WI: Wilson dies while Roosevelt lives

Wiki on Woody said:
The immediate cause of Wilson's incapacitation was the physical strain of the public speaking tour he undertook to obtain support for ratification of the Covenant of the League of Nations. In Pueblo, Colorado, on September 25, 1919[108] he collapsed.[109]

Then, on October 2, 1919, he suffered a serious stroke that almost totally incapacitated him, leaving him paralyzed on his left side and blind in his left eye.[110] He was confined to bed for weeks, sequestered from nearly everyone but his wife and his physician, Dr. Cary Grayson.[111] For at least a few months, he used a wheelchair. Later, he could walk only with the assistance of a cane. The full extent of his disability was kept from the public until after his death on February 3, 1924.

With few exceptions, Wilson was kept out of the presence of Vice President Thomas R. Marshall, his cabinet and Congressional visitors to the White House for the remainder of his term. His wife, Edith, served as his steward, selecting issues for his attention and delegating other issues to his cabinet heads. Eventually, Wilson did resume his attendance at cabinet meetings, but his input there was perfunctory at best.[112] This was one of the most serious cases of presidential disability in American history and was later cited as an argument for the 25th Amendment

Wiki on TR said:
Roosevelt's attacks on Wilson helped the Republicans win control of Congress in the off-year elections of 1918. Roosevelt was popular enough to seriously contest the 1920 Republican nomination, but his health was broken by 1918, because of the lingering malaria. His family and supporters threw their support to Roosevelt's old military companion, General Leonard Wood, who was ultimately defeated by Warren G. Harding.

On January 6, 1919, Roosevelt died in his sleep at Oyster Bay of a coronary thrombosis (heart attack), preceded by a 2½-month illness described as inflammatory rheumatism,[81] and was buried in nearby Youngs Memorial Cemetery.[82][83] Upon receiving word of his death, his son Archie telegraphed his siblings simply, "The old lion is dead."[79] The U.S. Vice-President at that time, Thomas R. Marshall, said that "Death had to take Roosevelt sleeping, for if he had been awake, there would have been a fight[

Well, For all those who know my timelines, you'd notice that Im a believer in a death for a death scenario's(It just makes sense to me look up Law on Conservation of energy lol). But anywho, I was thinking what if Wilson had died on that dark day of October, and Roosevelt was given yet another lease on life for a few more years.

How exactly would a Marshall presidency turn out? Would he be able to get the League threw on sympathy for Wilson and seceding to the GOP their revisions? Would Marshall be denied the nomination in 1920 by the Democrats? And How badly as an Incumbent POTUs would he loose to Roosevelt if he was the GOP nominee?

As for Teddy, if he had not suffered that fatal heart attack only three months after Wilson's stroke, would he have been given the nomination? Or would the bosses win out for the third election in a row? With his detiorating health(From the trip to the Amazon) could he survive a third term? What kinds of Progressive reforms that TR would push through that wern't covered by Wilson? Any chance that those reforms might hinder the economic boom of the roaring twenties? Any other potential variables? Keep it comming:D
 
As for Teddy, if he had not suffered that fatal heart attack only three months after Wilson's stroke, would he have been given the nomination? Or would the bosses win out for the third election in a row? With his detiorating health(From the trip to the Amazon) could he survive a third term? What kinds of Progressive reforms that TR would push through that wern't covered by Wilson? Any chance that those reforms might hinder the economic boom of the roaring twenties? Any other potential variables? Keep it comming:D

Don't forget, it's not just the illness. Teddy never really recovered from his son Quentin's death in the Great War. I can't see him running for the Presdency at all, and certainly not with the vigor that defined much of his life and his previous terms as POTUS even if he did.
 
Don't forget, it's not just the illness. Teddy never really recovered from his son Quentin's death in the Great War. I can't see him running for the Presdency at all, and certainly not with the vigor that defined much of his life and his previous terms as POTUS even if he did.
I have to agree there; his 1912 run already had a lot of people commenting that he didn't seem as vigorous and energetic as he used to be, and another eight years of aging along with the death of his son won't have helped matters one bit.

Also, I would imagine that after his Bull Moose run handed the Presidency to Wilson, the Republican party would have a fair amount of opposition to nominating Roosevelt for another run at the Presidency. I expect there would be a lot of of pressure on Roosevelt to just retire and let the new generation of politicians have their chance.
 
I have to agree there; his 1912 run already had a lot of people commenting that he didn't seem as vigorous and energetic as he used to be, and another eight years of aging along with the death of his son won't have helped matters one bit.

Also, I would imagine that after his Bull Moose run handed the Presidency to Wilson, the Republican party would have a fair amount of opposition to nominating Roosevelt for another run at the Presidency. I expect there would be a lot of of pressure on Roosevelt to just retire and let the new generation of politicians have their chance.

