WI/PC. GAU-8 Armed "Firefly" tanks in co-op with M1 Abrams.

Now that's an idea!!!

Would a SPAAG version actually work in the sense of getting the gun to fit into a turret that pivots?

Apart from the ill fated Sgt York and the M61 mini-gun atop a M113 , the US never designed and put into service a proper DIVAD weapon.

How effective would a GAU-8 SPAAG be?

Regards filers.
Not as good as that plan to fit Abrams hulls out with a SuperFledermaus clone and a couple KDAs to make a system like the Gepard or Guntank would be.

(IIRC, there was also a plan to put Stingers on them.)
 
There are a number of 40mm CTA weapons that would do the job for less ammo and weight and complexity (and money) using AHEAD type ammo with the option to use other ammo types
 
Now that's an idea!!!

Would a SPAAG version actually work in the sense of getting the gun to fit into a turret that traverse's?

Apart from the ill fated Sgt York and the M61 mini-gun atop a M113 , the US never designed and put into service a proper DIVAD weapon.

How effective would a GAU-8 SPAAG be?
To be honest, it would suffer from an excessive rate of fire - 800 rpm is as good as 4,000, and you can maintain it five times longer. Not that it stopped people proposing such things IOTL, and it seemed to work reasonably well in the Goalkeeper CIWS.
Not as good as that plan to fit Abrams hulls out with a SuperFledermaus clone and a couple KDAs to make a system like the Gepard or Guntank would be.

(IIRC, there was also a plan to put Stingers on them.)
Personally, I like the M1 AGDS - two 35mm Bushmaster III and twelve ADATS missiles.
 
Now that's an idea!!!

Would a SPAAG version actually work in the sense of getting the gun to fit into a turret that traverse's?

Apart from the ill fated Sgt York and the M61 mini-gun atop a M113 , the US never designed and put into service a proper DIVAD weapon.

How effective would a GAU-8 SPAAG be?

Regards filers.

Why not both SPAAG + Tank hunter.
Add missiles and you can have:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Defense_Anti-Tank_System
 

Delta Force

Banned
The total weapons system weighs 4,029 pounds/1,828 kilograms and the ammunition drum is almost the size of a Volkswagen Beetle. How would such a massive weapon be traversed and reloaded?

640px-GAU-8_meets_VW_Type_1.jpg
 
The total weapons system weighs 4,029 pounds/1,828 kilograms and the ammunition drum is almost the size of a Volkswagen Beetle. How would such a massive weapon be traversed and reloaded?
That's only big in the aircraft world, whilst the Beetle is small in the car world. Park the GAU-8 next to a tank, and it loses a lot of its' impact. Heck, park it next to a typical American land yacht of the era and the equivalent photo loses a lot of its' impact.
 
I really don't understand what the vehicle is supposed to do. Standard tank guns and ATGMs are just better, and the former are much simpler. I think you get a lot more tank kills with 800 lbs of long rod penetrators than you would with 1100 lbs of 30 mm shells, and short of helicopters, I don't know that there are many targets too big for a .50 cal but too small for a 120mm.
 
I really don't understand what the vehicle is supposed to do. Standard tank guns and ATGMs are just better, and the former are much simpler. I think you get a lot more tank kills with 800 lbs of long rod penetrators than you would with 1100 lbs of 30 mm shells, and short of helicopters, I don't know that there are many targets too big for a .50 cal but too small for a 120mm.

Hammer looking for nail.
But Imagine you are GD Executive and you need to sell more Abrahams hulls and make some money.
Definitely there is role for this weapon. Look on Pentagon Wars.
 
Personally, I like the M1 AGDS - two 35mm Bushmaster III and twelve ADATS missiles.
That's the one I was thinking of. It's been a while since I read up on it, so the details got a bit garbled.

Why did I think it used Stingers?
The KDA thing makes sense (since that's the standard 35mm gun,) but the stinger thing just came out of nowhere.
 
Given the discussion so far, I thought you might be interested in something I knocked together in 1/35 scale a couple of years ago...

Magach 5 Avenger

Following the Yom Kippur War the IDF’s holdings of M48s and M60s were dramatically reduced (500 and something down to 200 and something). OTL the US resupplied with M48A5s and more M60s. In this TL, however, some of the M60s supplied were M60A2s. Whilst the IDF had no intention of fielding the M60A2's gun/missile system they were desperate for AFVs. The A2 turrets were removed and replaced with either salvaged M60 105mm gun turrets or the new twin 120mm breach loading mortar turret (another story/project). Having suffered such great losses of its MBT force to Egyptian AT missile teams, the IDF were keen to come up with/prove the concept of a tank escort support vehicle. A deal was struck with the US for the IDF to acquire a limited number of GAU-8s to be retrofitted into the discarded M60A2 narrow profile turrets. With the barrel group sticking out front, the length and width of the turret was about right - although some modification was required to accommodate the large ammunition drums. The turrets, which were entirely unmanned, were then fitted onto older M48 hulls (same sized turret ring) with the 3-man crew (Commander, Gunner and Driver) being positioned within the hull. The end result was not, and was never intended to be, a MBT. The Magach 5 Avenger proved to be highly capable in its escort/urban role and, although never produced in large numbers, proved to be extremely popular with both AFV crews and infantry alike.


