WI:the Schlieffen Plan Succeeded?

as you know the schieffen plan was the plan that germany used in world war 1 to knock out the french and invade russia. But it failed due to bad planing and french tenacity it falied.

do you think that the the schieffen plan could have ever worked and if it did what would erope look like afterwards.
 
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Hello Brendan,
As someone pointed out in another thread, you really need to give more context and thought in written form on the forum, it's not the best to just drop a link and ask for opinions, you need to give yours and elaborate :)
 
Hello Brendan,
As someone pointed out in another thread, you really need to give more context and thought in written form on the forum, it's not the best to just drop a link and ask for opinions, you need to give yours and elaborate :)
i,ve tried to fix is it it better.{sorry about the lack of question marks my laptop can,t seem to make them}
 
Can you summarise his analysis and conclusion for the board? I'd prefer not to watch the entirety of the video, and this POD has been discussed quite a lot on this board in the past so I'd be surprised if it hasn't been covered before.
 
i,ve tried to fix is it it better.{sorry about the lack of question marks my laptop can,t seem to make them}
I haven't watched the video but a good thread start would be like this:

"As you may know, the Schlieffen plan was the initial German plan for WWI, which wanted to punch out France before rotating and taking on the Russians.

It failed due to French tenacity, panache and all around being the best nation in the world, but what if it had succeeded? What if Germany had managed to take France out of the war very quickly, as in WWII? I found this video exploring a bit that scenario which got me thinking.

To me it would mean x, y and z, what would be your thoughts?"

Of course, you may want to adjust some things in what I've said but that would be the general idea
 

yourworstnightmare

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The Schlieffen plan was flawed, meant for a very different kind of warfare than WW1, and heavily relied on things like: we will mobilize much faster than the enemy, Belgium will not resist an invasion, and the Russians will mobilize so slow we will take Paris before they're done.
 
The Schlieffen plan was flawed, meant for a very different kind of warfare than WW1, and heavily relied on things like: we will mobilize much faster than the enemy, Belgium will not resist an invasion, and the Russians will mobilize so slow we will take Paris before they're done.


Least we drown in the Red Tide has led me to do some reading on WWI.

The Russians mobilized fast and sloppy.

THe germans had to redirect the 8th army from the West to the East.

I can't find how big that was, but if it was available for use in the West,

Could it have breached the lines and allowed the Germans to actually "knock" France out of the War?
 
I haven't watched the video but a good thread start would be like this:

"As you may know, the Schlieffen plan was the initial German plan for WWI, which wanted to punch out France before rotating and taking on the Russians.

It failed due to French tenacity, panache and all around being the best nation in the world, but what if it had succeeded? What if Germany had managed to take France out of the war very quickly, as in WWII? I found this video exploring a bit that scenario which got me thinking.

To me it would mean x, y and z, what would be your thoughts?"

Of course, you may want to adjust some things in what I've said but that would be the general idea
I thought the British at Mons were an overriding reason for the failure of the Schlieffen Plan.
 
We've had a few threads on this topic over the years.

It was logistically flawed, and very difficult in the circumstances to make it *not* logistically flawed - certainly once the Belgians and the British had decided to fight.
 
I thought the British at Mons were an overriding reason for the failure of the Schlieffen Plan.

Actually the overriding reason was Von Bulow, who insisted on Kluck changing his line of march to stay closer to Bulow's Army, and secondly Von Moltke who overrode Kluck's protest. This resulted in Kluck hitting the BEF head on instead of outflanking them.
 
Or maybe it's theame in. threat of the American entering the war that made the silly Germans piss their lederhosen.

They managed to go on fighting for over eighteen months after the US came in. It was no doubt a blow to morale, but didn't cause it to collapse.
 
That video is pretty shit.

However quite a few things went wrong with Moltkes plan which are easy fixes; Prittwitz's crying and the subsequent stripping of troops already in Belgium to go to East Prussia first and foremost. Without this the plan falls short of the ludicrous dreams but still manages the highly useful tasks of winning the Race to the Sea which tips the balance enough into the CPs favour that they win the war.
 
And if the BEF comes under a flanking attack rather than a frontal one (as it might have done had Bulow or Moltke not forced Kluck to change direction) it probably falls back in a more easterly direction, putt6ing it across Fifth Army's line of retreat. If Lanrezac (as OTL) fails to notify French of his withdrawal, then he finds himself retreating down roads already choked with Tommies. Could set the scene for a western Tannenberg.
 
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