WI - More Homogenous Ethiopia?

OurSacredWar

OurSacredWar

Let me be clear that this thread is NOT intended to purposefully cause conflict but more so a product of my own curiosity on the subject - hopefully, it can be kept civil.
 

Wolttaire

have ethiopa defeat Islamic powers in the region and have it control that region for a long time and support Amharic culture in all those regions allowing it to spread
 

Ivan Lupo

There would likely have to be a significant policy of spreading their Tewahedo Orthodox faith wherever they go as well as one of Ethiopization or Amharicization of any newly conquered people. It would definitely help if Aksum was able to more thoroughly spread Christianity in Yemen where it couldn't be dislodged by a potential future spread of Islam, and even moreso if Aksum was able to spread and maintain solid control of territory all the way to and past the Horn of Africa, completely controlling all access to the Red Sea and Indian Ocean.
 
OurSacredWar

OurSacredWar

Ivan Lupo said:
There would likely have to be a significant policy of spreading their Tewahedo Orthodox faith wherever they go as well as one of Ethiopization or Amharicization of any newly conquered people.
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This reminded of something - Edmond J. Keller's "Revolutionary Ethiopia: From Empire to People's Republic" notes that Ethiopia never attempted to consciously project itself as a benevolent patron amongst newly-conquered peoples that accepted Ethiopian rule and this would lead to the ruling classes later being seen primarily as those who just exploited. If an Emperor does recognize this and actively pursues this while encouraging extensive assimilation, you might see more people identify with the cultures and religion of the dominating ethnic groups up north.
 
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Ivan Lupo

OurSacredWar said:
This reminded of something - Edmond J. Keller's "Revolutionary Ethiopia: From Empire to People's Republic" notes that Ethiopia never attempted to consciously project itself as a benevolent patron amongst newly-conquered peoples that accepted Ethiopian rule and this would lead to the ruling classes later being seen primarily as those who just exploited. If an Emperor does recognize this and actively pursues this, you might see more people identify with the cultures and religion of the dominating ethnic groups up north.
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I can't quite remember the thread here, but I do remember someone on this site mentioned that Ethiopia's geography not only helped shield it from conquest (especially from the Muslims right across the Red Sea), but also discouraged expansion in most directions, asides from along the Red Sea coast towards the east. If even a semi-powerful state was sitting there, knowing the Ethiopians could only come from that direction, it would be easy to keep them from expanding there.

It would also help if they could maintain a cozy trading relationship and alliance with the Eastern Roman Empire, while also being a bastion of Miaphysite Christianity far from the reach of Constantinople. The ERE, even despite this, would probably do more business through the Red Sea to get to India instead of constantly going heads up with Sassanid Persia. If they could spread their version of Christianity up both sides of the Red Sea, it could possibly butterfly the rise of Islam. If they could somehow manage to expand down the Nile to the African Great Lakes and simultaneously towards the Swahili Coast, they could really cement themselves for a very long time and encourage further subjects to further assimilate.
 

Brodydaboss

A good way to have a more homogeneous Ethiopia is to have the oromo migrations either be more successful and completely replace the natives or have it not occur whatsoever.
 
OurSacredWar

OurSacredWar

Ivan Lupo said:
I can't quite remember the thread here, but I do remember someone on this site mentioned that Ethiopia's geography not only helped shield it from conquest (especially from the Muslims right across the Red Sea), but also discouraged expansion in most directions, asides from along the Red Sea coast towards the east. If even a semi-powerful state was sitting there, knowing the Ethiopians could only come from that direction, it would be easy to keep them from expanding there.

It would also help if they could maintain a cozy trading relationship and alliance with the Eastern Roman Empire, while also being a bastion of Miaphysite Christianity far from the reach of Constantinople. The ERE, even despite this, would probably do more business through the Red Sea to get to India instead of constantly going heads up with Sassanid Persia. If they could spread their version of Christianity up both sides of the Red Sea, it could possibly butterfly the rise of Islam. If they could somehow manage to expand down the Nile to the African Great Lakes and simultaneously towards the Swahili Coast, they could really cement themselves for a very long time and encourage further subjects to further assimilate.
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One of the main things that discouraged Ethiopian expansion was the agricultural staple and the presence of the tsetse fly but these were mainly found in regions to the south of the modern Ethiopian border as well - however, a surviving Adal Sultanate could play the same role of deterring Ethiopian expansionism into the eastern regions of the Horn.

