WI: Malcolm X lives

I've done a search, and it's been three years -- so let's have a new discussion, eh?

I'm reading Malcolm X: A Life of Reinvention by Manning Marable; in the introduction, the author points out a few specific things on the day of his assassination that, if done differently, could have led to the attempt on his life failing. Including the decision not to search people filing in to the OAAU event, and (if I remember correctly) the decision to not have Malcolm's bodyguard next to him while he was speaking.

And even if you don't have any of that change, I'd imagine it'd be pretty easy to have Malcolm only be wounded.

So...

What kind of fallout would result from a failed assassination attempt, if the attempt even goes forward? And overall, what would the future hold for Malcolm? He was only 39 when he was assassinated -- he could have possibly been alive today, at the age of 88.

Also, how likely is it that there would have been other assassination attempts, really?
 
I'm not fully versed in everything regarding the man, but IIRC he was starting to moderate much of his position shortly before his death. So, assuming that he survives for a significant period of time afterward, I could imagine a less chaotic sixties. This could also butterfly away MLK's own assassination. The question is just how the lack of these two deaths affects the civil rights movement and how it is received by the rest of the country. On the one hand, having the two most visible and well known civil rights leaders(of OTL anyway) survive the sixties means that the perhaps it doesn't peter out after its initial successes which could lead to a better situation race-relations wise. On the other hand, much of the reason for these two men being so well known today is because they died, and the sympathy garnered for the civil rights movement by the deaths of two of it's most visible leaders won't exist ITTL.
 
I think he would have continued to move away from his NOI views, but would have became very vocal against the Vietnam war and the number of poor black men being sent to die in Vietnam. He probably would have supported MLK's efforts with the Chicago Freedom Movement campaign but would say he (King) was naive to think he could be successful in Chicago with a non-violent philosophy. I think he would have started advocating more socialist beliefs maybe even going to visit the Soviet Union. He would have continued to write books and make speeches at universities around the world. He would have been supportive of the Black Panther Party becoming friends with Bobby Seale and Huey Newton. They would have named him "Chairman Emeritus" of the Black Panther Party.

He would have been an early advocate for the end to apartheid in South Africa and the freeing of Nelson Mandela. I think MLK would have still been murdered in 1968. I think Malcolm X would have grieved MLK's death but also saw it (along with RFK's murder) as proof that non-violence was not effective. He would have called for a more militant response from black America in the days after MLK's death. But after seeing the destruction and deaths from all the rioting, he would have saw that violence was not the answer and called for black America to "defend themselves but not go looking for trouble and destroy their own neighborhoods."

When Nixon becomes president he would have been on Nixon's enemies list. Into the 70s he would have become disillusioned with black militancy and ended his association with the Black Panthers when they became more focused on fighting the police than social change. Into the 1970s he would have began teaching as a professor, writing more books, making speeches for civil rights, and appearing on TV shows like Meet The Press more often. As the 70s progressed and the Civil Rights Movement received less attention and participation, Malcolm X would have focused more on academia and become more involved with ending apartheid in South Africa. He likely would have grown an afro and worn dashiki during this period. He likely would have opposed school busing.

Into the 1980s he would have been a vocal critic of Ronald Reagan and Reaganomics. He would have supported and helped campaign for MLK Day. In 1984 as a protest towards Reagan's policies, I could see him running for president becoming the nominee of the Socialist Workers Party, getting around 30,000 votes. He would have spoken out about the spread of crack cocaine in inner city black neighborhoods. He would have continued to try to bring awareness to apartheid and he would have gone to South Africa to greet Mandela when he is released in 1990.

In the 1990s there would have likely been no X movie in 1992. He would have kept writing, teaching, and advocating through most of the 90s, retiring sometime in the late 90s. He would have been highly critical of George W. Bush after 9/11. He would have blamed decades of U.S. involvement in Middle Eastern affairs for the cause of 9/11. He would have equated the Iraq war to the Vietnam war and called on young black men and women not to enlist and called for black soldiers and marines to desert. He would have been criticized by conservatives in the media as unpatriotic and called an al-Queda sympathizer.

