WI: US Bombs Vietnamese Dikes

kernals12

Banned
During the Vietnam war, the US chose not to intentionally bomb North Vietnamese civilian targets, simply going after military and industrial targets. As such, they refrained from bombing the Red River Dike network. Doing so would've flooded Hanoi and killed hundreds of thousands of people and have been a horrific black mark on the US military. But I'm going to focus on the military aspect instead of the political. Would this have changed the outcome of the war?
 
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Might give the chinese a good pretext to fully enter the war which is why the US in general attempted to be carefull about their targets.
 

Anchises

Banned
Leaving humanitarian aspects aside:

If the bombing of the dyke network is followed by a "Linebacker" type operation, degrading Northern ability to import stuff, then there is a serious chance of a massive famine.

If that happens, and China doesn't enter the war, the USA probably can safely begin Vietnamization.

And that doesn't even take into account the massive losses caused by flooding.

Assuming the dyke network bombing would work as planned.
 
Kick
In 1969, China would not declare war to USA. They didnt have ICBM's at this moment. Unless, they want to turn 60% of their own country into a nuclear wasteland, and lose 450.000.000 population at minimun
 
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kernals12

Banned
My wet dream is:
What if USA used 50KT warheads on Red River Dikes and Hanoi in 1969? This TL sounds promising.
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In 1969, China would not declare war to USA. They didnt have ICBM's at this moment. Unless, they want to turn 60% of their own country into a nuclear wasteland, and lose 450.000.000 population at minimun
You want the US to nuke millions of innocent people?
 
My wet dream is:
What if USA used 50KT warheads on Red River Dikes and Hanoi in 1969? This TL sounds promising.
Thread answer:
In 1969, China would not declare war to USA. They didnt have ICBM's at this moment. Unless, they want to turn 60% of their own country into a nuclear wasteland, and lose 450.000.000 population at minimun

Good job, you've just forced a USSR/China reconciliation, messing up the single biggest gift package to the west during this period.
 
There would be nothing left from China.

No I mean the moment you nuke vietnam the sino/soviet split is over and china would in all likelyhood be protected by soviet guarantees to retaliate against nuclear attacks against china. Although tbh that probably goes for any nuclear strike.

Meanwhile the US just alienated the entire world and is now facing a major conventional landwar in asia instead of the medium one they were already in.
 
Might give the chinese a good pretext to fully enter the war which is why the US in general attempted to be carefull about their targets.
If Chinese troops entered Vietnam , the entire North Vietnamese government would be dead within a week and Mao would installed a puppet government. The Soviet Union would be pissed off about that. Soviet China relations we're pretty low at that time. If you want a Sino Soviet war that could do it.
 
Good job, you've just forced a USSR/China reconciliation, messing up the single biggest gift package to the west during this period.

No, not even that would get Mao/Gang of Four and Brezhnev on the same page, mostly because China wasn't the big backer of North Vietnam, that was the USSR and the Pact nations
 
I don’t think it’s possible to separate the military and political aspects of the Vietnam war. Deliberately causing civilian casualties on that scale would cause a domestic reaction that would undermine the military gain. The US cannot win in Vietnam without maintaining domestic approval.
 

kernals12

Banned
I don’t think it’s possible to separate the military and political aspects of the Vietnam war. Deliberately causing civilian casualties on that scale would cause a domestic reaction that would undermine the military gain. The US cannot win in Vietnam without maintaining domestic approval.
This would be a pretty good POD for a McGovern victory.
 
If you don't mind further inflaming the countryside against the government and giving Americans a reason to want to distance themselves from something bordering on a war crime.

Bombing civilian infrastructure and causing floods, disease outbreaks, and likely subsequent famine that result in millions of deaths isn't bordering on a war crime, it is a war crime.
 
Bombing civilian infrastructure and causing floods, disease outbreaks, and likely subsequent famine that result in millions of deaths isn't bordering on a war crime, it is a war crime.

Should note that the US and British busted many Dams in WWII and Korea with zero repercussions
 
, the US chose not to bomb North Vietnamese civilians

Actually, they did bomb North Vietnamese civilians. During Operation Rolling Thunder, 300,000 civilians were killed. In 1965, it was estimated that 45% of the casualties were civilians and logistics workers while that jumped to 80% in 1966.
 

kernals12

Banned
Actually, they did bomb North Vietnamese civilians. During Operation Rolling Thunder, 300,000 civilians were killed. In 1965, it was estimated that 45% of the casualties were civilians and logistics workers while that jumped to 80% in 1966.
They didn't intentionally attack civilians.
 
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