WI not racist president Pelley?

This is like asking if “Mosley wasn’t a fascist, how fun would he be as PM?”

Pelley is inextricably tied to racism and fascism - you can’t separate him from those two things, because that’s what his entire worldview was founded upon.

We literally have a TL on PM Mosley where he didn't go Fascist here; OP is asking a pretty valid question.
 
That's not the point though; one can reasonably ask about someone turning out different in life as far choices and outcomes.

No, because if you somehow find a way to put Pelley in power he isn't Pelley he's just a WASP who learned the law and how to play politics, you then more or less have him do whatever because a Pelley that gets the Presidency isn't Pelley at all.

Mosley, on the other hand, was a decently successful politician before the BUF and one can actually figure out a way to get him into power without massively changing his life

Apples and Oranges
 
No, because if you somehow find a way to put Pelley in power he isn't Pelley he's just a WASP who learned the law and how to play politics, you then more or less have him do whatever because a Pelley that gets the Presidency isn't Pelley at all.

Mosley, on the other hand, was a decently successful politician before the BUF and one can actually figure out a way to get him into power without massively changing his life

Apples and Oranges

He's still Pelly, however. Yes, he's not the Pelly we know, but that's kinda the point of alternate history.
 
He's still Pelly, however. Yes, he's not the Pelly we know, but that's kinda the point of alternate history.
Then you’re just writing fantasy at that point, not actual AH, since AH is supposed to be based somewhat in reality.

Mosley was an actual politician who was affiliated with both the Tories and Labour during his lifetime - Pelley was a racist kook who idolized Adolf Hitler. If you take that away, than it’s not William Dudley Pelley, it’s a fictional character.
 
"Race! It is a feeling, not a reality: ninety-five percent, at least, is a feeling. Nothing will ever make me believe that biologically pure races can be shown to exist today. Amusingly enough, not one of those who have proclaimed the "nobility" of the Teutonic race was himself a Teuton." - Benito Mussolini

Fascist Italy wasn't much more racist than other European countries at the time were, and there's nothing about fascism which requires it to be racist.

At the same time Mussolini fretted about the “numeric and geographic expansion of the yellow and black races” and how he feared that that would mean “the civilization of the white man is destined to perish.” He might have mocked the Nazi's racial views when it suited him to differentiate himself from Hitler but he was always a racist.

I cannot talk about Italy, but depending of what you consider fascism, the integralists are the complete opposite. The brazilian integralist action was the first movement in Brazil to have a full participation of not only whites but women, afrobrazilians and natives (even before the communists did), to the point that the brazilian blackfront joined them and they had a afrobraziliancentric newspaper called "The voice of the race" that they used to denounce racism. on the other hand the integralists never considered themselves fascists, they rejected the view that everything should be under the state and the fascist futurist cultural views and their views on the religion, to the point that Salgado cheered the liberation of Rome in '44.

Still, this Pelley who scenario ended in a trainwreck, I asked a admin t close it.
 
Fascism and racism are pretty much inseparable.
I didn't say that they are, it's a matter if it's a core principle or not in regards to how it's applied; I mean afterall fascism in general requires a hierarchy of sorts.
Still, this Pelley who scenario ended in a trainwreck, I asked a admin t close it.
I feel the same about some of my threads I made, so I know what you're going through.
 
Then you’re just writing fantasy at that point, not actual AH, since AH is supposed to be based somewhat in reality.

Mosley was an actual politician who was affiliated with both the Tories and Labour during his lifetime - Pelley was a racist kook who idolized Adolf Hitler. If you take that away, than it’s not William Dudley Pelley, it’s a fictional character.

It's fantasy to write an alternate history where someone lives a different life? That sounds like the fundamentals of this genre to me.
 
He's still Pelly, however. Yes, he's not the Pelly we know, but that's kinda the point of alternate history.

No he's just generic white racist politician #101

It's fantasy to write an alternate history where someone lives a different life? That sounds like the fundamentals of this genre to me.

Its Fantasy to expect a President Pelley to be remotely like anything related to OTLs Pelley and by this point, you can have him do whatever he wants by the time you had to jumo through enough hoops to get POTUS Pelley he's now Not-Pelley whose about as different to Pelley as Notler is to Hitler. Its Fantasy to expect a POTUS Pelley to have even the faintest resemblance to OTL Pelley
 
To be honest and this might sound fucked up, if he's not a ranting lunatic, its kinda boring to speculate on him as a President. If hes a moderate politician who has moderate views, ahhh wheres the fun in that?
 
