WIP Map Thread

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This WiP isn't that far in terms of progress (and North America feels like filler-y to me). The point of divergence would be a narrow Prussian loss in the Austro-German War (somehow), with stuff developing from there. Also: have fun guessing who is a member of the three alliances I listed in the upper-left corner.
A bit stalled on Syria: thinking of doing modern Syria (the Triumph of Baath?) rather than medieval Syria. And South Sudan is...iffy. Switzerland is inspired by Upvote's impressive "Swiss Siberia" map, especially the part of incorporating kingdoms, [1]and Spain by Goldstein's "Madrid Eterna", the biggest Spain-wank I've seen not consisting of some joker just making the planet Spain-colored.

[1] What with the plagiarism kerfluffle ongoing on the main thread, I hope this doesn't make you mad, @Upvoteanthology !

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The Provinces of the Kingdom of New Holland.

This is a Green Australia, so the population is much higher and much more spread out. The center and the south are still desert, while the edges are either grassland or various types of forest. It's basically an Australia with fertile crescent, though it's a very fertile crescent.

Though the continent was eventually conquered by the Dutch, whites don't form the majority as they do in OTL, and so not only does New Holland look different from OTL Australia in terms of the way the land looks, but also in how the people look and speak.

Thoughts, comments?
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Ottoman pyromancers, Habsburgs with dragons in exile and coming winter...
(America hopefully done, Europe and Middle East almost too...)
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hmmm maybe something Palmyrene?

Well, I'm trying to keep this fairly "modern era" (although that will mean very different things in different times), and a Palmyrene empire surviving a couple millennia seems a bit unlikely even by wank standards. Also, there's a cultural element: a Syrian wank should retain the dominance of some degree of 'Syrian' culture and/or ethnicity, while a Palmyrene empire that, say, conquers Egypt is in danger of becoming an Egyptian empire in short order (see, Scottish empires including England)


North African Littoral and West Eurasia just prior to the outbreak of the Third World War-proper


Just got a deviantart account!

A bit of background:

Here's something I'm working on at the moment. PoD is in 1930, when the Left Opposition takes power in the USSR after the assassination of Stalin, a coup staged by Kirov, and a brief civil war from 30-33. Afterwards a new Soviet constitution is drafted, empowering Narkomiust into an independent judiciary (I'll explain that later) and creating Narkometik as a legislative ethics committee with veto power over the Supreme Sovnarkom (which could override this veto) and the Presidium (which could not). The Presidium itself was combined with the general secretariat and modified into a plural executive separate from the legislature chaired by a "State Commissar" or GosKom, which serves as head of state, while women's organization Zhetnodel was formed into an organ of the legislature with the power to draft laws independent of Sovnarkom, requiring the approval only of the Presidium or Narkomiust.

The second revolution initiated a flowering of LGBT culture in the USSR, and the state became an early champion of queer rights and feminism. The USSR's government became over the next decades increasingly under the control of the marginalized minority communities of the country, and policies similar to Korenizatsiya are maintained and expanded in a concerted effort to break the imperial, colonial power of the Russian culture and religion. There was still a non-aggression pact with Nazi Germany, and even though IOTL the secret clause was agreed to as a measure to both lead the Nazis to believe that peace was in their best interest as well as save half of Europe from the Nazis, but ITTL the LeftCom state still did not attempt to cooperate with the Germans. The USSR traded with Nazi Germany in order to maintain pace of industrial development as a result of western sanctions preventing the USSR from trading anything but grain in exchange for industrial equipment (this happened IOTL). This deliberate starvation of the USSR, still existent ITTL, is, as OTL, ameliorated somewhat by trade in gas to Germany, which owing to desperate need of gas was one of the few powers willing to go around the embargo.

Though this was a necessary evil, the USSR's leadership knew that with their finger on the gas tap they had the power of life and death over the German economy should war break out, and no political cooperation was made with the Germans, even as they steamrolled across Poland and the Baltics. Germany would gain more sources of gas as it expanded during the subsequent Second World War, but the Soviets shutting off the flow after Fall Weiss seriously hurt the German war effort in the short term and an economic collapse was only averted by the Wehrmacht finally breaking through Polish lines around Warsaw and the Vistula after a four month war (which, as ITOL, allowed the Germans to seize Polish banks to sustain a kind of plunder economy). The USSR's developing industry suffered from this act, however, and a famine gripped parts of Belarus in 1940 when the USSR was forced to increase grain exports in exchange for urgently needed medical equipment.

