WI MacCartney Embassy succeeds?

Let's say Qianlong dies. The new emperor decides to open up trade with Britain as well as permit extraterritoriality in certain ports. Does this reverse the trade imbalance with the silver outflow to China being much reduced? I'm assuming British manufactured goods and technological products find some demand in China. Will this in turn butterfly away the opium wars when the Qing govt tries to outlaw it and seize opium without compensation?
 
This is the age of Imperialism. It depends on if the Qing government “pulls a Meiji” through wider trade and earlier diplomatic normalization. If no then sooner or later Britain and other European empires will take a bite out of China over some disagreement.
 
This is the age of Imperialism. It depends on if the Qing government “pulls a Meiji” through wider trade and earlier diplomatic normalization. If no then sooner or later Britain and other European empires will take a bite out of China over some disagreement.

But let's say British trades are already making profits selling across China, such as their manufactured goods as well as stuff from other colonies. Of course they try to sell opium too, but like OTL China bans it, now Britain has to choose between accepting the ban or going to war and risk losing all the trade with China that they've had for several decades. They might just accept the ban and confiscation instead of going to war.
 
But let's say British trades are already making profits selling across China, such as their manufactured goods as well as stuff from other colonies. Of course they try to sell opium too, but like OTL China bans it, now Britain has to choose between accepting the ban or going to war and risk losing all the trade with China that they've had for several decades. They might just accept the ban and confiscation instead of going to war.

First Britain had a mercantilst policy. They might not fight over opium, but they will demand more ports, interior trade, more extra-territoriality, more diplomatic residents, more market access for a wide variety of products.

Second they had a colonialist policy. Britain may want territorial control over Vietnam, Taiwan, access to Korea, Tibet for example. At some point military force will dictate those terms.
 
First Britain had a mercantilst policy. They might not fight over opium, but they will demand more ports, interior trade, more extra-territoriality, more diplomatic residents, more market access for a wide variety of products.

Second they had a colonialist policy. Britain may want territorial control over Vietnam, Taiwan, access to Korea, Tibet for example. At some point military force will dictate those terms.
A China that agrees to these demands are most certainly more OK to Industrialization, the question is will China industrialized enough by the time Britain is hungry for more?
 
Second they had a colonialist policy. Britain may want territorial control over Vietnam, Taiwan, access to Korea, Tibet for example. At some point military force will dictate those terms.

I don't think this is correct as the British were willing to acknowledge China was not India, it was unified rather than fractious and the cost of obtaining these territorial possessions may be greater than any benefit, particularly the benefit forsaken by loss of trade and the Chinese market, ect. It would simply be more profitable to do trade rather than engage in war against China.
 
The problem isn't Britain, as most people here seem to think, but China. A different Emperor would have the same mindset. China is the center of the world, trade is so unimportant it's disguised as 'tribute', any foreign monarchs had to accept status a vassal to the Chinese Emperor, and barbarians from the sea were no threat.

Heck, even after the total military superiority Britain demonstrated in the First Opium War, getting the Chinese to accept anything approaching reality was very tough. And often involved mandarins lying to the Emperor to save both China and their own lives.

Failing such a demonstration, there is no conceivable way the Emperor would accept Britain as an equal.

Of course, once such a demonstration HAS happened, Britain won't accept China as an equal....
 
I don't think this is correct as the British were willing to acknowledge China was not India, it was unified rather than fractious and the cost of obtaining these territorial possessions may be greater than any benefit, particularly the benefit forsaken by loss of trade and the Chinese market, ect. It would simply be more profitable to do trade rather than engage in war against China.

You’re either keeping up or falling behind. War is very profitable if victory is easy and certain. Why trade when you can take?
 
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