No he's just generic white racist politician #101

Its Fantasy to expect a President Pelley to be remotely like anything related to OTLs Pelley and by this point, you can have him do whatever he wants by the time you had to jumo through enough hoops to get POTUS Pelley he's now Not-Pelley whose about as different to Pelley as Notler is to Hitler. Its Fantasy to expect a POTUS Pelley to have even the faintest resemblance to OTL Pelley

Which is entirely the point of alternate history.
 
Which is entirely the point of alternate history.
It’s not alternate history when you’re just straight up making things up about a historical figure with no actual basis or even a POD.

If I wrote a TL where the central conceit was about Jermaine Jackson becoming the Republican Governor of Indiana, that would be fantasy - arguably, it makes as much sense as Pelley magically becoming a regular, standard Democrat for no reason.
 
As an individual, Mosley had a typical fascist political journey. He followed the classical, Mussolini-type journey to fascism where a left-wing or socialist drops the internationalism of normal socialists and shifts their emphasis away from economics to ultra-nationalism.
The type of person in the west who is attracted to fascism or neo-nazism is probably never going to gain political power (without being propped up by an ideologically sympathetic invading army Warsaw-pact style). Mosley's party failed to win a single seat in Parliament, let alone take power in a "march on London".
A PM Mosley is almost as implausible someone writing a timeline where Jason Unruhe (wing-nut tankie youtuber who defends Stalin and Mao) becomes prime minister of Canada.
 
It’s not alternate history when you’re just straight up making things up about a historical figure with no actual basis or even a POD.

If I wrote a TL where the central conceit was about Jermaine Jackson becoming the Republican Governor of Indiana, that would be fantasy - arguably, it makes as much sense as Pelley magically becoming a regular, standard Democrat for no reason.

This is literally doctrinaire alternate history. We have TLs on this site where Ted Bundy, for example, becomes a major Republican politican.
 
This is literally doctrinaire alternate history. We have TLs on this site where Ted Bundy, for example, becomes a major Republican politican.
Ted Bundy was also actually involved in the Republican Party and served as a delegate at the 1968 RNC.

Unlike that, there is no actual basis to this WI. It is not “doctrinaire AH,” it’s fantasy.
 
Ted Bundy was also actually involved in the Republican Party and served as a delegate at the 1968 RNC.

Unlike that, there is no actual basis to this WI. It is not “doctrinaire AH,” it’s fantasy.

Ted Bundy was also a serial killer which somewhat prevents a stable political career, no? Writing an alternate history where someone lives a different life is a bedrock of this genre and literally the logical conclusion of the butterfly effect.
 
Ted Bundy was also a serial killer which somewhat prevents a stable political career, no? Writing an alternate history where someone lives a different life is a bedrock of this genre and literally the logical conclusion of the butterfly effect.
Okay, you’re literally just ignoring the simple points I’m laying out and being a bit dense, so I’m just going to walk away at this point.
 
A PM Mosley is almost as implausible someone writing a timeline where Jason Unruhe (wing-nut tankie youtuber who defends Stalin and Mao) becomes prime minister of Canada.

We know it's implausible because Mosley is dead and because we know what happened in Britain and the world during his life. Jason Unruhe of Maoist Rebel News is still relatively young and we don't know how the future will turn out so you can plausibly write some future history TL where Jason Unruhe and his gang of tankies takes over Canada in the year 2050. Seems more fun than making W.D. Pelley into a random American politician.

Ted Bundy was also a serial killer which somewhat prevents a stable political career, no? Writing an alternate history where someone lives a different life is a bedrock of this genre and literally the logical conclusion of the butterfly effect.

He was also considered incredibly charming hence why it's easy to imagine an alternative career in politics.

W.D. Pelley was a deranged religious nut who was also virulently racist even for his age. Take away the racism and you have a nutjob who believes God lets him walk through walls and levitate, which isn't the sort of material American politicians have ever been made out of. Take away the religious craziness and you have pretty much a generic person who happens to be named W.D. Pelley and look like him too.
 
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