WI the General Franco's military coup againts the spanish Republic succeeds?

If the military coup succeeds in a few weeks instead of triggering a civil war, will a fascist Spain join the Axis in WWII? will spanish army and mineral resources change the result of the war?
 
A Mola Spain wouldn't really do much except tie the Western Allies in liberating it after Overlord instead of going directly for Berlin. This outcome is far more likely to end Fascist rule in Spain decades ahead of schedule, and we might just end up with a third Spanish Republic instead of a resurgent Kingdom of Spain as per OTL.

Bear in mind was that what did the Axis in was lack of resources, that won't change with Spain on their side as opposed to neutral.
 

nbcman

Donor
May be Mola. Sanjurjo died july 20th. At the end the result is a fascist Spain.
If there is no SCW with a Nationalist Spain, General Sanjuro wouldn't have to take his doomed flight from Portugal where he was exiled. He would probably have reentered Spain in a more leisurely fashion sometime after the military coup succeeded.
 
A Mola Spain wouldn't really do much except tie the Western Allies in liberating it after Overlord instead of going directly for Berlin. This outcome is far more likely to end Fascist rule in Spain decades ahead of schedule, and we might just end up with a third Spanish Republic instead of a resurgent Kingdom of Spain as per OTL.

Bear in mind was that what did the Axis in was lack of resources, that won't change with Spain on their side as opposed to neutral.

Wouldn't a belligerent Spain seize Gibraltar and cut off Royal Navy access to the Western Mediterranean?
 
Wouldn't a belligerent Spain seize Gibraltar and cut off Royal Navy access to the Western Mediterranean?
You don't need to seize Gibraltar. Just build a set of artillery bunkers in Tarifa and with Ceuta, you can cut the Gibraltar strait.
 

nbcman

Donor
You don't need to seize Gibraltar. Just build a set of artillery bunkers in Tarifa and with Ceuta, you can cut the Gibraltar strait.
Why? If there was no SCW, why would the Nationalist government feel any need to enter the war on behalf of Germany and Italy? They wouldn't have needed significant military aid from Germany and Italy prior to the start of WW2 - so why are they risking their foreign trade to help the Germans / Italians? Fascists are not a hivemind.
 
Why? If there was no SCW, why would the Nationalist government feel any need to enter the war on behalf of Germany and Italy? They wouldn't have needed significant military aid from Germany and Italy prior to the start of WW2 - so why are they risking their foreign trade to help the Germans / Italians? Fascists are not a hivemind.
Franco can make the same request as he do in Hendaye in 1940 but without asking for German supplies of petrol, arms and food because they are not needed as Spain avoided a civil war and Spanish economy was not destroyed. Spain will ask for Gibraltar and French colonies in Africa.
 

nbcman

Donor
Franco can make the same request as he do in Hendaye in 1940 but without asking for German supplies of petrol, arms and food because they are not needed as Spain avoided a civil war and Spanish economy was not destroyed. Spain will ask for Gibraltar and French colonies in Africa.
Assuming Hitler and the Nationalist leader meet in Hendaye at all. If the Germans don't gain experience on creating their combined arms doctrine during the SCW, it is not a sure thing that the Germans will be able to beat the French. Also, the Italians may not be as pro-German without their joint SCW experience. There are too many butterflies for a no SCW TL to predict the same Battle of France or the same kick-off to WW2 in Europe.
 
Assuming Hitler and the Nationalist leader meet in Hendaye at all. If the Germans don't gain experience on creating their combined arms doctrine during the SCW, it is not a sure thing that the Germans will be able to beat the French. Also, the Italians may not be as pro-German without their joint SCW experience. There are too many butterflies for a no SCW TL to predict the same Battle of France or the same kick-off to WW2 in Europe.

If anything, Mussolini might very well try to pursue a "Latin Bloc" strategy with Spain and Portugal and leverage their position as a potential decisive weight on the Franco-British vs. German balance to gain concessions in the Balkans (A wink and a nod in Yugoslavia, privlaged position in Austria which has the added benefit of hedging against German expansion, ect.)
 
IF the coup succeeds there has been a German airlift of troops from Morocco but no Italian corps involved? Germany might at least have inside track to set up a Spanish air force.

seems MORE likely they might stumble into WWII but still UNLIKELY. have no decided view of Gen. Sanjuro other than the fact he had a rather elevated view of himself, Franco was considered the most cautious of the coup leaders.

ONE thing would change, Spain retains the world's fourth largest gold reserves, which were sent to the USSR historically.
 

Cook

Banned
...which were sent to the USSR historically.

Jew-Joseph-Stalin.jpg


"Gold, what gold? Don't know what you are talking about."
 
You don't need to seize Gibraltar. Just build a set of artillery bunkers in Tarifa and with Ceuta, you can cut the Gibraltar strait.
That's very plausible because one thing that the Spanish armed forces had plenty of IOTL was coast artillery. Follow this link and have a close look at the maps at the bottom of the page.

http://www.elgrancapitan.org/foro/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=17045&start=210

The map of the coast artillery around the Strait of Gibraltar includes two 15" guns. According to the following link on Naval Weapons Spain purchased 18 of them 1929-35. With no SCW ITTL they might buy a few more.

http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNSpain_15-45_mkB.php

This is a link to a webpage about one of the 15in guns that defended Port Mahon in Menorca
https://armourersbench.com/tag/15-inch-vickers-naval-gun/
 
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raharris1973

Gone Fishin'
Donor
Monthly Donor
A Mola Spain wouldn't really do much except tie the Western Allies in liberating it after Overlord instead of going directly for Berlin. This outcome is far more likely to end Fascist rule in Spain decades ahead of schedule, and we might just end up with a third Spanish Republic instead of a resurgent Kingdom of Spain as per OTL.

Bear in mind was that what did the Axis in was lack of resources, that won't change with Spain on their side as opposed to neutral.

Why is this Spain in the war?
 
If anything, Mussolini might very well try to pursue a "Latin Bloc" strategy with Spain and Portugal and leverage their position as a potential decisive weight on the Franco-British vs. German balance to gain concessions in the Balkans (A wink and a nod in Yugoslavia, privileged position in Austria which has the added benefit of hedging against German expansion, etc.)
Might a successful coup and therefore no Spanish Civil War result in a better Italian performance in World War II?

AFAIK the Italian aid to the Nationalists consumed a large amount of money that might have otherwise been spent on modernising the Italian armed forces or improving the transport infrastructure in Libya and Italian East Africa.
 
A successful coup would almost definitely still have a civil war, though more localized to regions in the east. They're still overthrowing the elected government when there's been around four anarchist uprisings by this time- now they would have legitimate reason to rise up and popular support, so there'd almost definitely still be a civil war of some form.
 
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