During this time France had advanced some distance into the Rhineland in an attempt to relieve the Poles, but the offensive was cautious and the troops dug in after contacting German forces waging effective resistance, while Franco-British commanders, as OTL, overestimated the strength of German units in the region and suffered much as OTL from Fall Gelb.

The Germans invaded the USSR in June, 1941, but even though they caused an incredible amount of destruction and briefly occupied parts of Moscow itself during the decisive battle there, the Red Army managed to organize an effective retreat and hold the line in the east. In 1942 the Germans launched a summer offensive into the Caucasus to attempt to secure its oil, getting Georgia to revolt against the USSR under RightCom remnants and taking the city of Zhlobagrad on the Volga, but their attempt to reinforce the conquest by taking Astrakhan was met with disaster when Tukhachevsky launched a massive offensive on the army's weaker flanks which encircled and captured a German army. It was all downhill from there and the Red Army fought the Germans all the way to Berlin, which was taken by Tukhachevsky's forces in April, 1945.

In the west, the Germans learned the real planned location of the Normandy invasion and made preparations accordingly, and the WAllies were successfully contained in Normandy for several months. Operation Dragoon and landings at Bordeaux allowed the allies to break out of Normandy, but by this time the Germans had made preparations to withdraw to the Seine. The Eiffel Tower would be destroyed in the fighting, and it took several more months for German strength on the front to weaken to the point of collapse. During the Battle of Berlin, Hitler was captured in the Fuhrerbunker but, against orders to guard him, was painfully tortured and murdered by a Belarusian soldier whose entire family had been tortured and murdered by the SS at the start of the war.

Upon the Fall of Berlin, the WAllies were just breaking through the Seine line as German units retreated into the German highlands and German units near Berlin withdrew to the west. From April to July, 1945, Arthur Seyss-Inquart acclaimed himself the new Fuhrer and resisted in the Netherlands and the Ruhr with remaining SS and Wehrmacht units. The Rhineland would be annexed by France following the war.

There's much more to talk about but, to make the rest brief, the US Manhattan Project never gets off the ground and the allies launch Operation Downfall alongside a Soviet Pacific Fleet invasion of Hokkaido. The remaining Japanese units in the homeland wage a brief but devastating Battle of Japan, but after central Kyushu and the Kanto Plain are secured, and the Red Army has landed nearly unopposed in Tohoku, the Japanese government surrenders in December, 1945. Operation Olympic was aided considerably by air support provided by the USSR from Busan, in the newly-formed People's Republic of Korea.

Fast-forward to 1963, and the assassination of Polish state president Ewa Longina Guz by French-sponsored Algerian terrorists opposed to the proposed admission of Andalus-Rifia into the European Communist Association initiated a collapse of diplomacy in Europe which split the UN in two and drew NATO and AECA (Asia-Europe Communist Alliance) into a war which broadened until it included the active cooperation of the entire Comintern in fighting its worldwide capitalist-rightist opposition.

Fast-forward eight more years of suffering, during which time nuclear weapons and fuel technology would be first widely developed by both sides, seeing extensive and devastating use in battlefields around the world as they became locked in an ever-escalating stalemate. The war would end in January, 1971, when the development and city-shattering use of thermonuclear weapons by both sides resulted in worldwide anti-war movements of such magnitude that they agreed to an armistice in Eurasia, with much of the world following soon after. Rightist governments around the world collapsed in the years following the war, while Anarchism would become a major worldwide force in the post-war world dominated by the United Earth Consortium.

This organization was established as the openly socialist successor to the UN. Its aim is to use the collective military power of the post-colonial world to enfranchise minority peoples and establish through force a worldwide socialist federation in which all people have access to their human needs and rights. With the pooling of the resources of the whole world in a socialist structure, then Communism is to be created when all needs are guaranteed and, therefore, all labor is rendered freely.

Here are some answers to some questions that I've been asked/comments that have been made:

1) Was there enough of the Left Opposition left in 1930 to stage an uprising?

That's true, but there were many in the Red Army officer corps who not only sympathized with the LeftOpp but also saw the writing on the wall as those around them, their comrades and lovers, "old bolsheviks" and young activists alike, disappeared one by one as the revolution was asphyxiated by an internal rightist poison.

