WI: U556 had torpedoes

In OTL U556 has Ark Royal in her sights but had used up all her torpedoes in attacking convoys. What if U556 had one last salvo of torpedoes and damages or sinks Ark Royal before she can launch strike that damaged the Bismarcks rudder. What are the butterfiles from this.
 
I sometimes muse on what if everything went right for the Germans during the Bismarck sortie? Bismarck sinks not only Hood, but pursues and sinks Prince of Wales, as well (and possibly Norfolk and Suffolk, too, as they couldn't just stand by and let PoW be pounded to bits). And then U556 has the torpedoes to sink not only Ark Royal but the BC Repulse (Renown?) which was lined up with its stern tubes? And then Bismarck makes it safely into Brest. The shift in the naval balance of power in the Atlantic might well force the British to abandon the Mediterranean entirely and shift its whole fleet to the Atlantic. (And PoW and Repulse don't get sent to Singapore.)
 
We are unsure exactly how much damage there was to the Bismarck, from the cannon hit at the Denmark Straits battle. That affects how long she sits in dry dock at St Nazaire. The longer in dry dock the increase in odds of a aircraft bomb doing damage. Whatever the case the Brits reorganize their fleet operations to deal with a sortie of multiple German surface raiders. Bomber Command may be told their priority is the capitol ships in the French ports. Even if the Brits know the damage to the Bismarck they are not going to let it & its ugly sisters sit at the docks unmolested. The Brits may even transfer some of the T Class subs in the Med to the Atlantic to screen the routes from the French ports.
 
I sometimes muse on what if everything went right for the Germans during the Bismarck sortie? Bismarck sinks not only Hood, but pursues and sinks Prince of Wales

But wouldn't Bismarck have incurred additional damage doing so, forcing it to go back to Norway or Germany? I did a thread on that.
 
But wouldn't Bismarck have incurred additional damage doing so, forcing it to go back to Norway or Germany? I did a thread on that.

..or continue to the dry dock at St Nazaire

While the PoW had problems it was not toothless. The hit on the Bismarck probably was from the PoW. Another lucky hit & the Denmark Strait might have two debris fields.
 
But wouldn't Bismarck have incurred additional damage doing so, forcing it to go back to Norway or Germany? I did a thread on that.
Well, that would have been a much better result for the Germans than what really happened. Two British capital ships gone and Bismarck in a place where it can be repaired in safety.
 
Well, that would have been a much better result for the Germans than what really happened. Two British capital ships gone and Bismarck in a place where it can be repaired in safety.

By that time it was clear that French ports weren't so safe. Look what happened to Scharnhorst.
 
What if.... it had all gone 'right' for Germany on this one?

Could it mean:
No Swedish sighting - meaning Home fleet not knowing that they would be coming out
Bismarck also tops up the fuel tanks.
Norfolk and Suffolk get trapped (as nearly happened I believe) up against the ice pack
PoW does not rupture the fuel tank
PoW gets finished off

… and then the torpedo spread to take out Ark Royal!

It would really be bad luck.

Impossible? not likely after all, but ….

Consequences:
1) What would be sent to Singapore?
2) Home fleet would not look so inviting, but would it be necessary to call on Med to plug the gap?
3) Where would Bismarck go after this? - hit a convoy? go to Brest? Go back to Germany

The list can be fascinating after all

Ivan
 
I sometimes muse on what if everything went right for the Germans during the Bismarck sortie? Bismarck sinks not only Hood, but pursues and sinks Prince of Wales, as well (and possibly Norfolk and Suffolk, too, as they couldn't just stand by and let PoW be pounded to bits). And then U556 has the torpedoes to sink not only Ark Royal but the BC Repulse (Renown?) which was lined up with its stern tubes? And then Bismarck makes it safely into Brest. The shift in the naval balance of power in the Atlantic might well force the British to abandon the Mediterranean entirely and shift its whole fleet to the Atlantic. (And PoW and Repulse don't get sent to Singapore.)

Bloody hell...why go to Brest - while she is on such a roll get her to sail down the channel shoot down the entire RAF sail up the Themes and shell Westminster until the British seek terms.
 
Ah, yes. If no Swedish sighting, then …. But let us be lenient. Let there be the sighting in Norway then.

There are actually a lot of different things in this:

Timing is of essence. Britain had everything on the look-out for Bismarck. Wiki says:
"
To meet the threat from German surface ships, the British had stationed at Scapa Flow the new battleships King George V and Prince of Wales as well as the battlecruiser Hood and the newly commissioned aircraft carrier Victorious. Elsewhere, Force H at Gibraltar could muster the battlecruiser Renown and the aircraft carrier Ark Royal; at sea in the Atlantic on various duties were the battleships Revenge, Rodney and Ramillies and the battlecruiser Repulse. Cruisers and air patrols provided the fleet's 'eyes'. At sea, or due to sail shortly, were 11 convoys, including a troop convoy."

But if Bismarck is sighted late can PoW and Hood get there fast enough? It was a bit touch and go as it were in terms of picking up Bismarck.

So with full tanks and no hole in the bow, Bismarck might have sailed off into the sunset and played havoc with the convoys as sea.

Bismarck could maybe have sailed for the South Atlantic? Shooting up Simonstown in South Africa is not a bad suggestion either (although a bit left-field).

Let us face it: Bismarck had a lot of bad luck and bad decisions. With just a typical venture with a bit of bad luck/good luck on both sides, Bismarck could have got to Brest with a few victories.

Ivan
 
Did Bismarck have fuel to make it there and back to friendly territory, even if her tanks were topped off?


Since the Graf Spee, German warships "at large in the Atlantic" or farther were dependent on supply ships, including tankers, to operate and get back home.
 

CalBear

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Or, and this is as least as likely as the other side of the coin, the hit on Hood does not occur simply because her CO either makes the order to unmask the aft turrets two minutes sooner and that salvo kills water or she has an extra knot of speed on (there is an entire ASB thread predicted on this possibility) and her next salvo puts two shell hits forward on Bismarck, one hit jamming her B Turret the other doing superficial damage to her bows. Bismarck turns away in order to avoid the next salvo and catches four 14" shell from PoW. Her CO decides to open the range a bit, where his guns will have better effect on Hood. As he does so PoW secondary battery finds the range on Prinz Eugen and put fourteen 5.25" shells into her in just over on minute.

Both KM ships decide that they have had a rather rough morning and break off contact. Hood, having been hit earlier and having considerable damage due to the explosion of her ready AAA ammo and resulting fire, and PoW, let them go, pursued by the RN cruisers to provide ongoing location data.

Folks seem to forget that Bismarck was, in fact, quite fortunate to have destroyed the Hood before she and her consorts seriously damaged the German ship.
 
...

Folks seem to forget that Bismarck was, in fact, quite fortunate to have destroyed the Hood before she and her consorts seriously damaged the German ship.

The Hood & its fate have become a sort of modern Greek Tragedy, foreordained and inevitable outcome. The will of the Gods will occur whatever the PoD and variations. The intersection of the projectile and the Hood are built into the very structure of the universe.
 
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Ah, yes. If no Swedish sighting, then …. But let us be lenient. Let there be the sighting in Norway then. ...

Need to read up on this, but the surface ships were using similar Enigma system as the submarines. & their signals security were based on the same false assumptions as the subs were operating under. I'm unsure in there were any Enigma decrypts that warned of the sortie. At least once during the voyage the Bismarck was momentarily located by its radio transmissions.
 
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