WI: No unification of the Canadian Military?

As it says on the can, what if the 1968 reorganization of the Canadian military did not lead to the complete unification of the three services (RCN, RCAF and Canadian Army) into the Canadian Forces? What would be the knock-on effects of a more rational and less controversial reorganization?

For an easy POD to get us there, given that Defense Minister Hellyer is a WWII vet, say that during the war he gets himself killed, either in combat or in an accident.
 
As it says on the can, what if the 1968 reorganization of the Canadian military did not lead to the complete unification of the three services (RCN, RCAF and Canadian Army) into the Canadian Forces? What would be the knock-on effects of a more rational and less controversial reorganization?

For an easy POD to get us there, given that Defense Minister Hellyer is a WWII vet, say that during the war he gets himself killed, either in combat or in an accident.

First idea off the top of my head is happier sailors, air crews and soldiers. Morale counts for a lot. It might cost a bit more though, since there would be a bit more duplication and wastage. OTOH, the uniform supply companies would have a few more contracts to bid on.

Other than the morale boost and possibly more money spent on the military, TBH I can't think of any other effects that would make a difference.
 
First idea off the top of my head is happier sailors, air crews and soldiers. Morale counts for a lot. It might cost a bit more though, since there would be a bit more duplication and wastage. OTOH, the uniform supply companies would have a few more contracts to bid on.

Other than the morale boost and possibly more money spent on the military, TBH I can't think of any other effects that would make a difference.

Agreed. Trudeau was going to gut Canada's commitment to Europe (the 1st Canadian Air Division and 4th Canadian Mechanised Brigade Group) anyway. He didn't care at all for the military and his whole period as prime minister pretty much echoed it.
 
Agreed. Trudeau was going to gut Canada's commitment to Europe (the 1st Canadian Air Division and 4th Canadian Mechanised Brigade Group) anyway. He didn't care at all for the military and his whole period as prime minister pretty much echoed it.

This.

I like Trudeau for his handling of the October crisis and Quebec, but DAMN he beat our military with a stupid stick. mercilessly.
 
First idea off the top of my head is happier sailors, air crews and soldiers. Morale counts for a lot. It might cost a bit more though, since there would be a bit more duplication and wastage. OTOH, the uniform supply companies would have a few more contracts to bid on.

That bolded part would have to be addressed in a "no unification" scenario.
 
not a big change but the uniforms might be different (the land army could still have rank insignias that are a variation of the british style for example).
 
I have to echo the above statements. Early Trudeau was as anti-military as Canada's national leaders have been in our history. Without him, things would probably be different.
 
Except it was under Pearson the CF was unified.

Yeah, that's true. Especially since he had Paul Hellyer working as his Minister of National Defence.

That man -- while I could understand the need to trim down some costs and all that -- probably, IMO, did as much damage to the morale of the military as a whole (especially in the Air Force and Navy) than Trudeau ever did. Fortunately, a lot of that has finally been healed, especially in recent years.

I still get a laugh at his reaction to the restoration of the titles "Royal Canadian Navy" and "Royal Canadian Air Force" to Maritime Command and Air Command respectively last month. Moaning and complaining that we were taking a "big step back" by bringing those titles back. D'uh! Wake up, dummy! It was a near zero-effect decision and it doesn't change anything about how the Forces operate these days! :rolleyes:
 
One thing I've been wondering, and someone might enlighten me, why wasn't it just the "purple trades" who were unified ? Would make sense to have a single "General Purpose" branch with various department (medical, policing, etc...) and it would have cut down some of the cost.

PS: migth have to design a uniform for a AH purple trades branch one day.
 

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Banned
One thing I've been wondering, and someone might enlighten me, why wasn't it just the "purple trades" who were unified ? Would make sense to have a single "General Purpose" branch with various department (medical, policing, etc...) and it would have cut down some of the cost.

PS: migth have to design a uniform for a AH purple trades branch one day.

I agree, a certain amount of unification isn't the bad thing, but a complete unification is nonsence.;)
 
One thing I've been wondering, and someone might enlighten me, why wasn't it just the "purple trades" who were unified ? Would make sense to have a single "General Purpose" branch with various department (medical, policing, etc...) and it would have cut down some of the cost.

