WI Poland had found out Germany's plans to attack it?

King Thomas

Banned
I read somewhere Poland was reading Germany's messages in the 1930's until, six months before the invasion of Poland, the codes were changed. So what happens if the codes are not changed and the Poles know exactly when and how the attack is coming?
 
I'm not exactly certain just what Poland could do about it. Mobilize sooner and faster, but I doubt they would pre-empt Germany. That would just give the Nazis a legitimate excuse to attack in the eyes of world opinion.
 
A mobilization is not a causus belli according to international law, at most it is a cause for your own mobilisation.

The Poles might have ensured that they got the R45 tanks, MS406 and Hurricane fighters and Battle bombers a month early, giving them some more punch. Perhaps all the P.37s would be armed, the P.11G ready and more P.50 produced.

The order seem to have been: 50 R35 tanks, 120 MS.406 fighters, 14 Hurricane IA fighters, 1 Spitfire IA fighter (for evaluation), 100 Battle bombers as well as torpedos, mines, optics and coastal artillery. A lot of this was on its way in September 1939, going by ship to Romania. Some of it was sold to Turkey instead.

Poland is probably going to fall anyway, if the French do not move. Perhaps the Poles will share intelligence with the French and hold out for two more months, allowing the French to occupy the Ruhr area. If the French do, the Germans will have a hard time replenishing their ammunition and supply stocks, which were almost completely drained after the campaign in Poland.

Edit: Added numbers.
 
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Markus

Banned
I read somewhere Poland was reading Germany's messages in the 1930's until, six months before the invasion of Poland, the codes were changed. So what happens if the codes are not changed and the Poles know exactly when and how the attack is coming?


IIRC they did know the "when and how" well enough to want to mobilize but France and the UK urged them not to, resulting in the Polish Army being only half mobilized. Even with the incomplete Army the Poles were quite a handful. It took twice the ammo to destroy a polish division in 39 than it took to destroy a french/british one in 1940.

Unless there is an allied offensive in the west, the Poles will eventually loose but the better they do, the more likely such an offensive is.
 
Poland had been partially mobilized since the annexation of the Czech rump, and ordered general mobilization almost half a week before the hostilities actually broke out. The had something in the range of 2 million available reservists, but had only 37 divisions under arms when the fighting actually broke out.
 
Originally posted by posbi
Poland had been partially mobilized since the annexation of the Czech rump, and ordered general mobilization almost half a week before the hostilities actually broke out. The had something in the range of 2 million available reservists, but had only 37 divisions under arms when the fighting actually broke out.
Not exactly. Poland started full mobilization at the end of August 1939. Then Warsaw called it off under French and British (mostly French) pressure. Allegedly French ambassador threatened with withdrawing French help for Poland if Poles do not stop "provoking" the Germans. Eventually Poland started full mobilization again at the very eve of the war. Needless to say Polish reservists were completely confused wheter they should go to their units or not, and getting there took them time Poland didn't have.
Also, Poland could have mobilized over 2 milions of soldiers, but was unable to arm and equip them. According to Polish Plan Z (defense against Germany) Polish Army should have had 30 infantry divisions, 9-10 reserve infantry divisions, 11 cavalry brigades, 2 motorized brigades, about 15 National Defence brigades (more or less equivalent of Home Guard, poorly armed and equipped), 3 improvised mountain brigades, some Coast Defence units and some Border Corps units (not to confuse with Border Guard).
IIRC on September the 1st Poland had fully mobilized and on position only about 21 infantry divisions, 7 cavalry brigades, 1 mobilized brigade and other units - ca 60% of its forces.
 

yourworstnightmare

Banned
Donor
It wasn't like the Polish didn't know what was coming. Hitler went around with his annexation shopping bag and took everything he wanted.
 
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