WI: Soviets overrun Poland - 1921

NotYetRegistered

So, the Soviets were poised to overrun Poland under the leadership of Tukhachevsky, but the Poles cracked the Soviet communication system and turned them miraculously back at the Battle of Warsaw, thus forcing the Soviets to abandon their expansionist plans.

I read that Lenin was planning on pushing into Germany and the Baltic countries, spreading good old revolution. If the Poles hadn't held back the Soviets, how far would they have gotten? Would they have been stopped by the Allies quickly or was there a real chance that they could've turned Germany and maybe France red?
 
Kitiem3000

Kitiem3000

Donor
There was a good timeline about exactly that scenario; What If The Red Army Captures Warsaw in 1920.

I myself never believed they had any chance to conquer more then Poland, if they even managed that. They might have made some inroads into Germany. But even handicapped Germany could've stopped the Soviets. And Britain and France never would've let Germany get overrun. Well, Britain wouldn't have stood for it.
Doubtlessly the Soviets attack every other country within sight as well, further making life difficult for themselves. They had a tendency to overreach.


 

LostCosmonaut

Might lead to some of the restrictions on Germany's military restrictions being lifted, if the West is concerned about Soviet aggression.

French would bitch about that, though.
 

AdanALW

Banned
In the Soviet's mind, Poland was historically part of Russian territory, so they had a stake in reclaiming it. However, Germany is another question, considering then they would be going beyond their historical borders. They might have felt that such a move would be risky and have little chance of holding up in argument with other Europeans powers, and opne themselves up to another war so soon after the Russian Civil War.

Considering the shape Russia was in after the Civil War, they'd be crazy to take Germany on again so quickly after their defeat to Germany in World War I. More likely, they would have helped create/supply and army proxy fighters in Germany as payback.
 

MrHaakwood

Another possiblity is that the SU now supports the Communists in Germany, meaning a possible Civil War in Germany.
 
Alex Richards

Alex Richards

Donor
There was certainly a faction within the Poltiburo who wanted to carry on to Berlin and beyond- Trotsky for example was a supporter of carrying the revolution forward- but I'm not exactly certain how far Lenin was part of it, and certainly don't think they'd have been able to implement it.
 

Saladan

from what I've read, Warsaw was the logistical end of the Soviet's force projection at that point. Several years of a grueling and costly world war, combined with two revolutions and a major civil war had basically gutted Russian industry, agriculture, and other resources. Heck that's one reason why they failed to even take the city in the first place. Assuming they do manage to win and hold it, then I still doubt they'd have the resources left to overrun the rest of Poland or at least anything past Poland.

If they do manage to win Warsaw and overrun the rest of Poland, then I can actually see them start to quickly fold as the demands of holding so much territory while lacking any of the resources needed to starts to really get to them. You might end up with a Germany that gets to keep it's eastern borders or potentially a Polish puppet.
 

AdanALW

Banned
Saladan said:
from what I've read, Warsaw was the logistical end of the Soviet's force projection at that point. Several years of a grueling and costly world war, combined with two revolutions and a major civil war had basically gutted Russian industry, agriculture, and other resources. Heck that's one reason why they failed to even take the city in the first place. Assuming they do manage to win and hold it, then I still doubt they'd have the resources left to overrun the rest of Poland or at least anything past Poland.
Click to expand...
Which is why Trotsky fell out of favor and Lenin and Stalin abandoned such an adventurist position.
 
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