WI:Royal Navy does not achieve OTL level of dominance?

First off what could be a POD before 1900 that could allow the Royal Navy to not become so dominant?

Secondly, if the Royal Navy's was weaker than OTL, which other country's navy could claim the title of world's strongest? France? US? Germany?
 
First off what could be a POD before 1900 that could allow the Royal Navy to not become so dominant?

Secondly, if the Royal Navy's was weaker than OTL, which other country's navy could claim the title of world's strongest? France? US? Germany?

Well there is a ton. A Successful Spanish Armada is one. Britain getting crushed due to Seven Years War/ French Indian War. Britain falling to Napoleon in 1805 due to a astounding loss at Trafalgar. Although that might just be ASB. Nelson's strategy was so far ahead of Villaneuve it was basically a forgone conclusion what was going to happen. Post-Napoleonic wars I don't see how it can not be the premier naval power.

Nations that would be able to have the title of strongest navy really depend on the POD. Spain in the first POD. France in the second. Any POD with America already in the TL will have America surpassing the other nations by the 20th century tho.
 
T3h_shammy said:
Britain falling to Napoleon in 1805 due to a astounding loss at Trafalgar. Although that might just be ASB. Nelson's strategy was so far ahead of Villaneuve it was basically a forgone conclusion what was going to happen.

That is if Neslon exists or is still alive by the time of Trafalgar. Have a POD making him die before 1805 or making him not exist and you could have a less competent admiral in charge of the British fleet.

Without Nelson, there may be no Trafalgar. And if there is no Trafalgar, Napoleon gets what he needs : a complete Franco-Spanish fleet, ready to occupy the Royal Navy while the French troops land on British soil.

T3h_shammy said:
Post-Napoleonic wars I don't see how it can not be the premier naval power.

At the end of the Napoleonic Wars, the British dominated the sea and had no challenger. The situation would remain the same up until WW2. So, if you wish to end the Royal Navy's dominance, you have to make it fall before 1815. In truth, destroying the Royal Navy before Trafalgar would be the best solution as Trafalgar sealed British dominance over the seas.

PaulPierce said:
Secondly, if the Royal Navy's was weaker than OTL, which other country's navy could claim the title of world's strongest? France? US? Germany?

That would depend on the POD.

I don't believe the US can take the prize before 1900 though... There isn't much time for them to achieve this. Yet, I can be wrong as the the US Navy had developped Ironclad ships during the civil war.

Germany can't achieve Naval Predominance before 1900 as it was only united in 1871 and the German fleet only started to worry the British shortly before WW1.

The possible leading Naval powers I see before Britain are Spain, Portugal, the Netherlands and France. The latter seems to be the best option as France was Britain's main rival and the strongest force on the continent up until the end of the Napoleonic Wars.
 
Basically it depends on the POD we want to play with - for example take 1848, make it more revolutionary in Britain, whilst a knock-on effect could be that Germany remains united under Frankfurt. In this case we could have a British fleet knocked back by extended social disruption, and a German Navy which continues the great start from the 1848 period

Best Regards
Grey Wolf
 
Perhaps a united Belgium and Netherlands. They were both big on trade and had a decent navy. If a few more things went right with them and a few more things went wrong with England they could have ruled the seas.
 
The possible leading Naval powers I see before Britain are Spain, Portugal, the Netherlands and France.

And you can remove Spain and Portugal from that list, too. By the 1850s Spain was a broken power and Portugal was too small (plus somewhat struggling to modernise) to ever effectively challenge the UK, even a weakened one.
 
Perhaps a united Belgium and Netherlands. They were both big on trade and had a decent navy. If a few more things went right with them and a few more things went wrong with England they could have ruled the seas.
Not with a POD around 1815. The Dutch glory days were over and would never come back, but with a POD during the Dutch revolt, where the Netherlands manages to gain Belgium it might be possible. A Netherlands with Antwerp and the Flemish ports and a larger population, might be able to rival the English navy.
Of course other condition must exist, like stability in the Netherlands (the southern Netherlands remain protestant or equal rights for catholics is important, less domination of Holland and the merchant/regents from Holland, etc.)

Also the Netherlands can't be under constant pressure from foreign powers, like France (or maybe Spain or a united HRE). That would mean the Netherlands has to focus more on their own safety than on naval superiority.

Also instability in Britain would help, like religious troubles, republicanism vs monarchism, no union with Scotland (thus leaving a foreign threat to the north) or maybe a war with a foreign nation fought on British soil, like a Spanish or French invasion.

Still, in the end the French will probably have a better shot at it than the Netherlands.
 
One of the Main reasons for GB's dominance, has been the Governments willingness to spend the nessacery funds.
Ships at sea cost more than ships in port, The RN sets sail.
Shot and powder are expensive, the RN trains with live Ammo.
New Ships are expensive, the RN replaces old with new.

However if some penny-pinching government takes office &.the British government stopped the Money, The RN would start sliding, and even party change probably wouldn't stop the rot.
 
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