Factual detail:
- The A-10 routinely carries 1150 rounds of 30mm ammunition for its GAU-8 Avenger cannon. The GAU-8 was designed to have 2 rates of fire - slow 2100rpm and fast 4200rpm. In operation the gun now has a fixed rate of fire of 3900rpm. However, I would suggest that in a ground vehicle mount the slower rate of fire would more than suffice. Thus at 2100rpm you fire 35 rounds every second. This gives you approximately 32 x 1-second bursts from 1150 rounds.
- This compares favourably to a modern SPAAG such as the Gepard, which carries only 320 rounds per gun but also only fires each gun at a cyclic rate of 550rpm. In other words, 9 rounds per gun per second for a total of approximately 36 x 1-second bursts.
- In order to prevent possible ingestion of spent cases into its engines, the A-10 keeps hold of its fired empty cases in the rear drum immediately behind the ammunition feed drum (All of this is part of the overall 5.93m length of the gun system).
- There is no ingestion problem on a ground vehicle and so no need to retain the spent 30mm cases, thus the second drum could be used to hold more ammunition, effectively doubling its capacity to 2300 rounds. This would give approximately 64 x 1-second bursts from one complete ammunition load. The bonus, of course, is that each 1-second burst fires 35 rounds down range as opposed to the Gepard which fires 18 rounds per second from its 2 barrels.
- The GAU-8 operates a linkless round system with the rounds effectively pushed along the feed rails by the ammunition drum, which is designed like a giant corkscrew. Whilst this storage and feed system could be replaced with something less linear there is, I believe, scope for some sort of gun elevation system, which would only move the front part of the gun without adversely affecting the flexible feeds. In the A-10 mount this mid section appears to be taken up with what I assume are hydraulic and/or electric motors to spin the barrel group and power the ammunition drums. Without the limitation of aircraft space and weight constraints, I am sure that the above mentioned elevation system could be worked out.
- The empty cases are ejected from a armoured port on the right-hand side of the turret. The process of reloading the ammunition drums is facilitated through an access panel on the rear of the turret which allows a reload feed belt to be attached.

The model, which represents the 2nd Vehicle, 2nd Platoon of the 2nd Magach 5 Avenger Company, is made from parts of a Tamiya M48 Sgt York, a Tamiya M60A2 and a fair bit of scratch build/bits from the spares box.





 
When the A-10 was built, a large portion of the Soviet armored force was still older T-55 tanks an T-62s. It was fairly plausible it could have been an effective anti tank aircraft. However by the 80s when the T-72 and T-80 where coming online it was reduced to a missile platform and a fairly vulnerable one at that. Look at Iraq where a large number of them where either shot down or damaged beyond repair. I was never sure why they didn't just replace it with a Dragonfly type aircraft for close air support and COIN and strap hellfires on everything else for Anti tank warfare. People love that gun though.
 
Now that's an idea!!!

Would a SPAAG version actually work in the sense of getting the gun to fit into a turret that traverse's?

Apart from the ill fated Sgt York and the M61 mini-gun atop a M113 , the US never designed and put into service a proper DIVAD weapon.

How effective would a GAU-8 SPAAG be?

Regards filers.


Short answer: Not very. It would be cheaper and easier for the US to acquire the Gepard which was a proven system and without equal in NATO.
 
What this would make is a support vehicle for bunker busting or urban warfare. Wanna make a hole in a building just cut loose and make a hole. Want to take out a bunker just aim at the firing slit..
 
What this would make is a support vehicle for bunker busting or urban warfare. Wanna make a hole in a building just cut loose and make a hole. Want to take out a bunker just aim at the firing slit..
You just described a regular tank. 120mm or 105mm HE will do the job much better than lots of 30mm.
 
A GAU-8 armed tank would be a good SPAAG or you could turn it into a fearsome but very specialised anti-infantry machine with a dedicated infantry support role. Give it a high enough elevation to deal with folks firing down on a tank but otherwise use it as a pure infantry support weapon.
 
If the GAU-8 is good, but the 105mm gun is more useful, the answer is clear. Redesign the GAU-8 to fire the 105mm ammo - best of both worlds. Might need a slightly bigger tank though.
 
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