Could an alliance with the Sassanids work instead?
Brodydaboss said:
A good way to have a more homogeneous Ethiopia is to have the oromo migrations either be more successful and completely replace the natives or have it not occur whatsoever.
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You'd need to have quite a few Oromos adopt Habesha traditions and Orthodox Christianity to match what the OP says - regarding the latter, that could potentially happen if Ethiopia had been introduced to firearms by the Portuguese and manages to recruit the Portuguese as advisors to train Ethiopian troops under Emperor Dawit II before the war with Adal occurs. By the time Ahmad Gran decides to launch his invasion, Ethiopia might be able to repel his armies with steady Portuguese assistance and re-rout most of the Oromo penetration into the eastern regions of the Horn of Africa similarly to the way the Ajuran Sultanate did.
 
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PuffyClouds

PuffyClouds

I really hate that tsetse fly.

If Axum had maintained control of Yemen a portion of the wealth from the increased trade opportunities it presented would have been redistributed in the Ethiopian heartland. The increased commercial opportunities would have helped to bind together the people there. Perhaps if a line of kings had taken the benevolent philosophy that @OurSacredWar had mentioned, this could have been accomplished. It would be difficult for Axum to hold together down through the centuries, but that is not necessarily contrary to the question of the opening post. There is some kind of possibility that the cultural memory of an empire, or united kingdom, will linger and the legacy will reconstitute itself at a later date.
 
OurSacredWar

OurSacredWar

Koprulu Mustafa Pasha said:
Possible but with either smaller borders or borderline genocide. And no Oromo invasion.
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How successful would Ethiopia be in "borderline genocide"? I have my doubts but one way it could occur is having the 1890s Rinderpest Epizootic hit the Horn of Africa harder, particularly the Oromo populace and manages to wipe out a huge chunk of them (some 2/3rds???) which allows for easier Ethiopian expansion under Emperor Menelik II. Combined with the settlement of the newly-conquered regions by Habesha immigrants from Old Ethiopia and the Ethiopian government's active assimilationist attempts, the Oromo population gradually decreases while the numbers of the Habesha ethnic groups grow with the native elites proclaiming themselves to be "Habesha". The same occurs with the various ethnic groups in southern Ethiopia where a combination of assimilation and settlement of loyal assimilated ethnic groups makes it so that no one can quite tell who is and who isn't a Habesha over time - with the exception of Somalis in southeastern Ethiopia but we could avoid having a major Somali population if Ethiopia doesn't end up conquering the majority of the Ogaden.
 
twistedirregular

twistedirregular

OurSacredWar said:
After finding the post above, it made me wonder - what if Ethiopia had remained a more homogenous country that is mostly Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Christian and Amharic-speaking? How could this be achieved prior to 1900?
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It could happen if Ethiopia either remains smaller, is actively assimilationist as @OurSacredWar points out and/or avoids the bulk of the Oromo penetration during the 15th Century.
 
OurSacredWar

OurSacredWar

PuffyClouds said:
If Axum had maintained control of Yemen a portion of the wealth from the increased trade opportunities it presented would have been redistributed in the Ethiopian heartland. The increased commercial opportunities would have helped to bind together the people there. Perhaps if a line of kings had taken the benevolent philosophy that @OurSacredWar had mentioned, this could have been accomplished. It would be difficult for Axum to hold together down through the centuries, but that is not necessarily contrary to the question of the opening post. There is some kind of possibility that the cultural memory of an empire, or united kingdom, will linger and the legacy will reconstitute itself at a later date.
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This essentially occurred IOTL, with the Zagwe Dynasty being the reconstituted Kingdom that Aksum previously was but I'm not sure how likely it is for Aksum/Ethiopia to hold Yemen.
 
OurSacredWar

OurSacredWar

twistedirregular said:
It could happen if Ethiopia either remains smaller, is actively assimilationist as @OurSacredWar points out and/or avoids the bulk of the Oromo penetration during the 15th Century.
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Ethiopia avoiding the Oromo penetration in the aftermath of the war with Adal would definitely assist in the establishment of a homogenous Ethiopia - what would the effects be?
 
twistedirregular

twistedirregular

OurSacredWar said:
Ethiopia avoiding the Oromo penetration in the aftermath of the war with Adal would definitely assist in the establishment of a homogenous Ethiopia - what would the effects be?
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Aside from a more homogenous Ethiopia, you might also see a more stable Ethiopia as a result of avoiding the use of Oromos to counter the Habesha nobility by Ethiopian Emperors later on. This could be avoided with the Ethiopian-Adal War either being avoided or ending in an early and decisive Ethiopian victory.
 
OurSacredWar

OurSacredWar

twistedirregular said:
Aside from a more homogenous Ethiopia, you might also see a more stable Ethiopia as a result of avoiding the use of Oromos to counter the Habesha nobility by Ethiopian Emperors later on. This could be avoided with the Ethiopian-Adal War either being avoided or ending in an early and decisive Ethiopian victory.
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Or if the Walashma Dynasty is completely wiped out in Amda Tseyon's campaigns against the various Sultanates instead of fleeing to establish the future Adalite Sultanate IOTL.
 
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