s army combined in, back to the Polish-Hungarian border. They then manage to conquer much Hungarian land. With the polish and hungarian armies routed, and Hungary being besieged, the war starts to fade in the eyes of the Poles, who had been hypnotized by Wladyslaw’s wins against the Ottomans in Bulgaria, and against the Hungarian rebels in the early 1440s. By January of 1455 though, the Poles had lost all respect for their monarch. Polish soldiers deserted their ranks, and feudal lords refused to submit more the King’s army. Supposedly, King Wladyslaw sent a letter to his younger brother, Grand Duke Casimir of Lithuania, pleading his brother to send troops to help the war, a letter his brother never replied to. Someone who did reply to Wladyslaw of Varna’s call-to-arms was his father-in-law, John von Hohenzollern, Margrave of Brandenburg-Kulmbach. Despite John’s love of peace and his pursuit of peaceful activities, he joined Wladyslaw’s war. His joining didn’t make a difference quickly though. The Poles still refused to participate further, and John and Ladislaus’ hungarian army was drastically reduced in size and demoralized, soldiers only remaining due to their love of John and Ladislaus, and for them not wanting the hungarian Matthias Corvinus Hunyadi’s death to be in vain. But, by the late spring of 1455, Brandenburgian troops had arrived in Krakow, where Wladyslaw had retreated to lick his wounds. Having been raised a good knight, he takes the lead of the army for the absent John, who had no skill in combat. Wladyslaw also took command in hopes of raising the Pole’s spirits and gaining more men as they marched through the countryside.
Not only did Wladyslaw’s plan to increase the Pole’s morale and gain men fail, it backfired horribly. The sight of more soldiers passing meant the war would still go on, harshening the lives of the people who it would never effect once it finished. They grew even more wary of Wladyslaw, and more exhausted from the war, which had now raged for a year and a half. Once King Wladyslaw and the fresh Brandenburgian troops reached John’s army at his castle in Vajdahunyad (1) in the July of 1455, they were met only with sadness. John Hunyadi, the White Knight, first Grandmaster of the Knights of the White Cape, had died two weeks prior to a heart attack. Ladislaus Hunyadi inherited everything: Hunyad Castle, Voivodeship of Transylvania, the Knights of the White Cape, and the hungarian army. Many hungarian soldiers began to desert the army, their hope in winning the war lost with John Hunyadi. That was until Grandmaster Ladislaus Hunyadi gave a speech to the remainder of the army, reminding them of their duty to their king, Wladyslaw, and to fight on in memory of Matthias Corvinus and John Hunyadi, both of which gave their life to the war’s cause (2). The speech was recorded by literate hungarian soldier, and later published in the book, The Vajdahunyad Trials, a book detailing the army’s time from their loss in rebel territory up until the end of the war in 1456.
With the combined Brandenburgian Army under King Wladyslaw, and the Hungarian Army under Grandmaster Ladislaus, the Polish-Hungarian nation was once again ready to win the war. Rather than again try their divide and conquer strategy, Wladyslaw and Ladislaus decided to march together, and chase down the rebel army, which they now outnumbered. They spend the next six months chasing down the rebel army across friendly and rebel Hungary, winning back castles all along the way. By December of 1455, the two armies are stationed in the city of Esztergom, where a year and a half earlier Wladyslaw was beaten and Matthias Corvinus was cut down. The city had changed drastically in those eighteen months. The city was filled with refugees from raided village and farms, and it was covered with rats and waste, and bodies of starved civilians and fallen soldiers. Had anyone still been alive, the city would have looked much like it had 100 years before, when the Black Death had clouded over Europe. Luckily, those civilians wouldn’t have to wait much longer for their hell on earth to end. By late March of 1456, the Polish-Hungarian army, comprised of mainly of brandenburgians, marched on Pest. the siege of the city only lasted for a months before the people of Pest surrendered the city, throwing the rebel’s ruling council out to the army. Peace was signed, and the broken realm was finally healed, almost three years after the conflict had begun. It was a Pyrrhic victory though, tens of thousands of Poles and Hungarians needlessly died, Wladyslaw has his reputation shattered, and two of the greatest minds of the Kingdom had died.
(1.) About the names of places… I’ll probably be switching a lot between regional names and english names, depending on how necessary I think it is… and whichever name I personally prefer. I prefer Vajdahunyad to Hunedoara, so Vajdahunyad it is!
(2.) Technically John Hunyadi didn’t die due to the war, it was heart attack, but propaganda is always good, right?
Also, I'm trying for longer updates. If you like lengths like this, like the last one, or even longer, please tell me and I'll try and make it happen.
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Deleted member 67076
Well so much for the peace, although I suppose it was inevitable. Happened with the Anjou in Hungary too.
Hm, have the Ottomans still taken Constantinople by 1453?
Hm, have the Ottomans still taken Constantinople by 1453?
Hopefully peace should be ahead. I mean, it can only go uphill from here right?
No, the Ottomans have been wary of western expansion after their war with Poland-Hungary, and have been focusing eastwards. The Ottoman situation will be talked about in the coming updates.