WI: Prussia gets Denmark's colonies after Second Schleswig War, aka German Greenland

Magnum

With the recent Trumpian stupidity over Greenland, I was reminded of something that happened in one of my Victoria playthroughs - Prussia annexing the Danish colonies (Greenland, but also Iceland and the Faroes).

So, how plausible is this?

Assuming Bismark pushes the issue and the Danes reluctantly accept (all of Jutland had been occupied after all, Britain was worried about the American Civil War, France was bogged down in Mexico and Russia was on good terms with Prussia), what kind of butterflies could we expect?
 
Rdffigueira

Rdffigueira

That would be one of the worst cases of geopolitical bullying in Europe (barring Poland being partitioned), but overall I'm not sure what the Prussians/Germans would do with them. Greenland and Iceland don't have a lot of economic value for a nation undergoing the Second Industrial Revolution. Besides, in the age of nationalism, it is likely that the German Empire would have to find some middle ground to catter to the recently-incorporated populations, with large autonomy and such.

The Faroes are too close to Britain for the Germans to like having it. The UK won't like it in the least, and they still control Heligoland by then. It will likely create a diplomatic discomfort, to say the least.

Now, the Danish Caribbean islands could be very useful for a tourism industry (the ads about the "German Bahamas" would be interesting), while the settlement in the Gold Coast in Africa could be interesting for scientific exploration and colonization. This might be the most interesting divergence.

EDIT: Now, thinking on it, Greenland could be even worse than the Faroes, seeing that it is also relatively close to British Canada and to the US. Monroe Doctrine might become even more radical if there is a giant German province near North America, even more as we get close to an alt-WW1 (if it happens similar to OTL).
 

Nivek

Rdffigueira said:
The Faroes are too close to Britain for the Germans to like having it. The UK won't like it in the least, and they still control Heligoland by then. It will likely create a diplomatic discomfort, to say the least.
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They can swap, say change Helgioland and Farore become independant. Iceland is pausable could join a Staten and later Lander
 
AntoniousTheBro

AntoniousTheBro

it is possible they forgoe the other colonies such as greenland and just go for the american and African ones just to avoid stepping on anyone's toes and it wouldn't really bother any of the other powers just some more prestige for prussia
 

Byzantion

Magnum said:
With the recent Trumpian stupidity over Greenland, I was reminded of something that happened in one of my Victoria playthroughs - Prussia annexing the Danish colonies (Greenland, but also Iceland and the Faroes).

So, how plausible is this?

Assuming Bismark pushes the issue and the Danes reluctantly accept (all of Jutland had been occupied after all, Britain was worried about the American Civil War, France was bogged down in Mexico and Russia was on good terms with Prussia), what kind of butterflies could we expect?
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Maybe the Prussian West India aswell.
 

SenatorChickpea

This seems like the kind of thing that would get the US to invoke the Monroe Doctrine. Or rather, for the US to invoke it and the UK to actually enforce it.

You might see a European equivalent of the Triple Intervention in China- Prussia signs a ridiculously harsh peace treaty with Denmark. Shortly after, the US, UK and probably France say: 'Seriously, no. Here's the settlement we'll accept.'
 

sendô

In truth I can see what Prussia would want with Greenland or Iceland, or the Faroes. None are particularly valuable, they're already populated by non German Europeans who, in the age of nationalism, wont be happy to be ruled by a German Kingdom, and ultimately for a nation that has no navy of note, they're pretty much indefensible.

France would certainly be capable of taking them in the upcoming Franco-Prussian war, and in reality I can't see Britain being happy with Prussia having territory on it's northern and north western flanks - a possibly butterfly is British intervention in the Franco-Prussian war?
 

The Gunslinger

Seeing as how America is a tad busy with the Civil War, I doubt the Monroe Doctrine doesn't really concern itself with colonies changing hands.

I could see Britain opting for an alternate Heligoland Treaty for the Faroes. We'll have to see what long term happens with Iceland, because that could be the real problem with Britain's overseas trade with a threatening looking Germany.
 

Nivek

The Gunslinger said:
Seeing as how America is a tad busy with the Civil War, I doubt the Monroe Doctrine doesn't really concern itself with colonies changing hands.

I could see Britain opting for an alternate Heligoland Treaty for the Faroes. We'll have to see what long term happens with Iceland, because that could be the real problem with Britain's overseas trade with a threatening looking Germany.
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Long Term Independance as become a Staten/Lander is pausable, Iceland is so small and learning germany would be easier the community, specially as oportunity in the mainland start to come
 
Grey Wolf

Grey Wolf

Iceland's population was less than 100,000 and some of those were leaving for Canada due to climate. It would not be beyond the bounds of possibility for German immigrants to outnumber Icelanders and Nordic Greenlanders by 1900. As with many European provinces when they change hands there is the incentive to acclimatise and to adopt the new country's mannerisms, so Icelanders and Greenlanders would start speaking German, adopt German forms, and as I seem to remember they didn't have surnames per se, adopt German surnames, or at least German versions of their existing patronymic

Best Regards
Grey Wolf
 

NegusNegast

Reagent said:
Didn't Denmark offer to join the North German confederation so long as they could retain Schleswig-Holstein in 1864? I'm unaware of any direct Prussian interest in Greenland and Iceland, so Denmark's offer to join the NHC might be a more tenable mechanism to achieve this.

While Prussia itself won't control the Danish colonies, there could still potentially be a Prussian-dominated German Empire which does
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IIRC this was an offer from the king himself not necessarily the whole Danish government, and even if they joined the German Confederation (not the North German Confederation because that did not exist yet in 1864) that doesn't mean by default they would later join the German Empire. It seems more probable given linguistic/cultural differences that a Denmark in the German Confederation would pull a Luxembourg/Lichtenstein/Limburg etc. and be excluded from the unified state later on although there may be some fight over S-H. German nationalists themselves didn't even want all of Denmark, they just wanted Schleswig-Holstein.
 
Roosevelt

Roosevelt

Sounds like what I do in Vicky II.

In all seriousness, I don't see a reason for this. Prussia more likely to annex all of Jutland than go for Greenland and Iceland. Greenland has no use and Iceland has an established Danish-Icelandic population. As others have said, the Faroes are too close to Britain. The only good Danish territories that could benefit Prussia/Germany are the ones in the Caribbean as they'd be good for coaling for the German Navy.
 

SenatorChickpea

The Gunslinger said:
Seeing as how America is a tad busy with the Civil War, I doubt the Monroe Doctrine doesn't really concern itself with colonies changing hands.
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The thing is, for most of the nineteenth century it wasn't the US who actually enforced the Monroe Doctrine. In this scenario- the brief tensions over Trent years in the past and the Confederacy clearly on the road to defeat- the US would invoke the doctrine and the British would 'support' it.
 

JSchafer

Banned
Britain would not allow it, especially not the Faroes unless there are severe restrictions to militarization of the islands. In which case they may become rather prosperous as Germany industrializes and settlers come in but they'd be occupied and lost when WW1 comes around.
 
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