WI: The KGB controlled the Labour Party

Most British posters are probably aware of the conspiracy theory that Harold Wilson was a KGB agent - the premise had been transformed into a very successful TL, Agent Lavender.

Allegations have also came up over the years that Michael Foot, another Labour leader, was also an informant for the Soviets, providing them with information up until 1968.

Ignoring the accuracy of these claims, let's imagine that, in an alternate timeline, the KGB is able to establish a web of control over the Labour Party. Soviet agents are able to establish themselves in senior positions within the party, including its leadership. Then, during the 70s, their cover is blown. MI5 are able to unmask the spies and reveal evidence beyond any reasonable doubt that the Labour frontbench is in the pay of the Soviet Government. Perhaps a few MPs flee to Moscow to confirm to any sceptics in the public that the incident is not an 'establishment coup'.

What would the implications of this be?
 
The Labour party will be largely extinct in months and the all but the most radical (or infiltrated) trades unions will be forced to end their support for it. Unfortunately this being the 1970's you are also going to see massive amounts of politically based industrial action from the like of the NUM, NALGO, NUR and other notoriously militant unions with closed shops to return things to the status quo. Their members can't quit because they'd lose their jobs and if they kick up a fuss they get expelled, and lose their jobs.
 
The Labour party will be largely extinct in months and the all but the most radical (or infiltrated) trades unions will be forced to end their support for it. Unfortunately this being the 1970's you are also going to see massive amounts of politically based industrial action from the like of the NUM, NALGO, NUR and other notoriously militant unions with closed shops to return things to the status quo. Their members can't quit because they'd lose their jobs and if they kick up a fuss they get expelled, and lose their jobs.
Could the vacuum left by Labour be filled by more leftist forces like the trostskyist? I mean, the '70s is the era of radicalism and they need a left wing party thats also antisoviet after such a scandal. And unions still need a party of their own, and they are still strong.
 
Considering the Trots were considered extreme by the mainstream Labour party they're not going to pick up much support. Mainstream Labour support is going to pass to the Liberals. The TUC has a serious problem as it to is discredited by the exposure of Soviet control of the Labour Party. The suspicion will be that if the Soviets were controlling Labour then they must also be controlling its Union paymasters. Only the closed shop will prevent the unions haemorrhaging members as it means that resigning from the union is resigning from your job.

One thing to consider is that within weeks of the Soviet involvement being exposed there will be a general election and Labour will be all but wiped out in Parliament. IF it's a Conservative government the motive for calling the election is obvious, they will have a massive majority in the new Parliament. If it's a Labour or Labour led government then the Conservatives will call a vote of no confidence which Labour will lose due the number of their MP's that have either defected or been arrested.
 
The Labour party will be largely extinct in months and the all but the most radical (or infiltrated) trades unions will be forced to end their support for it. Unfortunately this being the 1970's you are also going to see massive amounts of politically based industrial action from the like of the NUM, NALGO, NUR and other notoriously militant unions with closed shops to return things to the status quo. Their members can't quit because they'd lose their jobs and if they kick up a fuss they get expelled, and lose their jobs.
Like protests, that's the kind of thing that's easily squashed in small numbers, but no longer once they reach a certain critical mass.
Imagine if tens of thousands workers decide that enough is enough and refuse to participate in a strike and very publicly leave their union under protest. Imagine further that their employers refusee to fire them and tell the unions where they can shove the closed shop agreement. Police forces protect the scabs from picketers and with the recent relevations they are willing to fight back, if the picketers try to force the issue and have the political backing to do so. If we were talking about just a few, then the unions could just bash in some heads, but not when it's too many and legal proceeding trying to enfore the closed shop "agreements" will take a while. Time enough for the sitting or incoming Tory gouvernment to pass ironclad legislation banning closed shops.
Faced with that prospect some of the militant unions leadership might decide that holding strikes to protect outright traitors, isn't worth facing a revolt from the rank and file.
 
Like protests, that's the kind of thing that's easily squashed in small numbers, but no longer once they reach a certain critical mass.
Imagine if tens of thousands workers decide that enough is enough and refuse to participate in a strike and very publicly leave their union under protest. Imagine further that their employers refusee to fire them and tell the unions where they can shove the closed shop agreement. Police forces protect the scabs from picketers and with the recent relevations they are willing to fight back, if the picketers try to force the issue and have the political backing to do so. If we were talking about just a few, then the unions could just bash in some heads, but not when it's too many and legal proceeding trying to enfore the closed shop "agreements" will take a while. Time enough for the sitting or incoming Tory gouvernment to pass ironclad legislation banning closed shops.
Faced with that prospect some of the militant unions leadership might decide that holding strikes to protect outright traitors, isn't worth facing a revolt from the rank and file.
I agree - if the unions came to the defence of a party which has committed treason, then union discipline would break down en masse.
 
Not Enoch, he was long gone from the Conservative Party. With Labour toxic to the voters and the Conservatives failing the next PM could be David Steel as the Liberals form their first government since the 20's.
 

Deleted member 94680

Early 1970s *thatcherism, although when that fails we'd some new right response. PM Enoch Powell in 1979, maybe.

Unlikely.

Not Enoch, he was long gone from the Conservative Party. With Labour toxic to the voters and the Conservatives failing the next PM could be David Steel as the Liberals form their first government since the 20's.

