WI: South Africa reintroduces slavery and becomes a pariah state like North Korea

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No.

This can be possible given a nuclear exchange between NATO and the Comintern, thus allowing South Africa to regress beyond belief. A post-atomic dictatorship instituting a form of slavery or serfdom can be implemented under the guise of survival.
Apartheid South Africa surviving nuclear war (Which will likely lead to a revolution by the oppressed blacks) is even more ASB.
 
No.

This can be possible given a nuclear exchange between NATO and the Comintern, thus allowing South Africa to regress beyond belief. A post-atomic dictatorship instituting a form of slavery or serfdom can be implemented under the guise of survival.

Then you can handwave almost any silly POD, by saying 'NUKES'.

Somebody says 'WI: Unicorns suddenyl become common in the UK in the 1960s?'

People reply and say this should go to ASBs. But the counter-argument is that a nuclear exchange between the West and the Warsaw Pact leads to mutations among the horses of the UK, which grow horns, and thus become unicorns.

A nuclear exchange between the West and the Soviet-aligned countries could well lead to South Africans deciding to work together. Nobody expected a peaceful end to apartheid, and that's (;argely) what we got in OTL, when people decided to work together for the greater good.
 
A rump white-dominated South Africa along the Oranjerivier or the majority Afrikaans areas can hold off with slavery.

By majority-Afrikaans do you mean majority-white? At the end of apartheid I think there was only one magisterial district which had a white majority.

And you're speaking English, so it's called the Orange River, not the Oranjerivier?

But the question must again be raised - why would white South Africans think slavery is a good idea? And why would the majority-black population meekly accept becoming slaves?
 
A nuclear exchange between the West and the Soviet-aligned countries could well lead to South Africans deciding to work together. Nobody expected a peaceful end to apartheid, and that's (;argely) what we got in OTL, when people decided to work together for the greater good.

But they can also not work together as well. Wouldn't there be a slim chance of the whites and the non-whites to not work together ? Yes, plausibility would push for a post-Apartheid South Africa, but in any possible outcome after, say, a nuclear exchange, wouldn't there also be the slimmest of chance that working together wouldn't work.
 
So, basically the only idea that is barely in the same solar system as an idea that could be called plausible, that people have come up with for South Africa reinstituting slavery, is a nuclear World War III which also magically makes white South Africans turn into Nazis-crossed-with-Confederates, but only less pleasant.
 
I guess slavery would work after a nuclear exchange, albeit for a month at most before said slave owning remnant of the Apartheid regime is promptly destroyed.
 
So, basically the only idea that is barely in the same solar system as an idea that could be called plausible, that people have come up with for South Africa reinstituting slavery, is a nuclear World War III which also magically makes white South Africans turn into Nazis-crossed-with-Confederates, but only less pleasant.

It's not PLAUSIBLE. But is it POSSIBLE ? Plausibility have gone down the drain already, but possibility in some other universe out there, this can happen, albeit with the slimmest chance of possibility.
 

missouribob

Banned
I posed the question to @missouribob about what the actual POD would be, and which individuals would be behind the reintroduction of slavery but he (perhaps unsurprisingly) declined to respond.

The apartheid government was bad, very bad, but they weren't literal Nazis.

As I have said, this thread should be in ASBs.

I didn't respond because I live in a different timezone and have a job...
I don't have a list of individuals that would indorse slavery. I have a list of scenarios that would increase the chance that slavery would occur. I think that if South Africa experienced a black uprising that whites were able to suppress that slavery of at least some of the population would be a real possibility. It is hard to say who would advocate that or that such a situation would even be meant to be. My argument is literally this:

South Africa undergoes a black revolt
South Africa's white leaders and population become more reactionary. They suppress the revolt.
SOME and only SOME of South Africa's blacks become slaves in the post revolt.

It really isn't that unlikely. They might not call it slavery...but how they would treat a lot of blacks would be slavery. So my counter question is do you think that South Africa couldn't have undergone a revolt or insurrection by blacks? I ask not in combativeness but because I don't know much of South African history.
 
My point still stands. Whether it's de jure or de facto, millions of people are in slavery today, and no one's talking about invading.

That is because no one can totally stop criminals from breaking any law. One reason India has so many slaves is that the population is very high and its PCI is still fairly low. If slavery were legal in India , slavery would be much, much more common.
 
This is beyond ASB.
Why would they reintroduce slavery? That would mean whites would have to feed, house and clothe their black slaves, a lot more expensive than just paying them shitty wages, segregating them from the cities and such.
Can't you see that Apartheid is far more economically beneficial than slavery?

Which is considerably cheaper than having to pay a wage sufficient to feed, house and clothe them. Paying them a wage doesn't mean you can have them starve, be naked and die of exposure. They need all that if you do it directly or indirectly through wages. It is actually cheaper to do so directly even if the person is not materially better off when you pay them a wage because if they are provided by you , you can buy in bulk. If they pay for it they pay individually,
 
Vagrancy laws and chain gangs are a pretty easy way the OTL south did it on a small scale. Don't forget, involuntary servitude is still allowed even today in the US as punishment for a crime explicitly in the 13th Amendment.

Now imagine using the "vagrant" population to do public works, construction and cleanup. It's not hard to pull off and you can send them to different parts of the country.
 
I didn't respond because I live in a different timezone and have a job...
I don't have a list of individuals that would indorse slavery. I have a list of scenarios that would increase the chance that slavery would occur. I think that if South Africa experienced a black uprising that whites were able to suppress that slavery of at least some of the population would be a real possibility. It is hard to say who would advocate that or that such a situation would even be meant to be. My argument is literally this:

South Africa undergoes a black revolt
South Africa's white leaders and population become more reactionary. They suppress the revolt.
SOME and only SOME of South Africa's blacks become slaves in the post revolt.

It really isn't that unlikely. They might not call it slavery...but how they would treat a lot of blacks would be slavery. So my counter question is do you think that South Africa couldn't have undergone a revolt or insurrection by blacks? I ask not in combativeness but because I don't know much of South African history.

You did respond to someone else after my initial query though.

Yes, of course South Africa could have undergone a violent insurrection - in many ways the 1980s had exactly that. What is more likely that in a scenario where there is a revolt which the white government wins, partition will be the result. South Africa will be split into two, with a white state and a black state.

There is no scenario where white South Africans would reintroduce slavery.

What many people on this thread seem to believe is that white South Africa was some sort of Nazi state. It wasn't. It was certainly a police state, but for whites there was relatively free political activity, and civil society, sections of the the media, and academic institutions were all heavily critical of apartheid and the government.

It is impossible that white South Africans would reimplement slavery, and it is impossible that black South Africans would be accepting of it.
 

SRBO

Banned
Like that guy said, paid work pays off better than slavery. Even though i do support some sort of forced labor on criminals simply because keeping someone in prison to do nothing useful is retard tier. With mass slavery you get uprisings every second

Not to mention the fact the commies in the region will all jump on this great opportunity to prove how good they are (even though they ruined every country they ever touched)
 
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