Wives For Napoleon IV

During the 1870s, there was some talk of a marriage between him and Queen Victoria's youngest daughter, Princess Beatrice.
Victoria also reportedly believed that it would be best for "the peace of Europe" if the prince became Emperor of France.

Source? Maybe the tabloids of the time speculated about a match.

Certainly not Victoria, who had no intention of allowing her youngest daughter to marry at all, let alone the heir to a foreign throne.

The circumstances of Beatrice's betrothal and marriage are well documented, she was in love with Prince Henry of Battenberg for years before she plucked up the courage to tell her mother.

Victoria instantly stopped talking to her daughter, although insisted she continue to be beside her at all times and serve her. The two women would communicate through a servant. Victoria thought she could break Beatrice's will but the young Princess refused to buckle for months.

Finally, after months of awkward silence, Beatrice's siblings begged Victoria to relent, she finally did but only on the condition that Prince Henry agreed to live with Victoria.

Victoria adored the Empress Eugenie (the feeling was mutual), I am sure she was fond of the Prince Imperial and it is known she was saddened by his tragic death and wrote to comfort his grieving mother but marriage? No, not going to happen if he was heir to the French Imperial Throne.

Victoria might have agreed to the marriage had the Prince Imperial agreed to give up his rights to the French Imperial throne, remain in the UK and convert to Protestantism but that equally ASB.

The marriage would have been strongly opposed by the Anglican Church and Victoria's German relations. Victoria had decided to marry her two middle daughters Helena and Louise to politically irrelevant men to avoid a repeat of the family strike of the 1860s that plagued her family as her children were married to royals in opposite sides of the Prussian expansion war of the 1860s.
 
Are there any Bourbons available?

With the Comte de Chambord dead and heirless, quite a few Legitimists might find a Bonaparte, married into the Legitimate line, more acceptable than a descendant of the "traitor" Louis Philippe.
 
Are there any Bourbons available?

With the Comte de Chambord dead and heirless, quite a few Legitimists might find a Bonaparte, married into the Legitimate line, more acceptable than a descendant of the "traitor" Louis Philippe.

I don't think that both dynasty want marry to competing dynasty. And might be that Napoleon III wants his son marry to somewhere current royal house that they can secure themselves. On end of 19th century was still important whose monarch marries.
 
Source? Maybe the tabloids of the time speculated about a match.

Certainly not Victoria, who had no intention of allowing her youngest daughter to marry at all, let alone the heir to a foreign throne.

The circumstances of Beatrice's betrothal and marriage are well documented, she was in love with Prince Henry of Battenberg for years before she plucked up the courage to tell her mother.

Victoria instantly stopped talking to her daughter, although insisted she continue to be beside her at all times and serve her. The two women would communicate through a servant. Victoria thought she could break Beatrice's will but the young Princess refused to buckle for months.

Finally, after months of awkward silence, Beatrice's siblings begged Victoria to relent, she finally did but only on the condition that Prince Henry agreed to live with Victoria.

Victoria adored the Empress Eugenie (the feeling was mutual), I am sure she was fond of the Prince Imperial and it is known she was saddened by his tragic death and wrote to comfort his grieving mother but marriage? No, not going to happen if he was heir to the French Imperial Throne.

Victoria might have agreed to the marriage had the Prince Imperial agreed to give up his rights to the French Imperial throne, remain in the UK and convert to Protestantism but that equally ASB.

The marriage would have been strongly opposed by the Anglican Church and Victoria's German relations. Victoria had decided to marry her two middle daughters Helena and Louise to politically irrelevant men to avoid a repeat of the family strike of the 1860s that plagued her family as her children were married to royals in opposite sides of the Prussian expansion war of the 1860s.

The difference being that with the Prince Imperial, if he gets restored, Beatrice is only a hop, skip and a jump away in Paris, and if doesn't get restored, he can easily be domesticated a la Battenberg
 
The difference being that with the Prince Imperial, if he gets restored, Beatrice is only a hop, skip and a jump away in Paris, and if doesn't get restored, he can easily be domesticated a la Battenberg

Sadly I don't think you properly appreciate the situation that Princess Beatrice faced, a good introduction would be "The Last Princess: The Devoted Life of Queen Victoria's Youngest Daughter" by Matthew Dennison.

I think sometimes there is a tendency on these boards to be somewhat flippant about historical figures and a failure to realise the importance of people's personalities in the decisions that were made at the time.

A marriage between Princess Beatrice and the Prince Imperial would have been perfectly possible, if:

a)You fundamentally changed the personality of Queen Victoria - probably need to keep Prince Albert alive so her dependency on Beatrice is not so great ;
b)You fundamentally changed the political landscape of Europe - the marriage of the British Queen's daughter to the pretender to the Bonaparte title would have been political dynamite in 1870s/1880s Europe - it would be seen as a political alliance and would have been viewed very negatively in Germany;
c)You fundamentally changed the perception of Catholicism in the UK.

Change all of these major issues and yes, a marriage would have been possible.

The idea that Victoria wouldn't mind her daughter being just "hop, skip..." away in Paris is frankly preposterous.

Victoria tried to prevent Beatrice going to the South of France on doctor's orders following the tragic death of her husband to recover and attend a spa as she was concerned about who would care for her during Beatrice's absence. Victoria was totally dependent on her youngest daughter.

The Prince Imperial couldn't (and wouldn't) have been domesticated unless you fundamentally changed his personality of European politics at the time - he believed there was a possibility of a restoration. He had a political role quite different from that of Henry of Battenberg. He had no real need for a marriage to Princess Beatrice in the way that Henry of Battenberg did, he had his own independent resources.

The issue of religion has also not been addressed.
 

