WI: William loses the Battle of Hastings?

Suppose Harold keeps the high-ground advantage he has over William, and defeats William in battle. What happens next? Is William driven all the way back to the coast? Perhaps even sees an invasion of his own territory? Will Normandy be conquered and returned to the English, or will it become its own state? Or perhaps the French will take it?

What about England? How will England's leadership be affected, and what might Harold's lineage do differently? Will a document like the Magna Carta ever originate in England? Will it ever be written at all (in any location)?
 
Suppose Harold keeps the high-ground advantage he has over William, and defeats William in battle. What happens next? Is William driven all the way back to the coast? Perhaps even sees an invasion of his own territory? Will Normandy be conquered and returned to the English, or will it become its own state? Or perhaps the French will take it?

What about England? How will England's leadership be affected, and what might Harold's lineage do differently? Will a document like the Magna Carta ever originate in England? Will it ever be written at all (in any location)?

1) Depends on how decisively William is defeated.

2) Probably not.

3) "Returned to"?! Normandy is part of France - the duke is a vassal of the
French crown. It never had anything to do with England.

4) See #3. William has sons, barring unrest within the duchy of rivals within France, the oldest (Robert) will inherit.

5) Drastically.

6) Hard to say. Not likely to be a Doomsday Book, for starters. Or a Harrying of the North.

7) Who knows?
 
As to what they would do differently its already been posited that Saxon England would remain in the scandinavian political sphere rather than become france focused like they did after the Normans took over. I dont the the English would be using any Magna Carta equivalent though, the nobles already have a lot of power in the saxon system because of the fact it was an elective monarchy and anyone who cared about their dynasty had to respect the nobles traditional priviliges lest their family loses the throne.
 
As to what they would do differently its already been posited that Saxon England would remain in the scandinavian political sphere rather than become france focused like they did after the Normans took over.

While Saxon England would not be as France-focused as the Normans necessarily were, France will still be important as it was nearer, richer, and potentially stronger than Scandinavia. By the time of the Norman conquest, Scandinavian influence in England was waning - Edward the Confessor was criticised for the Norman influence in his court. Saxon England will have the benefit of choosing which political sphere to involve themselves with at which point - they might also take on more Dutch/German influence than in OTL.
 
Suppose Harold keeps the high-ground advantage he has over William, and defeats William in battle. What happens next? Is William driven all the way back to the coast?
He's probably killed in battle, as nearly happened IOTL anyway: That's one of the likeliest causes for a Norman defeat.

Perhaps even sees an invasion of his own territory? Will Normandy be conquered and returned to the English, or will it become its own state? Or perhaps the French will take it?
France might try, but William's brother-in-law the Count of Flanders would probably intervene to help his relatives and the King of France wasn't really that much more powerful than any of the dukes or the more important counts (such as Flanders) so William's oldest son Robert -- who'd actually have been his only son if he did indeed fall in action at Hastings -- would probably end up as duke with about as much independence as William had possessed.

What about England? How will England's leadership be affected, and what might Harold's lineage do differently? Will a document like the Magna Carta ever originate in England? Will it ever be written at all (in any location)?
More contact kept with Scandinavia, less French influence and less involvement in French affairs (because, for one thing, there's a fair chance that this butterflies away the Hundred Years War...).


While Saxon England would not be as France-focused as the Normans necessarily were, France will still be important as it was nearer, richer, and potentially stronger than Scandinavia. By the time of the Norman conquest, Scandinavian influence in England was waning - Edward the Confessor was criticised for the Norman influence in his court. Saxon England will have the benefit of choosing which political sphere to involve themselves with at which point - they might also take on more Dutch/German influence than in OTL.
As you say, Edward was criticised for that... and, as you didn't say, the facts that Edward was not only half-Norman himself but had spent a couple of decades as an exile on the continent too were major factors in his bringing that influence over here in the first place and were factors that (in reaction to the invasion attempt) probably wouldn't apply for at least the next two or three generations of English kings.
 
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More contact kept with Scandinavia, less French influence and less involvement in French affairs (because, for one thing, there's a fair chance that this butterflies away the Hundred Years War...).

It will butterfly away the centuries of mutual warfare between England and France. The Norman conquest kicked this off as it created the situation where one of the feudal vassals of the King of France was also his feudal Equal. This was an unstable situation which resulted in the Dukes of Normandy (who were also after the Norman Conquest Kings of England) attempting to cut the Gordian Knot by making themselves Kings of France. They may still try this but it won't (neccesarily) involve the English
 
It will butterfly away the centuries of mutual warfare between England and France. The Norman conquest kicked this off as it created the situation where one of the feudal vassals of the King of France was also his feudal Equal. This was an unstable situation which resulted in the Dukes of Normandy (who were also after the Norman Conquest Kings of England) attempting to cut the Gordian Knot by making themselves Kings of France. They may still try this but it won't (neccesarily) involve the English
However there's still the possibility of an English king marrying Eleanor of Aquitaine (or some other French heiress) and getting into a similar conflict because of her lands...
 
More contact kept with Scandinavia, less French influence and less involvement in French affairs (because, for one thing, there's a fair chance that this butterflies away the Hundred Years War...).

As you say, Edward was criticised for that... and, as you didn't say, the facts that Edward was not only half-Norman himself but had spent a couple of decades as an exile on the continent too were major factors in his bringing that influence over here in the first place and were factors that (in reaction to the invasion attempt) probably wouldn't apply for at least the next two or three generations of English kings.

But given the proximity of France and the low-countries to England, without Scandinavians threatening England's shores (which is presumably at an end, unless Sweyn of Denmark goes for it) or on the throne, the English aren't going to put all their attention on Scandinavia.
 
But given the proximity of France and the low-countries to England, without Scandinavians threatening England's shores (which is presumably at an end, unless Sweyn of Denmark goes for it) or on the throne, the English aren't going to put all their attention on Scandinavia.
Well, no. They can put more effort into establishing hegemony over Wales, Scotland, and maybe even Ireland, too.
And then, onwards to Vinland! ;)
 
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