By 2005 he would have been 80 years old. So this could be around the time he dies of old age. But I'll continue on so he can see the candidacy of Barack Obama in 2008. He would have supported Obama's candidacy and proud to see his election win. I think because of Malcolm X's long association with socialistic ideology, President Obama would be hesitant to associate with Malcolm X. I think by now he would probably make fewer and fewer public appearances do to his advanced age.
 
Thank you for your input.

Malcolm X with an afro? I prefer his "Obama with glasses and a sick goatee" look.

(bump)
 
I hate to be a dick but I question if civil rights could've gone so far without turning King and Malcolm being turned into martyrs. MLK and MX were obviously extremely controversial in their time - and not just for the obvious reasons - and I imagine without dying at the time, they, well, wouldn't be remembered the same way.
 
Thank you for your input.

Malcolm X with an afro? I prefer his "Obama with glasses and a sick goatee" look.

(bump)

LOL. Well it would have been the 70s. Everybody who lived through it probably regrets their hairstyles and wardrobe during that decade.

Honestly I could even see MLK growing a little afro if he had lived through the 1970s. Ralph Abernathy and Andrew Young had mini afros and sideburns in the 70s.
 
LOL. Well it would have been the 70s. Everybody who lived through it probably regrets their hairstyles and wardrobe during that decade.

Honestly I could even see MLK growing a little afro if he had lived through the 1970s. Ralph Abernathy and Andrew Young had mini afros and sideburns in the 70s.

Didn't Obama have one too? Or am I mistaken?
 
Didn't Obama have one too? Or am I mistaken?

Seems Fallon found an old pic of it.

barack-rocked-an-afro-fallon-pulls-out-a-photo-of-obama-with-a-fro-during-his-college-years.jpg
 
I hate to be a dick but I question if civil rights could've gone so far without turning King and Malcolm being turned into martyrs. MLK and MX were obviously extremely controversial in their time - and not just for the obvious reasons - and I imagine without dying at the time, they, well, wouldn't be remembered the same way.

By the time MLK was killed in 1968 the Civil Rights Movement as we know it was pretty much over because of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and Voting Rights Act of 1965. Most of the movement consisted of desegregation and voting rights. By 1965 most of that was accomplished. That's why IMO MLK moved on to the Poor People's Campaign during the last year of his life.

I think after the Voting Rights Act became law a lot of the steam went out of the Civil Rights Movement. Those two laws alone were enough to make MLK and to a lesser extent Malcolm X, legends and a part of American history.

Like I said I think Malcolm X probably would have aligned with the Black Panthers for a while, spoke out about "poor black boys dying in a rich white man's war." I think he would have did a lot of writing, lecturing, and teaching for the rest of his life.

I think MLK would have continued to push for fair housing, equal opportunity employment, and higher wages to end poverty. I think young blacks would continue to become more militant going into the 70s and pretty much ignore and rebuff MLK's message of non-violence. MLK would lose influence and because of his opposition to the Vietnam war and his strong criticism of American foreign policy, he would be seen by many as unpatriotic and anti-American. I think with Nixon being in the White House, MLK would further become marginalized. He would have been on Nixon's enemies list. I think some of his colleagues in the SCLC would have left him because of MLK's growing focus on things that weren't directly connected to civil rights. I think because of all this MLK would have received less media attention and gone back to preaching and ministering. He would have still written books and continued to visit colleges to make speeches though. I could also see MLK getting heavily involved with the anti-apartheid movement. Calling for boycotts and trying to raise awareness.

Considering MLK had the heart of a man in his 60s when he died at age 39 in OTL. He might not have lived to see the 1990s. He smoked cigarettes and probably ate a lot of unhealthy food (like most southern soul food is). Those things along with the large amount of stress he lived with, I see heart disease taking MLK sometime in the 1980s.