TFSmith121

Banned
Needs to be a Catholic and, ideally, French

The son and heir of Napoleon III lives to his ascendancy and the Second Empire survives the Franco-Prussian War. Who would it be most fortuitous for Napoleon IV to marry in the interest of furthering the new dynasty?

Needs to be a Catholic and, ideally, French.

The British princess idea is entertaining, but as has been said, religion was significant in this era.

If there was a princess from one of the competing French royal houses, that would be interesting, but my impression is the Bourbons and Orleans branches cared little for the Bonapartists, and vice-versa.

Foreign princesses didn't exactly have a great track record in France as consorts by this time, obviously.

An appropriately Catholic and virginal daughter from one of the various marshals' families would seem a safe possibility. No dynastic complications, but reinforces the "imperial" theme.

Best,
 
Needs to be a Catholic and, ideally, French.

The British princess idea is entertaining, but as has been said, religion was significant in this era.

If there was a princess from one of the competing French royal houses, that would be interesting, but my impression is the Bourbons and Orleans branches cared little for the Bonapartists, and vice-versa.

Foreign princesses didn't exactly have a great track record in France as consorts by this time, obviously.

An appropriately Catholic and virginal daughter from one of the various marshals' families would seem a safe possibility. No dynastic complications, but reinforces the "imperial" theme.

Best,

I would have opted for a Russian Grand Duchess. The French Republic was very enamored with Russia, a Russian Grand Duchess as the wife of the pretender would have been a powerful PR tool.

Marie Alexandrovna, daughter of Tsar Alexander II, who married Queen Victoria's second son would have been an excellent candidate but she was a little older than the Prince Imperial and he was just 18 when she married.

Grand Duchess Anastasia, Alexander's niece would have been a good option, she was younger than the PI.
 

TFSmith121

Banned
True, but the question would be do the Russians want it?

I would have opted for a Russian Grand Duchess. The French Republic was very enamored with Russia, a Russian Grand Duchess as the wife of the pretender would have been a powerful PR tool. Marie Alexandrovna, daughter of Tsar Alexander II, who married Queen Victoria's second son would have been an excellent candidate but she was a little older than the Prince Imperial and he was just 18 when she married. Grand Duchess Anastasia, Alexander's niece would have been a good option, she was younger than the PI.

True, but the question would be do the Russians want it? NIV is a pretender, after all; kind of a comedown from your example, true?

Best,
 
True, but the question would be do the Russians want it? NIV is a pretender, after all; kind of a comedown from your example, true?

Best,

Russian Grand Duchesses did not really have to aim that high. They had a habit of marrying younger sons or princes from impoverished families, who were willing to relocate to Russia.

Certainly by the 1890s, Tsar Alexander III was keen to pursue Helene of Orleans for his son the future Nicholas II as a way of solidifying the Franco-Russian alliance, even though France was a republic.
 

TFSmith121

Banned
NIV in Russia, rather than Britain, is an interesting POD...

Russian Grand Duchesses did not really have to aim that high. They had a habit of marrying younger sons or princes from impoverished families, who were willing to relocate to Russia.

Certainly by the 1890s, Tsar Alexander III was keen to pursue Helene of Orleans for his son the future Nicholas II as a way of solidifying the Franco-Russian alliance, even though France was a republic.

NIV in Russia, rather than Britain, is an interesting POD... not sure how the Russians would react to an emigre Bonaparte in St. Petersburg.

Plus he'd have to convert to Eastern Orthodox, presumably.

Given his general pugnacity, odds are he ends up dying gallantly while fighting against the Turks in the 1877 war...

Best,
 

TFSmith121

Banned
From memory

Beatrice was quite fond of the Prince Imperial - the idea was of course fueled by the press who were aware that Victoria and the exiled French Imperial Family got on well (which they did dating back to Victoria's state visit to France years before).
Of course Victoria was determined Beatrice should stay at home with her and not marry.
As to religion it would have been difficult and British reaction to Beatrice's conversion would have been as reactionary as it was for her daughter's.

For Victoria herself I think less so if it could have been sold as some great love affair to her - she was pretty quickly convinced when Albert Victor wanted to marry Helene of Orleans - in part because of their love for each other and the fact they approached her first of course - it was scuppered by Helene's family and the Pope refusing to sanction her conversion. Of course that was the other way round with Helene converting to Anglicanism rather than a British Princess converting to Catholicism.
 
From memory

Beatrice was quite fond of the Prince Imperial - the idea was of course fueled by the press who were aware that Victoria and the exiled French Imperial Family got on well (which they did dating back to Victoria's state visit to France years before).
Of course Victoria was determined Beatrice should stay at home with her and not marry.
As to religion it would have been difficult and British reaction to Beatrice's conversion would have been as reactionary as it was for her daughter's.

For Victoria herself I think less so if it could have been sold as some great love affair to her - she was pretty quickly convinced when Albert Victor wanted to marry Helene of Orleans - in part because of their love for each other and the fact they approached her first of course - it was scuppered by Helene's family and the Pope refusing to sanction her conversion. Of course that was the other way round with Helene converting to Anglicanism rather than a British Princess converting to Catholicism.

Victoria didn't find Beatrice's deep love for Henry of Battenberg endearing, not sure why she would find the Prince Imperial any different.

Victoria viewed Beatrice differently to other members of her family, she was her's absolutely.

Check out Victoria's letters to her daughter the Crown Princess of Prussia, after being forced into giving her agreement to Beatrice marrying, she then wrote to Vicky hoping that Beatrice would not have any children as it would cause too much stress and difficulty for everyone i.e. her, Victoria would no longer be Beatrice's priority.

Victoria's relationship with Beatrice was fundamentally selfish, you need to change Victoria's personality fundamentally.
 
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