WI: Stalin Dead

[ManchesterLad]

Right, this has always been on my mind for quite a while. After the first few months of world war two, Ruso-German relations were quite cool. Both knew a war would not start tomorrow, but still knew one would start in the future. but anyway, i digress.
What if, in late May 1941, Hitler asks Stalin over for talks over the future of their respective spheres of influence, and the high ranking soviet generals (if any are left) are also invited to discuss plans with their German equivalents. With me so far? good. okay so what if, on this fateful day/weekend whatever, the german's decide to kill the visiting soviets or at least detain them. What affect would this have on the eventual war between the two countries? would it strengthen soviet resolve? or without their figurehead and generals would they crumble? or is it the case that it is far too ASB to have them all in Germany at the same time and i'm talking a load of bollocks?

 

[Dan]

Stalin wouldn't go, he would fear a trap, however, Molotov, Zhukov and some of the other higher ups would go in his place. It woudl have to look like an accident, (the NKVD were good at staging "accidents" so would know what to look for, unless the Germans were very good).
That said, if they did it just before WWII, and used say a stolen Polish fighter plane, (if JG200 existed pre war), then it could kind of work and make Poland a very isolated victim.

 

[Sir Chaos]

Right, this has always been on my mind for quite a while. After the first few months of world war two, Ruso-German relations were quite cool. Both knew a war would not start tomorrow, but still knew one would start in the future. but anyway, i digress.
What if, in late May 1941, Hitler asks Stalin over for talks over the future of their respective spheres of influence, and the high ranking soviet generals (if any are left) are also invited to discuss plans with their German equivalents. With me so far? good. okay so what if, on this fateful day/weekend whatever, the german's decide to kill the visiting soviets or at least detain them. What affect would this have on the eventual war between the two countries? would it strengthen soviet resolve? or without their figurehead and generals would they crumble? or is it the case that it is far too ASB to have them all in Germany at the same time and i'm talking a load of bollocks?

Not sure Stalin et al would go for that, as said before Stalin´s kind of paranoid.

What might perhaps work is sending a military/diplomatic delegation to Moscow which actually consists of Skorzeny´s handpicked special forces people in disguise, who assissante Stalin and however else they can get.

 

[Grey Wolf]

Not sure Stalin et al would go for that, as said before Stalin´s kind of paranoid.

What might perhaps work is sending a military/diplomatic delegation to Moscow which actually consists of Skorzeny´s handpicked special forces people in disguise, who assissante Stalin and however else they can get.

Except Skorzeny's handpicked special forces didn't exist at that date

The Germans allegedly offed the Tsar of Bulgaria in a similar way

Did Stalin travel much outside the USSR? I honestly don't know - he was at Teheran and Potsdam, but both were contiguous to Soviet held territory. Did he go to Casablanca?

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

 

[whitton]

Stalin

Except Skorzeny's handpicked special forces didn't exist at that date

The Germans allegedly offed the Tsar of Bulgaria in a similar way

Did Stalin travel much outside the USSR? I honestly don't know - he was at Teheran and Potsdam, but both were contiguous to Soviet held territory. Did he go to Casablanca?

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

Stalin never left the Soviet Union which was one reason for Churchill's staying at the top table after 1942 despite British exhaustion. He was the one leader travelling everywhere for the duration. From Washington to Moscow to Teheran.

 

[Adam]

Except Skorzeny's handpicked special forces didn't exist at that date

The Germans allegedly offed the Tsar of Bulgaria in a similar way

Did Stalin travel much outside the USSR? I honestly don't know - he was at Teheran and Potsdam, but both were contiguous to Soviet held territory. Did he go to Casablanca?

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

Nope, he never traveled much aside from the occassional trip to his dachas or the Teheran/Potsdam conferences. Too paranoid a man he was. Though I believe in the 30s he went on a fishing trip in Georgia (IIRC) and almost got shot by a huntsman.

 

[Urban fox]

This might help the Red Army if a delegation included some of Stalin’s incompetent old guard like Kulik and Voroshilov, we might see better men promoted earlier Zhukov etc wernt a top commanders at this point.

There's no way Stalin himself hops on the train to Nazi-land, and even if there was a meeting in a neutral meeting place there's a good chance Hitler sets shot in the sudden fire-fight.

 

[ManchesterLad]

Except Skorzeny's handpicked special forces didn't exist at that date

The Germans allegedly offed the Tsar of Bulgaria in a similar way

Did Stalin travel much outside the USSR? I honestly don't know - he was at Teheran and Potsdam, but both were contiguous to Soviet held territory. Did he go to Casablanca?

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

but even so, they could set one up and make it happen. they could even bribe soviet troops to do it in one of his many military parades. or were guns not loaded at such events.