WI: Maria Theresia Gives Birth to a Son in Karl VI's Lifetime?

[JonasResende]

Maria Theresia, Queen of Hungary & Bohemia, Archduchess of Austria, Grand Duchess of Tuscany, only had her first son (Josef II) in 1741, after her father Karl VI had died the previous year. However, she'd had more than a few daughters (Maria Elisabeth (b.1737), Maria Anna (b.1738) and Maria Karoline (b.1740)) before Karl VI's death in October 1740.

So, what if one of those first three pregnancies (maybe even the first one) had been born male? Would this significantly alter history? Since, from what I can make out, the fact that there was no male Habsburg or even a male Habsburg-Lorraine when Karl VI died, was part of the reason that the War of the Austrian Succession broke out.

Would the Bavarians be able to gain any traction if Karl VI had had a male grandson (albeit an infant)? Or would things still follow more or less the same route

 

[Carp]

I don't think it would have made much of a difference. The question of the imperial succession would still be contested between Charles Albert and Francis Stephen, as a child could not be elected emperor. Of course a contested imperial election need not necessarily lead to war, but the existence of a little Habsburg-Lorraine prince would certainly not alter Frederick's course of action (as he cared nothing for legality save as a fig leaf for his rapacity), nor would it diminish Belle-Isle's argument for France's involvement: to wit, that even if the imperial crown were gained by Charles Albert to the advantage of France, the permanent eclipse of Austrian power in Germany could only be accomplished by Austria's territorial reduction, and in particular the seizure of Bohemia (the sole Habsburg electorate).

 

[Max Sinister]

Maybe the problem wasn't so much that Maria Theresia was a woman. As one of Karl's advisors told him, he should better left his daughter a standing army and a full treasury instead of "a piece of paper".

 

[Space Oddity]

Maybe the problem wasn't so much that Maria Theresia was a woman. As one of Karl's advisors told him, he should better left his daughter a standing army and a full treasury instead of "a piece of paper".

Eugene of Savoy.

 

[Emperor Constantine]

The only way this might change is if Karl decided that the birth of a grandson meant he was willing to give up on having a son (the Emperor seemed to have this bizarre belief that he would outlive his wife, remarry and have a male heir) and arranged for François of Lorraine's election as King of the Romans. That would, in theory, allow the Habsburgs to tap the resources of the Empire during the Austrian succession war by proclaiming the Imperial ban against Prussia and Bavaria. Now what effects, if any, this might have I don't know, but that's all I can think of.

 

[Benevolence]

Another possible thing would be internal support, especially in Bohemia. The succession would be seen as more "stable" as their is a male heir.

 

[JonasResende]

The only way this might change is if Karl decided that the birth of a grandson meant he was willing to give up on having a son (the Emperor seemed to have this bizarre belief that he would outlive his wife, remarry and have a male heir) and arranged for François of Lorraine's election as King of the Romans. That would, in theory, allow the Habsburgs to tap the resources of the Empire during the Austrian succession war by proclaiming the Imperial ban against Prussia and Bavaria. Now what effects, if any, this might have I don't know, but that's all I can think of.

Considering that Karl VI only died because someone fed him a plate of poisoned mushrooms, and his wife was overweight (she needed a machine to lower her into chairs) possibly with cirrhosis due to the constant alcohol a doctor prescribed her as a fertility drug, I think Karl's idea might not have been so bizarre. Just saying.

Another possible thing would be internal support, especially in Bohemia. The succession would be seen as more "stable" as their is a male heir.

Which begs the question, Fritz will presumably still do as OTL, but whether anyone else will move? Bavaria is going to find it very difficult to take the Bohemian crown from the "rightful" male heir, no? And France would probably not back them to do it. OTL, France's interests were in weakening Habsburg power - and lacking a male heir, that was easy. What's France gonna get out of backing Bavaria here? And it's not as though Bohemia has never done the regency bit before.

 

[JCVocke]

Maria Theresa already having a Son probably significantly improves the internal support for her amongst the Kingdoms of the Habsburg Monarchy as said, however what hasn't been said is that this is probably most useful in Hungary. Once Maria had a Son she presented herself and him to the Hungarian Diet and managed to raise a pretty massive army, but that only happened after the initial Prussian Victory in Silesia and French Successes in Bohemia. This Hungarian Army was where the tide turned and Austria was able to go on the offensive against France-Bavaria-Saxony in particular. If she already has a Son then I think its logical that she'll be able to raise this massive army at the beginning of the war, so she'll have it to commit to fighting Prussia at the outset. Considering the initial Prussian attack had its own problems and Freddy King Junior was not some God General but an actual human who made mistakes and actually effectively lost the first battle he commanded until one of his subordinate generals won it for him after he left, if Maria has the Hungarian Army from the beginning then that's probably enough to tip that balance into an Austrian Victory.

If she manages to Crush Prussia early, then its likely Bavaria starts getting cold feet about the whole thing. Saxony probably nopes out before it even begins considering that's how they behaved in the historical war and "The War of Austrian Succession" might wind up be a couple weeks or months at most and just against Prussia.

 

[unprincipled peter]

Considering that Karl VI only died because someone fed him a plate of poisoned mushrooms, and his wife was overweight (she needed a machine to lower her into chairs) possibly with cirrhosis due to the constant alcohol a doctor prescribed her as a fertility drug, I think Karl's idea might not have been so bizarre. Just saying.



Which begs the question, Fritz will presumably still do as OTL, but whether anyone else will move? Bavaria is going to find it very difficult to take the Bohemian crown from the "rightful" male heir, no? And France would probably not back them to do it. OTL, France's interests were in weakening Habsburg power - and lacking a male heir, that was easy. What's France gonna get out of backing Bavaria here? And it's not as though Bohemia has never done the regency bit before.

I'm a bit amazed that the mushroom thing is so underused as a POD. I posed it as a WI once and was met with mostly silence (of course, most of my thread starts go that way ). The wife's horrendous medical advice is another major POD opportunity, and yet another example of the 'science' of days gone by.

As for France's entry, assuming the early Prussian victory, it wouldn't be surprising to see France looking to try taking advantage somehow. Plus, Prussia would not have long term staying power, economically, so France would almost be forced to join in eventually lest Austria gains at Prussian expense.

 

[LeCHVCK]

I don't think it would have made much of a difference. The question of the imperial succession would still be contested between Charles Albert and Francis Stephen, as a child could not be elected emperor. Of course a contested imperial election need not necessarily lead to war, but the existence of a little Habsburg-Lorraine prince would certainly not alter Frederick's course of action (as he cared nothing for legality save as a fig leaf for his rapacity), nor would it diminish Belle-Isle's argument for France's involvement: to wit, that even if the imperial crown were gained by Charles Albert to the advantage of France, the permanent eclipse of Austrian power in Germany could only be accomplished by Austria's territorial reduction, and in particular the seizure of Bohemia (the sole Habsburg electorate).

Why would a kid be unelectable wasn't Heinrich IV or a different Salian King of the Romans since he was a child?

 

[Historymaster]

The Golden Bull forbid it. It came later than the Salian Dinasty.