If MLK had lived to at least the 1980s, he would not have a holiday today but would have probably still have the King Center in Atlanta. He'd still be a civil rights icon. Have a postage stamp, and have schools and streets named after him.
 
I really want to give a longer reply to this but I have some errands to run at the moment, perhaps I will do so later. But I would say that even if he survived, the only chance he might live out the 60s and longer is if he moved overseas.

He had accumulated so many enemies. In particular, the NoI, FBI and the CIA. He had a few friends in the Middle East and in Africa, but even the slimey tentacles of the CIA reached that far. There were COINTELPRO infiltrators in his own organisation, including his own security staff. :(
 
Aozhouhuaren has one thing right - Malcolm was a marked men in many organizations and probably wouldn't have lived out the '60s in New York City. Unless a failed assassination brought down the hammer on Louis X/Farrakhan and the whole NOI, I don't see them stopping at one try. Maybe if he lived in Cuba for a few years like Robert F. Williams until things were less charged, or went on another African trip - but he wouldn't have been safe in New York in 1965. Maybe a POD that starts with him not coming back to the US for a longer period of time?

But had Malcolm lived, and been in communication with black nationalist groups in the US, he would've probably tilted them towards Africa more than China, and that would've impacted the Panthers and therefore the New Communist Movement may not have had as much of a Maoist character. He may have played a part in the Vietnam anti-war movement and pan-African and socialist groups (particularly the Socialist Workers Party who were the socialists closest to him) may have been slightly more influential than some of the OTL New Left for that reason.

MLK would be an interesting case - he already felt like there was a ton of pressure from radicalizing student youth in SNCC and CORE, and if Malcolm were still around it would've been double. I think he would've still had the same trajectory - a step in a more "radical" direction, talking about revolution but sidelined from among the people doing the actual work. If he was assassinated, Malcolm would have definitely drawn conclusions from it - that nonviolence wasn't working. He may also have slowed down the integration of African Americans into the Democratic Party after Civil Rights.

I think the failure of the African regimes to create any lasting success would have hit Malcolm like a ton of bricks, and he possibly would have shifted pretty hard in the '70s and '80s, and he would have stopped being a major leader like Stokely Carmichael or Huey Newton did after a certain point. I imagine his thought would go through a few more iterations, and he would definitely have been supportive of the ANC in South Africa and the anti-apartheid movement - and really hard on the kind of compromises they made and the society they created.

Malcolm would not have been as iconic as he was. He would be famous, but not in the way that reached a crescendo with Spike Lee's film. I also don't think he would have written all that much - Malcolm was a speaker, not a writer, and would have continued to speak. All of the books that he's credited with are transcripts of speeches, and the Autobiography is based on recorded conversations with Alex Haley.

I think the remnant of black nationalism would be in somewhat better shape, but nothing too tremendous gets shifted.
 
His work could further the spread of more traditional Islam. In addition he called on American blacks to use UN human rights law to challenge the status quo.
 
I don't see how canceling Malcom's Assasination prevents MLK's. If Malcom lived he would spend time fighting against poverty. I think he would have kept his NOI views on self help
 
Even if Malcolm X does live to see Obama run for president*, we can't be sure Malcolm X would see it as a good thing. For most of his life, Malcolm X's philosophy would reject Obama as an Uncle Tom. Perhaps that would have evolved with time, but I think there was a video of Cornell West or somebody lambasting Obama for taking his oath of office on MLK's bible and saying Obama doesn't stand for the principles of MLK. Historical Malcolm X's position undoubtably would be profoundly critical of Obama, and ATL living Malcolm X *probably* wouldn't be much nicer to him.


*Assuming Obama's existence as a politician isn't butterflied away.
 
Malcolm X's continued life... incredible to contemplate. His energy, intellect and ability to command attention on a large scale are butterfly tsunamis. Just his way of speaking and presenting himself would influence how public figures conduct themselves to a drastic extent.
 
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