WI: The French tried to intermarry with, Frenchifry, and Catholicize the Algerians?

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Baby Kata

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In our timeline, the French tried settling Frenchmen in Algeria, and it ended badly for them. What if the French had, in addition to settling their people, had tried to convert the Algerians linguistically and religiously, and intermarry with them. (Akin to what was done to the Mesoamerican Indians)
 
They tried to convert the Algerians IOTL; they got almost no converts to Catholicism.

Intermarrying with Algerians would result in having to give Arabs an ability to move up the racial hierarchy of Algeria, something the settlers vociferously opposed.
 

Baby Kata

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They tried to convert the Algerians IOTL; they got almost no converts to Catholicism.

Intermarrying with Algerians would result in having to give Arabs an ability to move up the racial hierarchy of Algeria, something the settlers vociferously opposed.

I wonder why the Algerians would refuse a chance to become Christian? Makes little sense to me.

How were the Europeans able to convert lots of Africans further south, then?
 
I wonder why the Algerians would refuse a chance to become Christian? Makes little sense to me.

I mean, there's the piety, deep interweaving of the faith into their cultural identity and practices, and the structure Islam provided to social mores and ruled. Structured religions tend to make those conditions, and are harder to convert from since it nessecitates alienating oneself from the general society and radically changing behavior.

How were the Europeans able to convert lots of Africans further south, then

The native African traditions were alot less concrete and intertwined with secular authority and traditional structure of daily life. It's alot easier to blend Christianity or at least aspects of it into a pagan beleif structure so the social and personal cost to conversion is lower
 
I wonder why the Algerians would refuse a chance to become Christian? Makes little sense to me.

The Algerians would probably say the same about you failing to convert to Islam. It seems that, as an evangelical religion based on a written scripture, Islam is quite sticky and is able to cultivate loyalty even in an environment where it is suppressed. Buddhism, Judaism and for that matter Christianity have pulled the same or a similar trick.

How were the Europeans able to convert lots of Africans further south, then?
Partly, they weren't; Senegal, Niger, Chad, etc. are deeply Muslim. Cote d'Ivoire, Benin, Congo-Brazza and Guinea Equateur had people who followed traditional religions which were largely based on ethnic affiliations and did not have written scripture, and these seem to be generally less immune than the religions I described above to conversion. Why, I don't know, and it would probably take a few volumes of books on religious theory to even begin discussing it, but it seems that as a meme these religions aren't quite as effective as propogating themselves. Even then though, traditional religions still have a lot of adherents, perhaps most famously with Benin's vodoun practices.

EDIT: Rather than reading volumes of textbooks, I guess you could read the post above mine.
 

Baby Kata

Banned
I mean, there's the piety, deep interweaving of the faith into their cultural identity and practices, and the structure Islam provided to social mores and ruled. Structured religions tend to make those conditions, and are harder to convert from since it nessecitates alienating oneself from the general society and radically changing behavior.

Christianity can provide just as much social structure, and has an extremely rich cultural and theological tradition.
 
Christianity can provide just as much social structure, and has an extremely rich cultural and theological tradition.

I think the simple answer is that it's not *their* cultural wealth. Whatever benefits it provides seems alien, they would be at the bottom of the social structure they are converting too as well, so the loss of social structure would be bewildering and not worth the cost for them.
 

Baby Kata

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I think the simple answer is that it's not *their* cultural wealth. Whatever benefits it provides seems alien, they would be at the bottom of the social structure they are converting too as well, so the loss of social structure would be bewildering and not worth the cost for them.

Not if the French ruled with a heavier hand and said something like "Christians are at the top of the social pyramid"
 

Baby Kata

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The Algerians would probably say the same about you failing to convert to Islam. It seems that, as an evangelical religion based on a written scripture, Islam is quite sticky and is able to cultivate loyalty even in an environment where it is suppressed. Buddhism, Judaism and for that matter Christianity have pulled the same or a similar trick.

France could have done an Inquisitionesqe thing in Algeria, like Spain did in Iberia.
 

SwampTiger

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Which resulted in the expulsion of the Moriscos from Spain when the Inquisition didn't work. Where will you send the Algerians?
 
They tried to convert the Algerians IOTL; they got almost no converts to Catholicism.

The main role of the Catholic missionaries was actually to educate the European population (many of whom were not of French origin) and assimilate them into French society. Converting the native Algerians was not a major focus. (Later the educational system became secularised.)
 
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Baby Kata

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The main role of the Catholic missionaries was actually to educate the European population (many of whom were not of French origin) and assimilate them into French society. Converting the native Algerians was not a major focus. (Later the educational system became secularised.)

What other countries were they from?
 
What other countries were they from?

Besides France, many came from Spain, Italy and Malta.

But the French can prevent apostates from being punished, since they were in charge.

Often, Europeans weren't fully in charge in these territories and depended on the support of local elites. In Muslim areas they were therefore careful about evangelizing as this could offend their supporters. They concentrated missionary efforts in animist areas.
 
It's a shame that they were ethnically cleansed when France left. Algeria would be a better place today if they were still there.
Doubt it, to much tensions between the different peoples. At best they would become a minority people and at worst it could become another Apartheid. (I’m not condoning ethnic cleansing, I’m just point out how the hatred wouldn’t just go away when the colonial overlords leave)
 
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