WI: the Patriots lost the American Revolution even with French support?

The British win the American Revolution even though France was heavily supporting the rebels. What would happen? Tell me your mini scenarios down below!
Treaty is Spain doesn't gain Florida, and France pays for Compensation and some other minor stuff
 
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Once France fully joins the fray, then i'm afraid reconquest and recolonization is a foregone conclusion.
Though the british can still keep control of some of the colonies if they win more decisive battles in the late stage of the ARW, such as Georgia, Maine, Vermont, and/or New York City.
(Welcome aboard, anyway)
 
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Once France fully joins the fray, then i'm afraid reconquest and recolonization is a foregone conclusion.
Though the british can still keep control of some of the colonies if they win more decisive battles in the late stage of the ARW, such as Georgia, Maine, Vermont, and/or New York City.
It isn't about how, it's the what if and what happens after Britain wins with French intervention
 
It isn't about how, it's the what if and what happens after Britain wins with French intervention

Easiest way is to make France enter before Saratoga and have that... be a smashing British victory with casualties 3 to 1 favoring the British and Burgoyne landing in Albany triumphant.
 

Anaxagoras

Banned
It isn't about how, it's the what if and what happens after Britain wins with French intervention

Since you are new to AH.com, I'll just let you know that posters will expect you to give specifics of how a certain scenario came to pass, either because that's simply the way it is done or, more practically, because the specifics will greatly impact the later effects.

Welcome to the board, by the way. An interesting scenario.
 

Anaxagoras

Banned
Easiest way is to make France enter before Saratoga and have that... be a smashing British victory with casualties 3 to 1 favoring the British and Burgoyne landing in Albany triumphant.

Well, this then raises the question of why France would enter the war before Saratoga. Moreover, had France entered the war, the Saratoga campaign likely would not have happened at all, since the troops that marched with Burgoyne IOTL would have needed to be diverted to other theaters of war (the Caribbean, in particular) once France enters the conflict.
 
Louis VXI's advisors varied between the cautious and the bellicose. The cautious were mollified when they saw the British get mauled at Saratoga thanks to Burgoyne not being a master tactician (oddly enough many American Historians actually now say he's an above average tactician and leader for his day despite his biggest engagement being a LOSS... anyhow he lost it one way or another). They didn't think about France's finances. Just have the bellicose advisors win when Burgoyne's troops enter New York and it's too late to recall them. Remember the French lost a lot of their Caribbean engagements before the British were able to send troops to their most important theatres (and of course the reinforcements to NA were cancelled because that was the last thing on their minds)
 
France was pretty rapidly looking for a way out of the war once they discovered that the Americans were not in it for a quick victory. The Americans were quite content to just hang around waiting for the British to lose the war. it was a good plan for the Americans but not so much for the French . just have the War go a slight bit worse for the Americans and the French may get sick of spending money when it’s obvious that the Americans aren’t going to be aggressive. Or, you can have the Americans be aggressive and lose.

Even with French support, the war was by no means a sure thing.
 
What will happen? France and Spain go pretty much as otl. Aside from a minor bit of prestige, neither gained much from the war. Spain didn’t do anything with Florida, so it was a rather empty victory.

The changes are going to be for the British. Most likely they face up to reality and allow a good bit of self government.
 
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