As to the main premise, OTL the was all but extinct in the ‘70s and ‘80s for a reason. The people just didn’t see that Liberal politics represented their interests. With the Labour Party a dead letter, bar some almighty almost ‘show trial’ shedding of the tainted members, I can see a new Party of Social Democratic bent being formed. Many ‘mainstream’ Labour politicians will cross over (the Left Wing of Labour will be dead in the water, anyhow) and it will likely be dominated by ‘centrist’ socialist politicians for a decade at least. Roy Jenkins and the like.

The name would be an interesting choice though...
 
As to the main premise, OTL the was all but extinct in the ‘70s and ‘80s for a reason. The people just didn’t see that Liberal politics represented their interests. With the Labour Party a dead letter, bar some almighty almost ‘show trial’ shedding of the tainted members, I can see a new Party of Social Democratic bent being formed. Many ‘mainstream’ Labour politicians will cross over (the Left Wing of Labour will be dead in the water, anyhow) and it will likely be dominated by ‘centrist’ socialist politicians for a decade at least. Roy Jenkins and the like.

The name would be an interesting choice though...

I wouldn't write the Liberals off. If there is time for the dust to settle after the initial arrests then, yes, an alt-SDP is the most likely candidate to replace Labour. But if Parliament is dissolved immediately after the KGB's cover is blown, then there simply might not be time for moderate Labour MPs to make a move. In that case, the inevitable knee-jerk reaction amongst the electorate would benefit the Liberals more than any other third party, and they'd stand the best chance of forming HM's Most Loyal Opposition.

Of course, it would be a fairly ineffective opposition given that the Conservatives would no doubt have a majority Stanley Baldwin would be proud of, but an opposition nonetheless.
 
There was long TL on the idea of the of Harold Wilson being a KGB mole a while back but for the life of me I can't remember the title.
 

Deleted member 94680

I wouldn't write the Liberals off. If there is time for the dust to settle after the initial arrests then, yes, an alt-SDP is the most likely candidate to replace Labour. But if Parliament is dissolved immediately after the KGB's cover is blown, then there simply might not be time for moderate Labour MPs to make a move.

That’s not how British politics work. If “parliament is dissolved” then there will be a General Election and the ex-Labour politicians will have all the time in the world to prepare.


In that case, the inevitable knee-jerk reaction amongst the electorate would benefit the Liberals more than any other third party, and they'd stand the best chance of forming HM's Most Loyal Opposition.

The knee-jerk might well be to lean towards the Liberals, but given even a modicum of time they will return to the Labourite party (whoever that may be) that has always supported their interests.

Of course, it would be a fairly ineffective opposition given that the Conservatives would no doubt have a majority Stanley Baldwin would be proud of, but an opposition nonetheless.

Given time, by-elections will wither the majority and short of further scandals the Left party will regain most of its support.

There was long TL on the idea of the of Harold Wilson being a KGB mole a while back but for the life of me I can't remember the title.

That’s the Agent Lavender TL referenced in the OP I think.

EDIT: Its this one I think - https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/agent-lavender-the-flight-of-harold-wilson.261475/
 
That’s not how British politics work. If “parliament is dissolved” then there will be a General Election and the ex-Labour politicians will have all the time in the world to prepare.
In three weeks? Britain's not the US where an election campaign lasts months. Parliament's dissolved and the campaign starts, three weeks later on Thursday the election is held. This will be a snap election with no warning.
 
That’s not how British politics work. If “parliament is dissolved” then there will be a General Election and the ex-Labour politicians will have all the time in the world to prepare.
I am aware that Parliament being dissolved will trigger a general election but considering that:
(1) As @Peg Leg Pom has outlined, general election campaigns are only a few weeks long,
(2) Any candidates will need to file their nomination papers within the first week of the campaign, and
(3) The ex-Labour MPs will be lacking in donors, activists and a brand (although admittedly setting up a party was much easier in the 70s/80s than it is now).
I'd say that the odds are still stacked against them.
 

Thomas1195

Banned
There could be a Red Scare in Britain ITTL, given the fact that the Soviets managed to thoroughly infiltrated even the highest ranks of the Labour Party and government. Even the unions would not avoided being suspected. I would not rule out McCarthy/J.E.Hoover-style witch hunts towards the Left.

The outcome could range from:
Best case scenario: the traditional left manages to regain their position in another form/party and to win elections again at some point.
Worst case scenario: socialism/social democrats/labour bla bla being thoroughly vilified/discredited/suppressed like in the US. In this case the Liberals would gain big time.
 
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(3) The ex-Labour MPs will be lacking in donors, activists and a brand (although admittedly setting up a party was much easier in the 70s/80s than it is now).
I'd say that the odds are still stacked against them.
Also Party Political Broadcasts on TV are assigned based on the number of candidates standing for a party. If ex Labour MP's are standing as either independents or candidates for very hastily organised parties they're not going to be assigned any. They'll be hampered by running fragmented campaigns on a local basis in the face of national campaigns run by the Conservatives and Liberals vilifying the Labour Party and its former MP's as a nest of traitors.
 
Then the non-KGB members of Labour leave and create a new party that replaces Labour, though of course it’ll be a rocky road for the Totally-Not-Labour Party to gain legitimacy and have new and effective political leadership.
 
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