WI: No Great Cause of Scotland.

Excited for this! I've made a bunch of Scottish maps of lordships, roads, earldoms, sheriffdoms, and ecclesiastical structure so let me know if you need any for reference or to be built for this TL specifically! Also, Scotland had great trade relations with German city-states, namely Hamburg, which William Wallace wrote to for aid during the 1st War of Indy. With a surviving (and even bigger) Berwick-based trade network, these links continue and Scotland could very well become a maritime power in the north sea.
Correct. Scotland had very strong trading links with the low countries ('Fleming' is one of the most common surnames in Berwickshire even now) but also with Scandinavia and nations round the Baltic. In many cases the links dated back to the missionaries who went out from Scotland to convert northern Europe in the few centuries after St. Columba. Ships from Aberdeen (or at least the Aberdeen coast) traded fish as far as Köln (Cologne), through Flanders - cod was even called something like 'aberdaan' for a while, iirc.
But (and it's quite a big but) the majority of Scottish trade OTL before the end of the 13th century went through and/or was with England. So it's not just peace with England which will help the Scottish economy, but the maintenance of trade routes/links. It wasn't just the rape of Berwick, vastly reducing the North Sea trade, but the loss of routes to more southerly nations which caused the Scottish economy to cease growing / shrink (depending on exactly when you look at). Trade with France, Italy, Spain, etc took a long time to get going again, whereas all those countries had had regular trade with Scotland before the English wars.
A journal article I read on trade said that Berwick spoke Flemish as a second language, so this can definitely continue!

EDIT: Just thinking about the butterflies, remember peace between Scotland and England is going to lead to a more stable northern England as well, and as a consequence, England might be able to better divert resources to Wales and France. :)
 
Excited for this! I've made a bunch of Scottish maps of lordships, roads, earldoms, sheriffdoms, and ecclesiastical structure so let me know if you need any for reference or to be built for this TL specifically! Also, Scotland had great trade relations with German city-states, namely Hamburg, which William Wallace wrote to for aid during the 1st War of Indy. With a surviving (and even bigger) Berwick-based trade network, these links continue and Scotland could very well become a maritime power in the north sea.

A journal article I read on trade said that Berwick spoke Flemish as a second language, so this can definitely continue!

EDIT: Just thinking about the butterflies, remember peace between Scotland and England is going to lead to a more stable northern England as well, and as a consequence, England might be able to better divert resources to Wales and France. :)
Oh yes please that would be massively helpful! Especially the
Earldoms as I’ll need to know which ones can be used for David abd Alphonso.

And awesome, in liking this more and more :)
 
Here's a map of Scotland in 1286 showing Earldoms, Lordships and Sherrifdoms.
kingdom_of_scotland__c__1286_by_procrastinating2much_dcq3rqr-fullview.jpg

EDIT: Somerled was the Lord of the Isles, but during this period the lordship was partitioned amongst his successors until it was reformed later.

Grant, A., 2007. Franchises North of the Border: Baronies and Regalities in Medieval Scotland. [Online]
Available at: eprints.lancs.ac.uk/633/
[Accessed 7 October 2018].

Lynch, M., 1992. Scotland: A New History. Pimlico ed. London: Pimlico.

McNeill, P. G. & MacQueen, H. L., 1998. An Atlas of Scottish History to 1707. Revised ed. Edinburgh: The Scottish Medievalists.
 
Here's a map of Scotland in 1286 showing Earldoms, Lordships and Sherrifdoms.
kingdom_of_scotland__c__1286_by_procrastinating2much_dcq3rqr-fullview.jpg

EDIT: Somerled was the Lord of the Isles, but during this period the lordship was partitioned amongst his successors until it was reformed later.

Grant, A., 2007. Franchises North of the Border: Baronies and Regalities in Medieval Scotland. [Online]
Available at: eprints.lancs.ac.uk/633/
[Accessed 7 October 2018].

Lynch, M., 1992. Scotland: A New History. Pimlico ed. London: Pimlico.

McNeill, P. G. & MacQueen, H. L., 1998. An Atlas of Scottish History to 1707. Revised ed. Edinburgh: The Scottish Medievalists.
You’re an absolute star, thank you! I take it the lands in yellowish orange were crown territory
 
You’re an absolute star, thank you! I take it the lands in yellowish orange were crown territory
No problem, that style of map is pretty quick to make so let me know if you need any custom made for the TL when you get round to writing it. Yes the unshaded areas are crown territory, although just looking at it like that is a little misleading as the further away from the 'core' of Scotland (the east) the less de-facto control the king had over it (the king would struggle to make any decision that impacted Lewis, for example, despite it lying within his own crown territory)
 
Here's a map of Scotland in 1286 showing Earldoms, Lordships and Sherrifdoms.
kingdom_of_scotland__c__1286_by_procrastinating2much_dcq3rqr-fullview.jpg

EDIT: Somerled was the Lord of the Isles, but during this period the lordship was partitioned amongst his successors until it was reformed later.