PS: migth have to design a uniform for a AH purple trades branch one day.

Technically, here are the so-called "purple trades" (as per modern trade classifications):

Logistics Branch - Logistics Officers (sea/land/air), Resource Management Support Clerks (the office clerks/finance clerks), Cooks (self-explanatory), Supply Technicians (the quartermaster teams), Stewards (the wardroom servers on ships and VIP flights), Mobile Equipment Support Operators (the truck drivers), Ammunition Technicians (the boys who play with things that go "bang!"), Postal Clerks (the mailmen), Traffic Technicians (the people movers).

Band Branch - Band Officers (sea/air/land), Musicians (the bandsmen).

Medical Branch/Canadian Forces Medical Services - Medical Officer (doctors), Nursing Officers (nurses), Bioscience Officer (the medical researchers), Health Care Administration Officer (the preventive medicine officers), Pharmacy Officer (the drug dispensers), Physiotherapy Officer (the "legal" chiropractors), Social Work Officer (the psychological support officers), Biomedical Electronics Technician (the medical equipment repairmen), Medical Laboratory Technologist (the lab rats), Medical Radiation Technologist (the X-ray gang), Medical Technician (the field medics), Physician Assistant (senior field medics, sergeants/petty officers 2nd class and above).

Chaplain Branch - Chaplains

Intelligence Branch - Intelligence Officers (the spooks with commissions), Intelligence Operators (the spooks)

Legal Branch - Legal Officers (military lawyers)

Military Police Branch/Canadian Forces Military Police - Military Police Officers (the redcaps with commissions), Military Police (the redcaps)

Personnel Selection Branch - Personnel Selection Officers (specialists in helping personnel switch trades if required)

Public Affairs Branch - Public Affairs Officers (they who talk to the media)

Training Development Branch - Training Development Officers (they who help construct all training syllabi)

Also, the Dental Branch/Canadian Forces Dental Services can also be seen as a "purple" department even if all Dental Officers and Dental Technicians wear Army green these days as traditionally, before 1968, all dental health care for the RCN, Army and RCAF was handled by the Army Royal Canadian Dental Corps.

Atop that, certain of the other above-listed trades wear a single environmental uniform per traditions. Moblie Systems Equipment Operators and Traffic Technicians either wear the air or land uniforms. Postal Clerks are all in Army green (the pre-1968 Canadian Postal Corps, like the RCDC mentioned above, handled all postal issues for the RCN, Army and RCAF).

Furthermore, there are members of other branches that work in either all environments (sea, land, air) or any two environments (usually land and air) which could be seen also as "purple trades." They are:

Communications and Electronics Branch - Communications Research Operators (the electronic warfare people) (sea/land/air)

Military Engineering Branch/Canadian Military Engineers - Construction Technician (they who build buildings) (land/air), Electrical Distribution Technicians (the wiremen) (land/air), Electrical Generating Systems Technicians (the power suppliers) (land/air), Plumbing and Heating Technicians (the plumbers) (land/air), Refrigeration and Mechanlical Systems Technicians (the freezer repairmen) (land/air), Water Fuels and Environmental Technicians (the water and fuel cleaners) (land/air)

I may have missed some of the higher-ranked remuster trades (i.e. like the situation when Medical Technicians become sergeants/petty officers 2nd class and are remustered into Physician Assistants), but all this comes from the Canadian Forces recruiting site.
 
I agree, a certain amount of unification isn't the bad thing, but a complete unification is nonsence.;)

And in effect, a lot of what happened in the late 1960s and 1970s has been pretty much undone. What could be brought together into a single-service operation (basic training) is still one unit (there is one Canadian Forces Leadership and Recruit School at Saint-Jean-sur-Richelieu, Québec that handles all recruit training), while those that have to be "enviromental-specific" are split apart.

The recent renaming of Maritime Command, Land Forces Command and Air Command back to the Royal Canadian Navy, Canadian Army and Royal Canadian Air Force was just a symbolic return to what it was like before 1968.
 
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