(This is precisely what Mao warns us about when he implores socialists to keep struggling after overt state power has been won, as the remaining rightist/patriarchal elements will continue to exert a corrosive influence if ignored.)

There were, nonetheless, still numerous members of the opposition who were still alive and in the USSR at this time, though many had been internally exiled and/or expelled from the party. These developments could bring them out of hiding.

Tukhachevsky comes to mind as a figure who could get a lot of the Red Army as well as the party itself on the side of the leftists in the event of civil war.

He had connections in the Commissariat of Defense, which he headed for a time before being Red Army Chief of Staff until '28, and as commander of the Volga Military District as of 1930, could have secured much of the industry of the country quickly for the leftists if he had joined an uprising. He was known for his brash, massive offensives probing deep into enemy territory, and was just the sort of pioneer of deep operations that could have won such a war quickly. Think Spanish Civil War.

In this timeline, Stalin is assassinated by a group of Cheka conspirators. Sergei Kirov, enraged, launches a coup in Moscow alongside the RightCom group and officers loyal to Stalin. He quickly lost the support of much of the Red Army, however, after the purging of its officer corps in revenge for the death of his personal friend, and the continuation with gusto of the elimination of LeftCom elements of the party, most of whom escaped Moscow and founded a rival government in Leningrad.

Trotsky returned triumphantly to the USSR from Istanbul (alongside other old Bolshevik exiles) after the Soviet Civil War began and the leftists had secured a base of power and transportation administration enough for the journey to be relatively safe. He also helped to lead Red Army forces, mainly in the Urals, procure international support for the Left Opposition, and glue the LeftCom coalition together long enough to form a government. After the war he would be instrumental in the drafting of the 1933 Constitution.

2) In the event of further de-russification, wouldn't there be interethnic violence and secession?

In 1920, when the 11th Red Army entered Yerevan, Nariman Narimanov, leader of the Azerbaijan soviet government, celebrated the victory of bolshevism and proclaimed that both Nakhchivan and Zangezur would be awarded to the Armenian state in the spirit of solidarity and ethnic representation, and as a sign that the Azeribaijani people supported the Armenians in their fight against the DRA.

"As of today, the old frontiers between Armenia and Azerbaijan are declared to be non-existent. Mountainous Karabagh, Zangezur and Nakhchivan are recognised to be integral parts of the Socialist Republic of Armenia."

Lenin welcomed this act of fellowship and internationalism, though he also advocated that a referendum be held in Nakhchivan to consult the people on the issue. It's incredible to read about the internationalism that flourished during this time. I think the rise of fascist irredentism made us jaded.

3) Queer issues with a PoD in 1930? ASB.

Do you think we didn't exist yet?. There was a great deal of persecution around the world, especially after the rise of Fascism, during the early 20th century, but we resisted and in many places queer culture did indeed flourish especially in left-com circles. If anything, worldwide queer culture, including that in the USSR, came out into the forefront of society and achieved a degree of acceptance during the 1920s that made the return to rightism following the start of the Cold War seem all the more genocidal a period of persecution. One that continues to this day.

Frankly, I'd like to know what exactly makes increasing acceptance of LGBT cultures ASB. In this world, the LGBT rights movement becomes intertwined with communism following the Left Opposition victory and the subsequent re-legalization of homosexuality in the USSR. The USSR also champions feminism ITTL, as it did in OTL, though to a lesser degree after Stalin's power grab.

4) Wasn't homosexuality illegal in the USSR?

Homosexuality was illegal under the imperial state and punished severely. In 1917 the Sovnarkom of the RSFSR introduced legislation officially legalizing homosexuality alongside a variety of other progressive laws, such as that expediting the process of divorce. The soviet women's rights group Zhetnodel, led by bolshevik feminists Alexandra Kollontai and Inessa Armand, spearheaded campaigns for improving the lives and facilitating the social freedom of women in the USSR. The Bolshevik government also became the first state in the world to guarantee women the right to free abortions in state hospitals.

