WI: Prince Arthur of Wales didn't die early

King Henry VII gained the crown of England from Richard III in 1485. Henry VII became the first king of the Tudor dynasty. He had several children, his most famous being his son Henry, who became Henry VIII. However Henry VIII had an older brother, Arthur, who was next in line but died before he could ascend to the throne. Basically, what might have happened had Arthur lived a full life and became King of England? How would he be titled, just King Arthur, or Arthur II(considering how all european monarchs attempted to trace their lineage back to the Arthurian legends). What would he do differently then his brother Henry?
 
Adûnakhôr said:
I think we already have several threads on this.

Yeah... I think I saw several threads regarding Arthur, Prince of Wales, surviving and suceeding Henry VII. We even have a recent timeline that is partially* linked to this POD: Two Lucky Princes by SavoyTruffle.

Basically, if Arthur were to succeed Henry VII, you would end up with him as King Arthur I of England. That would also result in OTL Henry VIII following a career in the Church since that was what was originally planned by Henry VII.

*partially because Arthur isn't the only Lucky Prince :D
 
Yeah... I think I saw several threads regarding Arthur, Prince of Wales, surviving and suceeding Henry VII. We even have a recent timeline that is partially* linked to this POD: Two Lucky Princes by SavoyTruffle.

Basically, if Arthur were to succeed Henry VII, you would end up with him as King Arthur I of England. That would also result in OTL Henry VIII following a career in the Church since that was what was originally planned by Henry VII.

*partially because Arthur isn't the only Lucky Prince :D

Why thank you.

I pretty much made him Arthur I because regnal numberings in England were dated from the Norman Conquest - which is why Edward I was numbered such even if there were quite a few kings named Edward before 1066.
 
Didn't die early leaves a lot of room for different outcomes.

What if Arthur only lives to 1508, and then dies, never having become King. He HAS married and unquestionably consumated his relationship with Catherine of Aragon. Perhaps they've already experienced a miscarriage.

With a longer lived Arthur, Henry (VIII) has spent actual time as a teenager being actively raised for a Church career. Perhaps this makes his personality a bit more humble and a bit more focused. Less prone to spending money on personal extravagance and wars.

Henry becomes King in 1509 on the death of Henry VII. He can't marry Catherine now, can he? What does the potential pool of brides look like?

With only a rushed year to prepare him for the kingship, does he move more cautiously in the first years of his reign? Fewer changes in royal advisors? No involvement in the League of Cambrai?

With more time spent with the Church as a teenager and a more fertile wife (possibly because he doesn't catch VD with less of a chance to sow his oats), will the Church of England ever be created?
 
Didn't die early leaves a lot of room for different outcomes.

What if Arthur only lives to 1508, and then dies, never having become King. He HAS married and unquestionably consumated his relationship with Catherine of Aragon. Perhaps they've already experienced a miscarriage.

With a longer lived Arthur, Henry (VIII) has spent actual time as a teenager being actively raised for a Church career. Perhaps this makes his personality a bit more humble and a bit more focused. Less prone to spending money on personal extravagance and wars.

Henry becomes King in 1509 on the death of Henry VII. He can't marry Catherine now, can he? What does the potential pool of brides look like?

With only a rushed year to prepare him for the kingship, does he move more cautiously in the first years of his reign? Fewer changes in royal advisors? No involvement in the League of Cambrai?

With more time spent with the Church as a teenager and a more fertile wife (possibly because he doesn't catch VD with less of a chance to sow his oats), will the Church of England ever be created?
I was thinking of Margaret of Austria marrying Henry VIII, I think this match is perfect..
 
Didn't die early leaves a lot of room for different outcomes.

What if Arthur only lives to 1508, and then dies, never having become King. He HAS married and unquestionably consumated his relationship with Catherine of Aragon. Perhaps they've already experienced a miscarriage.

With a longer lived Arthur, Henry (VIII) has spent actual time as a teenager being actively raised for a Church career. Perhaps this makes his personality a bit more humble and a bit more focused. Less prone to spending money on personal extravagance and wars.

After all, look at what joining the church did to Armand Jean du Plessis!

With only a rushed year to prepare him for the kingship, does he move more cautiously in the first years of his reign? Fewer changes in royal advisors? No involvement in the League of Cambrai?

With more time spent with the Church as a teenager and a more fertile wife (possibly because he doesn't catch VD with less of a chance to sow his oats), will the Church of England ever be created?

Actually, there's no evidence Henry ever got a VD to begin with. In fact, Henry's womanizing tendencies are somewhat exaggerated--he's not anywhere in Francois' league, and in point of fact, seems to have lagged behind Emperor Charles. Personally, I'd say Henry was more in love with being loved than sex--he didn't want a mistress--he wanted A WIFE to make him happy. (And bear him a legitimate son. That last bit was important.)
 
After all, look at what joining the church did to Armand Jean du Plessis!

Is that who I think it is? (In white) Richelieu.

Actually, there's no evidence Henry ever got a VD to begin with. In fact, Henry's womanizing tendencies are somewhat exaggerated--he's not anywhere in Francois' league, and in point of fact, seems to have lagged behind Emperor Charles. Personally, I'd say Henry was more in love with being loved than sex--he didn't want a mistress--he wanted A WIFE to make him happy. (And bear him a legitimate son. That last bit was important.)

On the other hand, Henry was to chastity what he was to humility. He did take mistresses while married.

This is not exactly atypical, just observing that he seems to have saw no reason he couldn't have both.
 
Is that who I think it is? (In white) Richelieu.

Yep.

On the other hand, Henry was to chastity what he was to humility. He did take mistresses while married.

This is not exactly atypical, just observing that he seems to have saw no reason he couldn't have both.

Oh, I'm not denying he did--but again compare him to Francois 'my mother wrote about me having my first sexual experience at nine' Valois, and Henry just doesn't seem that out there. Honestly, Henry's mistresses come across more as a middle-aged man looking for company, a little sex, and someone he can whine about his wife about. There are only four women we KNOW Henry took as his mistress, and two of them went on to become wives. (Further those two largely avoided sleeping with him until AFTER the wedding.) There also a few more POSSIBLE mistresses, but... again, really not that many.
 
Oh, I'm not denying he did--but again compare him to Francois 'my mother wrote about me having my first sexual experience at nine' Valois, and Henry just doesn't seem that out there. Honestly, Henry's mistresses come across more as a middle-aged man looking for company, a little sex, and someone he can whine about his wife about. There are only four women we KNOW Henry took as his mistress, and two of them went on to become wives. (Further those two largely avoided sleeping with him until AFTER the wedding.) There also a few more POSSIBLE mistresses, but... again, really not that many.

Yeah. Henry's main issue with being a womanizer seems to being profoundly unsatisfied with any individual woman (for most of his life).

But "loving to be loved" explains why he pursued Anne Boelyn more with her refusing to be a mere mistress, rather than finding that a sign she's just a -----, rather well.
 
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