WI - National Bolshevik Russia after Russian Revolution?

Is there anyway any ideology resembling National Bolshevism could rise to power during and/or after the Russian Revolutions occur in 1917?
 
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That doesn't seem too difficult. Most of the tenets of National Bolshevism were adopted under Stalin but were also popular with a wide range of the population from general nationalists to limited monarchists. Have Lenin die early and a much more nationalist version of Bolshevism would probably be adopted earlier.
 
That doesn't seem too difficult. Most of the tenets of National Bolshevism were adopted under Stalin but were also popular with a wide range of the population from general nationalists to limited monarchists. Have Lenin die early and a much more nationalist version of Bolshevism would probably be adopted earlier.
Who would replace Lenin?
 
If Lenin had been offed or arrested on his way back to Russia someone else would come to the fore and would probably have supported continuation of the War. This gives greater potential for the rise of a more nationalistic version of Russian socialism where Russia was a victor at Versailles.
 
If Lenin had been offed or arrested on his way back to Russia someone else would come to the fore and would probably have supported continuation of the War. This gives greater potential for the rise of a more nationalistic version of Russian socialism where Russia was a victor at Versailles.
Could Stalin perhaps fill in this role?
 
Hard to say, I'm not really an authority on the pre-Revolutionary Bolsheviks, Mensheviks and left SRs but my instinct would be that he isn't really prominent enough nor has he garnered enough political capital and authority in 1917/18. He is a strong pragmatist though so it isn't impossible.
 
If you go to the ideology thread, there are a few variants which are particularly noteworthy. There was for instance Tsarbolsheviks who loved the economic side of things but also loved Tsarist autocracy.
 

azadi

Banned
Try my timeline "The 4th of July coup in Russia". But the regime of Russia in that timeline is however very different from OTL present-day National Bolshevism in Russia. The regime of Russia in that timeline is not antisemitic and it supports a moderate form of Russian nationalism. It supports a ceremonial Romanov Tsardom and a socialist planned economy, but with privately-owned agriculture and small enterprises.

Azadi
 
Try my timeline "The 4th of July coup in Russia". But the regime of Russia in that timeline is however very different from OTL present-day National Bolshevism in Russia. The regime of Russia in that timeline is not antisemitic and it supports a moderate form of Russian nationalism. It supports a ceremonial Romanov Tsardom and a socialist planned economy, but with privately-owned agriculture and small enterprises.
I've already seen that TL - by the way, can't wait for a new chapter!

But what do you think could happen if a National-Bolshevik regime rose to power?
 

azadi

Banned
It depends on the specific type of National-Bolshevik regime. Stalinism contains some elements of National-Bolshevism, so OTL Soviet Russia was to some extent National-Bolshevik. It depends especially of the degree of nationalism. If its a moderate form of Russian nationalism, as in "The 4th of July coup in Russia", then it will be a more traditionalist and conservative version of OTL Soviet Russia, which unlike OTL Soviet Russia considers itself a continuation of pre-Revolutionary Russian statehood and traditions, e.g. Russian Orthodox Christianity, and perhaps establishes a ceremonial Romanov Tsardom. If its an extreme form of Russian nationalism, it may be like a more socialist version of Nazi Germany. It will introduce anti-Semitic legislation and in the worst case commence systematic extermination of Russian Jews, and its foreign policy will be very aggressive and imperialist.

Azadi
 
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It depends on the specific type of National-Bolshevik regime. Stalinism contained some elements of National-Bolshevism, so OTL Soviet Russia was to some extent National-Bolshevik. It depends especially of the degree of nationalism. If its a moderate form of Russian nationalism, as in "The 4th of July coup in Russia", then it will be a more traditionalist and conservative version of OTL Soviet Russia, which unlike OTL Soviet Russia considers itself a continuation of pre-Revolutionary Russian statehood and traditions, e.g. Russian Orthodox Christianity, and perhaps establishes a ceremonial Romanov Tsardom. If its an extreme form of Russian nationalism, it may be like a more socialist version of Nazi Germany. It will introduce anti-Semitic legislation and in the worst case commence systematic extermination of Russian Jews, and its foreign policy will be very aggressive and imperialist.

Azadi
That's actually what I was thinking - an imperialist Russian Empire with Fascist tendencies and a Socialist economy that focused on a pan-Slavic foreign policy.
 

azadi

Banned
Concerning pan-Slavism, the Igor Aleksandrovich Shanskiy regime in "The 4th of July coup in Russia" rejects pan-Slavism and instead considers Russia a multi-ethnic country composed of both Slavic peoples and non-Slavic peoples. The Igor Aleksandrovich Shanskiy regime is in addition more oriented towards Asia than towards Europe.

Azadi
 
Concerning pan-Slavism, the Igor Aleksandrovich Shanskiy regime in "The 4th of July coup in Russia" rejects pan-Slavism and instead considers Russia a multi-ethnic country composed of both Slavic peoples and non-Slavic peoples. The Igor Aleksandrovich Shanskiy regime is in addition more oriented towards Asia than towards Europe.

Azadi
I'm not talking about your timeline - I'm talking about what a NazBol Russia might look like.
 

azadi

Banned
A NazBol Russia can, as I have said in a previous post, be both moderate nationalist and extreme nationalist. Concerning the subject of pan-Slavism, a moderate nationalist NazBol Russia will probably be less pan-Slavist than an extreme nationalist NazBol Russia, because a moderate nationalist Russia will be cultural nationalist instead of ethnic nationalist. A moderate nationalist Russia will consider itself a multiethnic state and embrace its ethnic diversity. It will view Russian culture as history and traditions binding the many ethnicities of Russia together in a multiethnic nation. Pan-Slavism is excluding of non-Slavic Russians and will as a result be most popular among supporters of Russian ethnic nationalism. The popularity of pan-Slavism in a NazBol Russia will be strengthened if Russia primarily pursues expansion in Eastern Europe and will be weakened if Russia primarily pursues expansion in Asia.

Azadi
 
A NazBol Russia can, as I have said in a previous post, be both moderate nationalist and extreme nationalist. Concerning the subject of pan-Slavism, a moderate nationalist NazBol Russia will probably be less pan-Slavist than an extreme nationalist NazBol Russia, because a moderate nationalist Russia will be cultural nationalist instead of ethnic nationalist. A moderate nationalist Russia will consider itself a multiethnic state and embrace its ethnic diversity. It will view Russian culture as history and traditions binding the many ethnicities of Russia together in a multiethnic nation. Pan-Slavism is excluding of non-Slavic Russians and will as a result be most popular among supporters of Russian ethnic nationalism. The popularity of pan-Slavism in a NazBol Russia will be strengthened if Russia primarily pursues expansion in Eastern Europe and will be weakened if Russia primarily pursues expansion in Asia.
How about pan-Orthodoxy?
 

azadi

Banned
Pan-Orthodoxy is more suitable for Russian cultural nationalism than pan-Slavism, because Orthodox Christianity has nothing to do with racial or ethnic origin and because Orthodox Christianity can be seen as a cultural trait that binds the many ethnicities of Russia together. But the problem is that many Russians are Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Yazidis or adherents of Siberian native religions. Moderate Russian nationalism will not consider Russia as a solely Orthodox Christian country, but will still consider Russian Orthodox Christianity an important part of Russian history and tradition. The popularity of pan-Orthodoxy will increase if Russia primarily pursues expansion in Eastern Europe including Greece and Finland and will decrease if Russia primarily pursues expansion in Asia.

Azadi
 
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