WI: Swift Defeat of American Revolution

The ability to retreat from an untenable position, and move your army through unfriendly territory with no meaningful losses of men, materiel or morale, is damned rare. He did do badly on offense, but on defense, the world wouldn't see Washington's like again until Ho Chi Minh. And given that the enemy base was on the other side of the Atlantic, an offensive genius would have had little value to the rebels.
 
Boston isn't going peacably. Even if a major British victory early in the war caused most of the rebels in New York, Philadelphia and Virginia to lose heart, pacifying New England is going to be a long, expensive and bloody process.

Same with the Carolinas and Georgia, for different reasons. The British deployed no troops there until 1778 - by which point all the Loyalists had been brutalised into submission. Cornwallis arrived in Charleston expecting to be hailed as a liberator, and instead found that the "Loyal South" regarded him as too little, too late. This victory isn't likely to change that dynamic (especially if Howe retains overall command. Howe deliberately delayed basically everything, because he found it abominable to be commanded to fight "fellow Englishmen").

General Finley has a good TL on the matter, you might have a look :) He has the second rebellion in the middle of the Napoleonic Wars, under Andrew Jackson. 1830s over slavery is also a sound possibility. As to who would be hanged - Hancock, Sam Adams, perhaps a couple of others, but a swift victory makes the Brits less likely to try and salt the earth.
Ok, so I think we've established that even if the militia gets broken victory won't be as swift as I expected, especially in New England. This makes for an even more interesting setup IMO, so I'm going to amend that into my outline.

As for the south, I'm wondering if there would be significant backlash against the loyalists if the revolution degenerates into an insurgency by 1777 or so. Recalling that the main battles of the early war were all up north, I can't really see any spark that'd bring the war south and make the patriot/loyalist divide a readily-apparent thing.

I've worked out a list of important people and what their fates under my proposed TL would be, which I'll post next with explanations. Feel free to critique and give input.
 
This is a partial list of important figures in the Continental Congress and American Revolution in general, with the fates I think they would receive under my TL. Any critique or input is greatly appreciated.

George Washington: executed by firing squad
John Hancock: hanged for treason
Samuel Adams: hanged for treason
Thomas Paine: sentenced to hang, commuted to deportation. Possibly ends up in West Indies, not sure however.
Benjamin Franklin: tried and sentenced to hang, offered pardon in exchange for a renunciation of the revolution and oath of loyalty to the Crown which he declines.
Thomas Jefferson: hanged for treason
Israel Putnam: taken prisoner during Bunker Hill but paroled. Ends up leading an expedition out west of the Proclamation Line postwar.
 

FDW

Banned
You'd see some continued underground rebellion during the 1780's and 1790's that would accompanied by waves of Voortrekkers trying to get away from the British. Then, when the British Empire decides to get rid of slavery and/or get involved in some big ass war sometime in the 19th Century, you'll American Revolution II: Bigger, Badder, and Uncut.
 
As for the south, I'm wondering if there would be significant backlash against the loyalists if the revolution degenerates into an insurgency by 1777 or so. Recalling that the main battles of the early war were all up north, I can't really see any spark that'd bring the war south and make the patriot/loyalist divide a readily-apparent thing.
And yet, it was astonishingly bloody in OTL despite the lack of redcoats. The real issue is whether or not to respect the land claims of the Indians as recognized by Great Britain; "Rebels" wanted to ignore the law and expand west, "Loyalists" didn't, and Georgian killed Georgian and Carolinian killed Carolinian until the matter was "settled" in favor of the Rebels. The inhabitants of the three southernmost colonies butchered their neighbors for two years, in a way that was very uncommon up north where there was a British army to fight.

I recommend "A Few Bloody Noses" by Robert Harvey if you can find a copy.
 
And yet, it was astonishingly bloody in OTL despite the lack of redcoats. The real issue is whether or not to respect the land claims of the Indians as recognized by Great Britain; "Rebels" wanted to ignore the law and expand west, "Loyalists" didn't, and Georgian killed Georgian and Carolinian killed Carolinian until the matter was "settled" in favor of the Rebels. The inhabitants of the three southernmost colonies butchered their neighbors for two years, in a way that was very uncommon up north where there was a British army to fight.