Grant, A., 2007. Franchises North of the Border: Baronies and Regalities in Medieval Scotland. [Online]
Available at: eprints.lancs.ac.uk/633/
[Accessed 7 October 2018].

Lynch, M., 1992. Scotland: A New History. Pimlico ed. London: Pimlico.

McNeill, P. G. & MacQueen, H. L., 1998. An Atlas of Scottish History to 1707. Revised ed. Edinburgh: The Scottish Medievalists.

Also query if Edward ii has his trouble with piers Galveston and the barons as per otl, could we see Alexander IV ride to the rescue of his cousin?
 
No problem, that style of map is pretty quick to make so let me know if you need any custom made for the TL when you get round to writing it. Yes the unshaded areas are crown territory, although just looking at it like that is a little misleading as the further away from the 'core' of Scotland (the east) the less de-facto control the king had over it (the king would struggle to make any decision that impacted Lewis, for example, despite it lying within his own crown territory)
Interesting, seeing Alexander and his descendants try and rectify that will be fascinating to explore
 
Also query if Edward ii has his trouble with piers Galveston and the barons as per otl, could we see Alexander IV ride to the rescue of his cousin?
I’m not sure, but before the Wars of Indy Scottish and English kings got on well, so I can see a scenario where Alexander IV sides with Edward II on Piers against the barons. If Alexander could get the Scottish political community on board with Edward as well, that might influence the politics in England and put pressure on the barons as well. Furthermore, Edward II became deeply unpopular later on in his reign in part because it was seen as if he ‘lost’ Scotland. So, without the war the whole barons revolt might not happen.
Interesting, seeing Alexander and his descendants try and rectify that will be fascinating to explore
In OTL, this change happened late in the middle ages, but if Scotland was more prosperous I can see a more stable king (of which there was few in OTL after the War) making this change much sooner.
 
I’m not sure, but before the Wars of Indy Scottish and English kings got on well, so I can see a scenario where Alexander IV sides with Edward II on Piers against the barons. If Alexander could get the Scottish political community on board with Edward as well, that might influence the politics in England and put pressure on the barons as well. Furthermore, Edward II became deeply unpopular later on in his reign in part because it was seen as if he ‘lost’ Scotland. So, without the war the whole barons revolt might not happen.
In OTL, this change happened late in the middle ages, but if Scotland was more prosperous I can see a more stable king (of which there was few in OTL after the War) making this change much sooner.
Okay quality that’s going to be a fascinating f thing to explore especially with the king of scots owning land In England.

And definitely :)
 
Another thing that I’ve been considering is whether I should keep Edward Is third son Alphonso alive or not given the pod one could see this as reasonable no?
 
Another thing that I’ve been considering is whether I should keep Edward Is third son Alphonso alive or not given the pod one could see this as reasonable no?
I'm for it. Shake things up a lot and you can really let your imagination run wild. Perhaps his continued survival and good health into marriage and adulthood helps his mother survive for several years longer, and both would lead to a much more different version of Edward into the future.
 
I'm for it. Shake things up a lot and you can really let your imagination run wild. Perhaps his continued survival and good health into marriage and adulthood helps his mother survive for several years longer, and both would lead to a much more different version of Edward into the future.

Agreed, and I also think it would be good for Edward Senior, his wife survives and his prophetic son survives, meaning he's not waiting for the dynasty to die on the shoulders of his fool of a namesake son
 
Agreed, and I also think it would be good for Edward Senior, his wife survives and his prophetic son survives, meaning he's not waiting for the dynasty to die on the shoulders of his fool of a namesake son
Edward in OTL became a much different person after Eleanor died. Just judging from everything I have ever read, she wasn't just the love of his life, they were best friends and confidantes to each other. They grew up with one another and relied on each other immensely. In a way, it kind of puts Edward's OTL actions against Scotland and beyond into perspective. He was still grieving in a way.
 
Edward in OTL became a much different person after Eleanor died. Just judging from everything I have ever read, she wasn't just the love of his life, they were best friends and confidantes to each other. They grew up with one another and relied on each other immensely. In a way, it kind of puts Edward's OTL actions against Scotland and beyond into perspective. He was still grieving in a way.