The USSR, before the patriarchal reaction of Stalin's right-com group, championed feminism and LGBT rights and campaigned to weaken the traditional patriarchal family and religion. Soviet women entered the workplace and general society where they could not at all before, the Jewish people especially, as well as all the marginalized, persecuted minority peoples of the former empire, became increasingly influential in the Soviet state at all levels. Literacy and education improved across the board even in spite of Stalin, as 20,000 schools were built in 1934 alone during the First Five Year Plan. It's also worth noting that 500,000 women fought for the Red Army, and for the liberation our people, during the Russian Civil War alone.
ITTL the Zhetnodel organization became even more influential in the wake of the Soviet Civil War and the victory of the Left Opposition.

5) Why didn't the use of thermonuclear weapons result in the end of the world?
Thermonuclear weapons were only used a few times before the war ended. They left devastating material and cultural marks, but humanity stopped short of destroying itself under the overwhelming pressure of anti-war groups, especially the Black Panther Party and Students for a Democratic Society in the US.

The brutal suppression of the Detroit Uprising led largely by peoples of color and religious minorities, as well as the Stonewall Riots during the war contributed to stoking the flames.
The Wyandotte Nuclear Disaster, in which a defective plutonium bomb bound for sale to Brazil and use in South America for clearing the Amazon of communist militants detonated at the railway junction, resulted in mass rioting across the country and desertion or defection of Supreme Allied Command soldiers ordered to enforce martial law.

The last damning blow came with the discovery and mass publication of leaked information on the horrific Sarcomatic Genocide. Instigated by the US government, it was a campaign to systematically eliminate "deviant sexualities" from American , christian, and western society by deliberately covering up as well as facilitating the spread of HIV/AIDS, resulting in the death of millions of people around the world.

The first and third are not alternate history.

6) The USSR would never be a sponsor of gay rights. ASB.

There are several logical reasons I have given for why the USSR was and could have been to a greater degree a sponsor of worldwide LGBT rights as well as feminism. I would like to point you to the work and lives of Alexandra Kollontai, Inessa Armand, Nadezhda Krupskaya, Klavdiya Nikolayeva, and many other bolshevik feminists who were powerful and prominent during the 1920s, but were marginalized by Stalin's right-com group.

They did incredible work for the quality of life of Soviet women and fought to dismantle the patriarchal structures of old Russian society. The legacy of their work lives on even despite the series of rightist reactions which followed IOTL. I do not believe that these reversals were inevitable, and I have given reason for this view.

I also previously mentioned the USSR's legalization of homosexuality, which was repealed by under the right-com reaction in the 30s. ITTL, it is re-legalized after the Soviet Civil War and the victory of the Left Opposition over the rightists, at which point the USSR's gay community grew in power and acceptance alongside other minorities. The legalization of homosexuality, anti-patriarchal laws, the separation of marriage from religion, and the mass enfranchisement of minorities are all things that happened in our timeline, but were consciously halted by the patriarchal RightComs that had gathered around Stalin.

More explanation on the reform of the Soviet judicial system along with a brief primer on the Marxian analysis of political-economic systems:

Not independent in a sense of party affiliation or independence from a responsibility to the construction of socialism. Indeed the goal of socialist law is its use as a means to facilitate the process of using state power in rectification of unequal living conditions, the active destruction of the patriarchal family, and the active enfranchisement of marginalized peoples.

The aforementioned all stem from the system of private ownership of capital. In a capitalist economy in which the state enforces individuals' legal title of ownership over the means of production, all parts of the apparatus within and across different industries are constantly at war with one another, trying to absorb one another and survive in the unregulated market, using the services and goods they supply as a means to accumulate wealth rather than for the sake of rendering them to humanity.

Because the legal owners of the means of producing what people need and want cannot themselves do all of the work, they must hire labor. This brings us to the proletariat. In this economy, the capitalists own not only the farm (for instance), but also any hypothetical food that the farm produces.

The proletarian must, therefore, relinquish the compensation they have just been paid by the capitalist in exchange for their labor, for the privilege of access to the goods and services they have just produced. In effect, this process is a system of slavery in which people are coerced to work with the threat of starvation, at least in an ideal capitalist system without any interference in the free market of labor.

It is telling to note that the only possible amelioration of this condition of slavery is the direct interference of the state in the operation of the economic system and the relations that govern it. What is the logical conclusion, then, if capitalism alone is a system of naked class dominance over the economy only mitigated by the forceful institution of labor laws?
Such a system inevitably creates an underclass of marginalized people who, whether for reasons of disability physical or mental, or membership in a socially ostracized group, are disallowed from rendering their own abilities to human needs as the means of production are in the hands of prejudiced private owners with the privilege of "free association", who are already powerful by virtue of membership in socially dominant groups.