I recommend "A Few Bloody Noses" by Robert Harvey if you can find a copy.
They definitely did not mention that in school, thanks. I'll have to check that book out if my university library has a copy.
 

archaeogeek

Banned
This is a partial list of important figures in the Continental Congress and American Revolution in general, with the fates I think they would receive under my TL. Any critique or input is greatly appreciated.

George Washington: executed by firing squad
John Hancock: hanged for treason
Samuel Adams: hanged for treason
Thomas Paine: sentenced to hang, commuted to deportation. Possibly ends up in West Indies, not sure however.
Benjamin Franklin: tried and sentenced to hang, offered pardon in exchange for a renunciation of the revolution and oath of loyalty to the Crown which he declines.
Thomas Jefferson: hanged for treason
Israel Putnam: taken prisoner during Bunker Hill but paroled. Ends up leading an expedition out west of the Proclamation Line postwar.

I suspect a lot would end up in France, as historically tended to happen with people the british state did not like too much.
 
I suspect a lot would end up in France, as historically tended to happen with people the british state did not like too much.
Is France really going to take a bunch of radical republicans though? The French Revolution isn't going to butterfly itself away in this TL barring any massive reforms which would be out of the character of French monarchs who clung to Divine Right to the last, so the powder keg of the third estate will still be there. They might do it to spite the British but just imagine what a 1790s reprint of Common Sense in French might accomplish...
 

archaeogeek

Banned
Is France really going to take a bunch of radical republicans though? The French Revolution isn't going to butterfly itself away in this TL barring any massive reforms which would be out of the character of French monarchs who clung to Divine Right to the last, so the powder keg of the third estate will still be there. They might do it to spite the British but just imagine what a 1790s reprint of Common Sense in French might accomplish...

Considering that Paine was a member of the national assembly, and had moved a few months before the revolution IIRC, I'm going to go with a "they'll handle it".
 
Considering that Paine was a member of the national assembly, and had moved a few months before the revolution IIRC, I'm going to go with a "they'll handle it".
Very well. Paris shall have its vibrant community of American expats a few years early I daresay.
 

archaeogeek

Banned
Very well. Paris shall have its vibrant community of American expats a few years early I daresay.

Some of them would probably fit in with the coffee shop crowd (and yes there was already coffee shop politicking; one story of the time had Camille Desmoulins launching an impassioned call for revolution while jumping on a coffee shop table, brandishing a pair of pistols).
 
No, but providing it happens early on, American nationalism will probably only be held by a diehard minority, especially if London reacts sensibly by addressing the pre-war concerns rather than jamming the Hessian boot down reflexively. It could get troubled in the future but we're not talking Ireland territory here.

I am going to suggest that OTL's British policy during the period does not suggest sensible reaction.

well it does, but it's sensible in the sense that the colonies were not considered free, equal Englishmen.
 

archaeogeek

Banned
I am going to suggest that OTL's British policy during the period does not suggest sensible reaction.

well it does, but it's sensible in the sense that the colonies were not considered free, equal Englishmen.

And that its foreign policy was entirely based on victory disease, even when Britain was defeated horribly.
 
If they do react sensibly, of course, then things will work out okay. The problem is getting them to do so instead of behaving as if BNA was a giant version of Scotland or Ireland or some such.

Um, British policy in Scotland and Ireland was completely different. They didn't even have the same constitutional status (part of the kingdom versus kingdom in personal union). What's "somesuch"?
 
Regarding 'fates' - Paine has to hang, he was a low-level troublemaker and already persona non-grata in Britain. Franklin gets a 'pass' for his prestige and ends up a boulevardier in Paris without any influence. Some of the other local military leaders and DoI signers are executed or imprisoned, others fade back into their local societies. I seriously doubt there would be any proto-revolutionary clique hanging around Paris pst 1776.
Regarding France - one of the most critical financial drains leading to the financial crisis in 1788-89 was the enormous costs the French incurred supporting the revolution and fighting a world war against GB concurrently with the ARW. Butterfly those costs away as well as the influence of a succesful Jeffersonian-Franklin independence movement and the ancien regime probably staggers on for a while longer. The beastly climate of 1788-89 and the subsequent food crisis is a challenge for the ancien regime, but not as severe as the challenges faced in 1709 - 1710.
 
Top