Agreed, and of course the 13th century being what it was, there would be no way he could deal with that grief without looking weak
 
Eleanor of Castile has always fascinated me. I first started getting into medieval history around the time Braveheart came out, when I was about 11. My only real resource at the time was an encyclopedia set, so I would get the broad overview of Edward, and would subsequently read there, glossing over the fact really, about the deep love he had for his queen. So over the years, that stuck with me, and I would get a little bit more info about the two of them. Clearly, Edward was a Stern, ruthless man, so it got me to wondering, what kind of woman must this Eleanor of Castile have been to have deserved that sort of love and devotion from a man like that? There would be bits and pieces, like the apocryphal story of Eleanor sucking the poison out of Edward's arm after the assassination attempt, or the fact that Edward never took any mistresses, and that they had upwards of 17 children together. She had to have been one hell of a woman.

Years later, as an adult, and with more resources available to me (especially from The Shadow Queen, and I intend on seeking out John Carmi Parsons' book on her too), I have a much better idea of why their marriage worked. They were a real couple, they had the same interests, had the same circle of friends, they both worked for a living (Eleanor's property business impressed me), they even seemed to have the same sort of sense of humor. He didn't just love her; he respected her capabilities in total and she did everything she could to bring the best out of him. Considering Edward couldn't have been more different from his own parents, Eleanor had to have seemed like a breath of fresh air and they immediately took the ball together and ran for years with it. They seemed to me like the medieval version of Tommy and Gina from Living on a Prayer. They were down for each other. So when someone like that is torn from you, even though Edward was probably expecting it as Eleanor had been sick for years before she died, his whole world shattered.
 
Eleanor of Castile has always fascinated me. I first started getting into medieval history around the time Braveheart came out, when I was about 11. My only real resource at the time was an encyclopedia set, so I would get the broad overview of Edward, and would subsequently read there, glossing over the fact really, about the deep love he had for his queen. So over the years, that stuck with me, and I would get a little bit more info about the two of them. Clearly, Edward was a Stern, ruthless man, so it got me to wondering, what kind of woman must this Eleanor of Castile have been to have deserved that sort of love and devotion from a man like that? There would be bits and pieces, like the apocryphal story of Eleanor sucking the poison out of Edward's arm after the assassination attempt, or the fact that Edward never took any mistresses, and that they had upwards of 17 children together. She had to have been one hell of a woman.

Years later, as an adult, and with more resources available to me (especially from The Shadow Queen, and I intend on seeking out John Carmi Parsons' book on her too), I have a much better idea of why their marriage worked. They were a real couple, they had the same interests, had the same circle of friends, they both worked for a living (Eleanor's property business impressed me), they even seemed to have the same sort of sense of humor. He didn't just love her; he respected her capabilities in total and she did everything she could to bring the best out of him. Considering Edward couldn't have been more different from his own parents, Eleanor had to have seemed like a breath of fresh air and they immediately took the ball together and ran for years with it. They seemed to me like the medieval version of Tommy and Gina from Living on a Prayer. They were down for each other. So when someone like that is torn from you, even though Edward was probably expecting it as Eleanor had been sick for years before she died, his whole world shattered.

Oh now that is very interesting, I'd always known they'd loved one another, I just didn't know it ran that deep. So, would you advise for the good of England and Scotland that Eleanor not fall ill and that she remain alive?
 
Oh now that is very interesting, I'd always known they'd loved one another, I just didn't know it ran that deep. So, would you advise for the good of England and Scotland that Eleanor not fall ill and that she remain alive?
Or if she begins to fall ill but then is made to recover fully and make some lifestyle changes. The last pregnancy was the start of her eventual health problems, none of which were helped at all by Eleanor constantly being on the road at Edward's side and running her own business all at the same time. So maybe she starts getting sick, is counseled and convinced to start taking it easy, and all that combined with Alphonso's survival and health, maybe leads Eleanor to get back to her previously robust health. I'm convinced Edward turns out much differently in these circumstances. Up until her death, he had a reputation for being a good, formidable, and fair negotiator. That rep was the reason he was asked to arbitrate the election of Scotland's king in OTL in 1291 and 1292. What the Scots didn't know is that at that point, Edward had changed a lot.
 
Or if she begins to fall ill but then is made to recover fully and make some lifestyle changes. The last pregnancy was the start of her eventual health problems, none of which were helped at all by Eleanor constantly being on the road at Edward's side and running her own business all at the same time. So maybe she starts getting sick, is counseled and convinced to start taking it easy, and all that combined with Alphonso's survival and health, maybe leads Eleanor to get back to her previously robust health. I'm convinced Edward turns out much differently in these circumstances. Up until her death, he had a reputation for being a good, formidable, and fair negotiator. That rep was the reason he was asked to arbitrate the election of Scotland's king in OTL in 1291 and 1292. What the Scots didn't know is that at that point, Edward had changed a lot.

Hmm interesting, so if she does fall ill, say after Edward junior's birth, and doesn't seem to get better, but then eventually starts getting better after taking it easy, that should do it perhaps? And I suppose having the chance to raise her children could help as well.
 
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