WI Joan II of Navarre was born a male?

As asked in the title. IOTL Joan II of Navarre was in the middle of a French succession crisis after the death of her infant half-brother John I. Being a female child (and with rumours of being a bastard) made her be excluded from sucession, and the throne went to her uncle Philip V. So, if she had been born a male instead (prince John?) would this new heir be accepted, or would her paternity still be challenged by Philip?
 
There were a few suspicions on the legitimacy of Joan II because her mother had commited adultery. If Joan is born John, I guess Philippe of Poitiers could try to use that argument to have himself proclaimed King. However, I don't think that would be very successful because baby John would have the same supports as he had as female OTL, most notably the Duke of Burgundy, Charles of La Marche (OTL Charles IV of France) and a few other great nobles. In fact, it's possible that TTL John I would get even more support than OTL Joan II which would be troublesome for Philippe.

Plus, Philippe could be satisfied enough with the Regency: he got it while Clemence of Hungary was still pregnant with OTL John I. Here, he would probably also obtain it for his 4 year old nephew. And if he really wants the crown, he could just poison his nephew: it's a dark rumor with no proof (exploited a bit by Maurice Druon in The Accursed Kings), but he is suspected of having OTL John I poisonned so that he could become King.

Wonder who TTL John I would marry though if he is to live up to adulthood. Maybe Philippe of Poitiers' eldest daughter? That way, he would get the Counties of Burgundy (Franche-Comté) and Artois.
 
There were a few suspicions on the legitimacy of Joan II because her mother had commited adultery. If Joan is born John, I guess Philippe of Poitiers could try to use that argument to have himself proclaimed King. However, I don't think that would be very successful because baby John would have the same supports as he had as female OTL, most notably the Duke of Burgundy, Charles of La Marche (OTL Charles IV of France) and a few other great nobles. In fact, it's possible that TTL John I would get even more support than OTL Joan II which would be troublesome for Philippe.

Plus, Philippe could be satisfied enough with the Regency: he got it while Clemence of Hungary was still pregnant with OTL John I. Here, he would probably also obtain it for his 4 year old nephew. And if he really wants the crown, he could just poison his nephew: it's a dark rumor with no proof (exploited a bit by Maurice Druon in The Accursed Kings), but he is suspected of having OTL John I poisonned so that he could become King.

Wonder who TTL John I would marry though if he is to live up to adulthood. Maybe Philippe of Poitiers' eldest daughter? That way, he would get the Counties of Burgundy (Franche-Comté) and Artois.

I think there could be even earlier butterflies here. If Margaret of Burgundy gives to Louis X a son, would the French king really bring up the Tour de Nesle Affair and so give doubts to "John's" legitimacy? I mean, while Louis only had girl it would be more easily accepted that he could remarry and have a heir, but here it would affect the (until then) recognized Dauphin.
 
Gonzaga said:
I think there could be even earlier butterflies here. If Margaret of Burgundy gives to Louis X a son, would the French king really bring up the Tour de Nesle Affair and so give doubts to "John's" legitimacy? I mean, while Louis only had girl it would be more easily accepted that he could remarry and have a heir, but here it would affect the (until then) recognized Dauphin.
Good point. Plus, it does seem like something Philippe IV of France, Louis X's father, would do to avoid the Royal family trouble regarding the legitimacy of a future King. The Tour de Nesle Scandal could probably be hidden and resolved in secrecy.

The question then is that of the relationship between Louis X and Margaret of Burgundy. They apparently didn't like each other very well (proof: Margaret had a lover). When Louis becomes King, what would he do with his wife? On the other hand, maybe the birth of a son would have eased the relationship between the spouses and butterfly the Tour de Nesles scandal as a result...

On a side note, we can't really talk about a Dauphin of France prior the 1350s. The first Dauphin of France was the future Charles V of France, after his father bought the Dauphiné from the last Dauphin of Viennois. Before that event, the heir of the King of France received a simple apanage: Louis VIII was Count of Artois and John II was Duke of Normandy for example.
 
The question then is that of the relationship between Louis X and Margaret of Burgundy. They apparently didn't like each other very well (proof: Margaret had a lover). When Louis becomes King, what would he do with his wife? On the other hand, maybe the birth of a son would have eased the relationship between the spouses and butterfly the Tour de Nesles scandal as a result...

Well, if he doesn't like her, he could always take lovers. ;)

On a side note, we can't really talk about a Dauphin of France prior the 1350s. The first Dauphin of France was the future Charles V of France, after his father bought the Dauphiné from the last Dauphin of Viennois. Before that event, the heir of the King of France received a simple apanage: Louis VIII was Count of Artois and John II was Duke of Normandy for example.[/QUOTE]

Thanks, I wasn't aware of that.

Just other idea related with the POD: assuming that "John I" is lucky and lives long enough to ensure his line of succession, it would mean that Navarre would be kept united with the French crown. Any idea how could it affect French policies regarding their Iberian neighbours? Also (and more obviously) a successful descendence from John I would deny to the Plantagenets their claims to the French throne.
 
Gonzaga said:
Just other idea related with the POD: assuming that "John I" is lucky and lives long enough to ensure his line of succession, it would mean that Navarre would be kept united with the French crown. Any idea how could it affect French policies regarding their Iberian neighbours?
I don't really know: I'm no real expert on Franco-Iberian relationship. But I guess it could shift French diplomacy a bit southward to protect that Kingdom. France would likely build ties with Castille against Aragon to protect Navarra: that might mean more intermarriages between those two Kingdoms. I also guess France would be more involved in an ATL equivalent of the War of Castillan Succession.

Gonzaga said:
Also (and more obviously) a successful descendence from John I would deny to the Plantagenets their claims to the French throne.
Of course, since there is no longer a succession crisis. It also gets rid (or at least delays) the use of Salic Law: so, if we end up with a situation where their to the crown of France is a woman, she might get it later. However, it will require a lot of time and good conditions.

However, it's not because the Plantagenêt don't have a claim on the Kingdom of France that conflicts won't happen: Guyenne will most likely be the center of conflicts, especially because it makes the King of England a vassal of the King of France.
 
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