Without access to work or wage, these marginalized people are also barred from access to such things as food, housing, winter heat, medicine, psychiatric care, hygiene, recreation, clothing, transportation, and virtually all other human needs. Their lives not being profitable, their needs are not provided for.

All wealth flows back to the capitalist class and is only ever borrowed by the proletarian class. This creates a forced condition in which access to human needs is denied to those with low economic power.


Now, the Narkomiust judiciary established in 1917 in the RSFSR was an integrated organ of the Sovnarkom legislative body. This admittedly left the organization vulnerable to the control of political factions vying for power. This fact would undoubtedly have been noted by those who had already been expelled from the party or exiled. I think it reasonable that the Chekist system that had been allowed to grow would be campaigned against by a victorious Left Opposition in light of what had already happened by 1930.

In this timeline the 1933 Constitution spins off Narkomiust into a judiciary independent of the legislature and presidium tasked with the interpretation of socialist law, its proceedings occurring without legislative interference. Further, the constitution establishes a new department in the form of Narkometik, an ethics committee with veto power over the legislature whose candidates are drawn from party members in university philosophy departments, staffed in much the same manner as the Culture Commissariat.

The Cheka itself had largely sided with Kirov's bloc ITTL, and was disbanded as a result of its actions before and during the second civil war.

I do not argue that the Cheka wasn't a product of the revolution, nor that it wasn't necessary in the early years during the period of War Communism. The young state needed to defeat capitalist powers within and without, and a police force of that kind was neither new nor unique. I do, however, think it logical that the later Cheka's increasing influence and existence as a rightist political faction puts them in the cross-hairs of a victorious Left Opposition.

On the notion of Lenin being a prototype of Stalin, I would point one to Lenin's work on the subject of anti-nationalism. He advocated completely dismantling the imperial power of the Russian people and enfranchising the ethnic groups of the USSR, especially the Jewish people, and for the empowerment of women in Russian society in opposition to the patriarchal family values of the past. These views are clearly demonstrated not just in his writing and speeches, but also in the political work that he helped to direct and facilitate during the earliest years of the USSR.

The repetition of discredited anti-communist propaganda canards founded in racism and anti-semitism is evidence for exactly why historical education is indispensable for proper political awareness. For further reading I would strongly recommend the database on Marxists.org.
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Minor progress, but at least now I'm happy with North America. Also there should obviously be the implication that "West America" and the USSA (names pending) claim each other, but it'd look horrendous to show those claims on the map, hence it's not there.

(also a quick shout-out to RvBOMally because those Native ARs and the Acadia AR are heavily inspired by his Strength Through Unity map and UpvoteAnthology whose People's Socialist Atlas project inspired the basic split for North America)
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View attachment 496107
Minor progress, but at least now I'm happy with North America. Also there should obviously be the implication that "West America" and the USSA (names pending) claim each other, but it'd look horrendous to show those claims on the map, hence it's not there.

(also a quick shout-out to RvBOMally because those Native ARs and the Acadia AR are heavily inspired by his Strength Through Unity map and UpvoteAnthology whose People's Socialist Atlas project inspired the basic split for North America)
Idea throw: Italian Tunisia, Austrian Tripolitania, Greek Cyrenaica, because why not.
View attachment 496107
Minor progress, but at least now I'm happy with North America. Also there should obviously be the implication that "West America" and the USSA (names pending) claim each other, but it'd look horrendous to show those claims on the map, hence it's not there.

(also a quick shout-out to RvBOMally because those Native ARs and the Acadia AR are heavily inspired by his Strength Through Unity map and UpvoteAnthology whose People's Socialist Atlas project inspired the basic split for North America)
Very satisfying alternate colonial borders.
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2019 in my timeline. 26 years after its World War 1.

