WI John Brown and Sons are killed at Pottawatomie?

The Vulture

Banned
Let's suppose one of John Brown's intended victims (for argument's sake, James Doyle, the first) somehow gets advance word of the hit squad Brown is putting together. In response, he calls in some favors, fortifies his cabin, and lies in wait. In short, John Brown and his men find twenty armed and motivated people waiting for them. After a brief struggle, Brown and his followers are all killed or captured.

So what does this mean for Bleeding Kansas and the leadup to the Civil War? Where are we without Harper's Ferry?
 

maverick

Banned
I think that abolitionists will ultimately win in Kansas, and can even use Brown as a local martyr for the cause, ambushed by the dastardly border ruffians.

I wonder if there is any radical leader amongst the abolitionists who could be a daring and controversial as Brown, or could pull off some of his crazy stunts.

Not sure about Harper's Ferry, though.
 
I'd venture that the ACW would be slightly delayed, a couple years at most. What with tensions building (without John Brown serving as a fire-starter), the whole thing would likely be even more vitriolic than OTL.
 

The Vulture

Banned
Which leads to the question whether Lincoln would be elected without Harper's Ferry. The whole thing was quite an ordeal for both sides, led to a lot of polarization.
 
Which leads to the question whether Lincoln would be elected without Harper's Ferry. The whole thing was quite an ordeal for both sides, led to a lot of polarization.

Good question. I'd say that probably not, it really did make the division split a lot faster than they would have other wise. Without the raid happening, tensions would have more time to build up, and thus a higher "saturation point", so to speak.
 

maverick

Banned
Well, I thought Lincoln was the moderate one, picked as the candidate to show people that Republicans weren't all crazy radicals like Sumner, Seward, Chase and Freemont.

I don't know if the war could be postponed for years, though. It depends on how events develop without HF, I guess, and the election of 1860 in a way.

Could the Democrats be united in 1860 without HF? Maybe Douglas or someone else wins the Democratic nomination that year?
 
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