IDK guys, TR had really rejuvinated himself and his image campaigning for congressional candidates in 1918 and although Quentin's death did kneel a powerful blow to the Bull Moose, most historians say that he was still very interested in getting the nod and '20 and was approached by the party leaders for it.

In fact...In James Chaces book 1912, he says

1912 by James Chace said:
Roosevelt neverthless continued his quest for the nomination,fufilling as many speaking engagements as he felt strong enough to do...TR's health, however continued to deteriorate. On November 11th, 1918, the day in which Germany surrendered, he again entered the hospital, where he remained for seven weeks. At one point rheumatism in his left arms grew so great that the arm had to be bound in a splint. During this time, Republican leaders visited him to see if he would accept the Republican nomination. He responded that he would not activley seek it but if the party leaders came to him and said they were convinced he was the only man who could be elected and that they were all for him, he would not refuse.

So that's your scenario, a deadlocked convention perhaps...I just think 18months is a fairly long amount of time to recuperate and try to put one back into shape. Although I think he's to old to be roping cattle in the badlands, any extended vacation(Not in a steaming jungle), just might be what it takes to push Teddy back into the fight or atleast give him the appearance of being so;)
 
TR would likely be POTUS, but I don't see him (or Wilson FTM) getting many (if indeed any) progressive reforms through in the 1920s.

After WW1, people just wanted a rest, and the crusading zeal of 1912 just didn't exist any more. TR would have found himself in a situation akin to the last year of his OTL Presidency, where any reform measures just died in Congress.
 
TR would likely be POTUS, but I don't see him (or Wilson FTM) getting many (if indeed any) progressive reforms through in the 1920s.

After WW1, people just wanted a rest, and the crusading zeal of 1912 just didn't exist any more. TR would have found himself in a situation akin to the last year of his OTL Presidency, where any reform measures just died in Congress.

But what could be some of the causes, that Wilson hadn't already taken it, or basically what's left of New Nationalism to even make a serious agenda. I know TR was making speeches for government enforcement of Racial Equality in the South in the run up to his death, but we all know how much congressional support those measures would get(Nadie). Although his bully pulpit style might be enough to push the Dyer Bill through. Suffrage has been taken care off with the Amendment and Prohibition would be in place a year before the start of his term.

Maybe some less controversial issues, like more Conservation and such. But more imporantly, the economy did enter a recession in 1920-1921, that Im pretty sure Roosevelt will enact a huge stimulus plan for including public works, street car lines etc, and not the Tax cuts that Harding performed. I think most economists that they played some role in the economic expansion of the decade. So we could see a very L-shaped recovery due to the recession due to Roosevelt's policy but Im no where near an expert on fiscal policy.
 
I hereby declare the AH Canonization of Historico's Law of Conservation of Mortality.


OT: saving TR may be as simple as keeping him from going on that trip up the Amazon as his injuries and illness sustained there were the "nail in the coffin", so to speak, on his health.

Still, I don't see him running again, but he could certainly influence public opinion on some serious socio-political issues in his remaining few years.

With luck he helps jumpstart racial equality some, particularly w/o the "hero of the war" WW to kick it further back on the bus.

I don't see him supporting the LoN, as he was firmly Balance of Power minded.

Unless his presence gets Woods in the White House (a name he gave the Executive Mansion, BTW) I think mostly minor changes at first.
 
Historico has it right: TR overtly expressed interest in the 1920 GOP nomination. I can't quote the letter that his biographers have quoted, but during 1918, he wrote (to Henry Cabot Lodge? unsure and don't have the biographies handy) that he saw nobody else on the horizon that seemed a plausible candidate--and at the time, he was quite right since he overshadowed anyone else the Republicans might have had. Then too, with the illness that claimed him ultimately still over the horizon, he would have been perhaps 62 years old when elected/inaugurated, and would have served (assuming two terms) until age 70: not all that outrageous.
 
Historico has it right: TR overtly expressed interest in the 1920 GOP nomination. I can't quote the letter that his biographers have quoted, but during 1918, he wrote (to Henry Cabot Lodge? unsure and don't have the biographies handy) that he saw nobody else on the horizon that seemed a plausible candidate--and at the time, he was quite right since he overshadowed anyone else the Republicans might have had. Then too, with the illness that claimed him ultimately still over the horizon, he would have been perhaps 62 years old when elected/inaugurated, and would have served (assuming two terms) until age 70: not all that outrageous.

I concur, How plausible do you think that an Incumbent President Thomas Marshall would win the Democratic Nomination in 1920? and Would he have picked FDR as his running mate?
 
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