I still have to do Africa,Asia,Russia, and also make some corrections. And also put in the legend/description of places. But, allow me to make some things clear.
  1. China isn't communist. In fact communism and fascism don't exist in this world. Leftism and Rightism don't even really exist and the various regimes that exist here would be all over the OTL Political spectrum. Like a broken compass trying to point at everywhere at once.
  2. That's not Australia as you know it. It doesn't even speak English. The people don't even look like OTL Australians for the most part, nor does the land even look like OTL Australia.
  3. Canada doesn't exist, but that country up there still speaks English.
  4. US doesn't exist either, but that country also still speaks English.
  5. Brazil wasn't Portuguese, for long anyways.
  6. Italy still speaks (a different dialect) Italian, but everyone learns Spanish as a second language.
  7. Technology is 50-100 years ahead than OTL( depending on one's opinion). Humans walked the moon back in the 1910s and the Panama Canal was built in the early 1800s.
  8. Yes, there are Zeppelins, though they''re more of a pure luxury thing nowadays.
Also, what sounds better? Gemeinschaft or Gemeinde?
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Idea throw: Italian Tunisia, Austrian Tripolitania, Greek Cyrenaica, because why not.

As horrifying and depressing as all colonialism is, Italian Tunisia in particular presents some interesting (in the Chinese sense) possibilities for TLs that could bring it about. France never establishing a protectorate over the Tunisian Beylik in the early 19th century could have some knock on effects in regards to Ottoman politics, perhaps playing some role in Muhammad Ali's rebellion for instance. And how the development of the Italian state is affected by this might play a role in the circumstances of Italy's acquisition of the territory. Does Italy annex it after a brutal invasion? Does Italy establish a protectorate through the Bey? Do they deal with uprisings among, for instance, the Chaoui in the mountains as brutally as they suppressed Libya IOTL? Or could things have been different in Tunisia, especially with an alternate Italian Unification? I'm thinking maybe Garibaldian republic or possibly even the Roman Revolution of 1848 establishing an early Italy. All very interesting scenarios you present.

And now I can't un-see Sylvester Stallone. Today was a good day.
Look at me, not feeling bad for sharing the same WiP three times on a single page of a thread because I'm slow at making progress right now!

Also, the new "highlight" on the map: the collapse of Spanish control over the Philippines, with a coordinated uprising in Luzon, a smaller, independent revolt on Negros, and two Muslim-led revolts on Mindanao and Sulu respectively.

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EDIT: Updated Sokoto.
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So it has been a while since I've posted anything here! I have done some work on some projects including this one. I am currently working on electoral ridings for the Concordian Confederation with this being an example of how the map would look if all constituencies have been filled in for elections.

Blue - Concordian
Turquoise - Equality
Fuschia - Labour
Red - Escrophone Democrats
Green - Green


View attachment 496107
Minor progress, but at least now I'm happy with North America. Also there should obviously be the implication that "West America" and the USSA (names pending) claim each other, but it'd look horrendous to show those claims on the map, hence it's not there.

(also a quick shout-out to RvBOMally because those Native ARs and the Acadia AR are heavily inspired by his Strength Through Unity map and UpvoteAnthology whose People's Socialist Atlas project inspired the basic split for North America)

Is that Belgian Patagonia?
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Anyone have any advice as to how I have German Africa split into colonial entities? So, far I just have the area surrounding the Chad Lake spun off as it's own thing since that's area is predominately Muslim and also surrounds the Chad Lake.

University is wrapping up, so hopefully (no promises) that gives more time for maps. This is my progress from tonight on an (unauthorized) cover/soft reboot of rvbomally's Allies and Axis 2.0 set in 1936. Currently depicts the extent of Imperial America (Japan analogues/GEACPS analogues). Minimal progress but it is my first map section for a very long time.

- The Maritimes in my mind represent the Mengjiang to Canada's Mongolia - for now at least
- California is the PRC - subject to change
- Tejas is Manchuria
- CSA/the South is Korea - quite divided as how to split North and South post-war
- Cuba is Taiwan
- Vancouver Island is Sakhalin
- Panama is Singapore
- Belize and Miskito are analogues for the Chinese concessions (currently occupied by the Latin Pact of Spain, Portugal and Italy etc.) - subject to change​

In my personal view I liked the idea of Mexico/Greater New Spain as a Warlord China analogue more than I liked Brazil as China like in the original map. This is exacerbated by the early 19thC POD and my personal bias towards the Adams/Onis Border. Brazil is intended to be a part of the Latin Pact (Commonwealth) as India/Raj.

Quite unsure what a Philippines analogue will be so any suggestions are very welcome.