WI: Jane Seymour survives

[desmirelle]

Unless you change her character, K. Parr is not going to be anyone's mistress. Her successful marriages, ability to handle the estates while her husband was away (not to mention being given guardianship of her stepchildren) and personal character were what attracted H8 in the first place, by butterflying the marriages, you make her attracting H8 less likely. She's just another gal at court with no outstanding abilities and will be highly involved in her religion (whether RC is kept or CoE established, either way that's just immoral). {Okay, folks, I'm little stuck on characterization.}

Edward was healthy until he was overcoddled (as a toddler) and then caught something (perhaps TB), which killed him slowly - there is also a theory that he had TB, got measles and that finished him off. Queen Jane, as I said, might well have a healthy second child or even a third, so long as she isn't damaged in the first (or second) birth. What if the second is a girl is up to Night Gaul, who started the TL.

Reality check: the Dudleys are going to be Marquess of Pembroke Robert and Marchioness Elizabeth Dudley. Their subsidiary title will be Earl and Countess of Lincoln. She's not going to be given the masculine version for marriage. No, won't happen. The aristocracy and nobility will all give birth to pink squealy worms and there will be questions in Parliament about H8's sanity and the need for a regency (a little sarcasm here). The women's rights movement hadn't occurred at that time.

 

[John Fredrick Parker]

Surprised nobody’s mentioned this, but - without the Anne of Cleves fiasco, Thomas Cromwell likely doesn’t fall from grace or to execution; having him remain a big man in the government for several more years at least would certainly leave a mark on English history, no?

 

[Fabius Maximus]

I don't think there's any legal reason for denying Mary a title whilst giving one to Elizabeth -- Henry had had his marriage to Anne annulled as well, after all, so Elizabeth was no less a bastard than Mary was. There's a reason why Protestants rallied around Jane Grey instead of Elizabeth in 1553.

 

[Cate13]

Surprised nobody’s mentioned this, but - without the Anne of Cleves fiasco, Thomas Cromwell likely doesn’t fall from grace or to execution; having him remain a big man in the government for several more years at least would certainly leave a mark on English history, no?

That is a really good point! There is still always the chance he’d do something to tick Henry off, but it would be much less likely.

I don't think there's any legal reason for denying Mary a title whilst giving one to Elizabeth -- Henry had had his marriage to Anne annulled as well, after all, so Elizabeth was no less a bastard than Mary was. There's a reason why Protestants rallied around Jane Grey instead of Elizabeth in 1553.

The idea that was discussed several pages back was Jane ends up being a figurehead for the Catholics and Catherine Parr for the Protestants. And Mary obviously falls into Jane’s camp, so Elizabeth ends up in Catherine’s camp. Each woman championed her bastard princess and Catherine was better at it.

 

[Fabius Maximus]

The idea that was discussed several pages back was Jane ends up being a figurehead for the Catholics and Catherine Parr for the Protestants. And Mary obviously falls into Jane’s camp, so Elizabeth ends up in Catherine’s camp. Each woman championed her bastard princess and Catherine was better at it.

Yes, but unless Henry is going to come out and say "I like my mistress more than I like my wife, so I'm going to give a title to the daughter my mistress likes and not the one my wife likes," he'd have to give a title to Mary as well. And given that Jane is the woman who finally gave him the son and heir he longed for, I don't see him publicly humiliating her by so openly snubbing her in favour of his mistress.

 

[Cate13]

"I like my mistress more than I like my wife, so I'm going to give a title to the daughter my mistress likes and not the one my wife likes,

I think the line he'd probably use is, my younger bastard daughter is obedient, admits she is a bastard and follows the religion I say. My elder bastard daughter only sometimes admits she is a bastard and doesn't follow the religion I say. So, I reward the younger daughter.

And given that Jane is the woman who finally gave him the son and heir he longed for, I don't see him publicly humiliating her by so openly snubbing her in favour of his mistress.

I don't think he'd see it that way. 1) He's super self absorbed, so it would never occur to him that Jane wants something that is different than what he wants. 2) I don't thing Jane has the ability to get him to do things without angering him. This is something we see Catherine Parr had OTL.

 

[Fabius Maximus]

I think the line he'd probably use is, my younger bastard daughter is obedient, admits she is a bastard and follows the religion I say. My elder bastard daughter only sometimes admits she is a bastard and doesn't follow the religion I say. So, I reward the younger daughter.

No doubt this is what Henry would think to himself, but outright saying such a thing would risk antagonising Mary's Hapsburg relatives, Catholic Europe more generally, and English religious conservatives. Historically, Henry tried to chart a middle ground between religious conservatism and radicalism, for example by burning both Catholics and radical Protestants together to show how moderate he was, and giving a title to both Mary and Elizabeth would fit in with this policy. Plus, if it became widely known that Jane wanted a title for Mary as well -- as it surely would -- then snubbing his lawful wife and the mother of his son in favour of his mistress would make him even more unpopular both at home and abroad. Now Henry certainly didn't mind incurring unpopularity when he wanted something badly enough, but bunging some meaningless title Mary's way costs him nothing and probably makes life slightly easier for him, so there's no real reason why he shouldn't.

 

[John Fredrick Parker]

That is a really good point! There is still always the chance he’d do something to tick Henry off, but it would be much less likely.

Does anyone have ideas on how (a living) Cromwell would influence Henry’s later reign? For example, we’re talking about how Jane might push the English Reformation in a more conservative direction, but what would the Lord Chancellor have to say about that? And whoever her children end up marrying (or at least betrothed to while their father lives) would reflect English foreign policy as much as anything, which Cromwell will have thoughts on? And what else is there?

 

[Cate13]

Snip

We’re just going to have to agree to disagree. I see your point but I don’t think the factors would push Henry to give Mary a title.

Also, consider that Mary would be married when Elizabeth got her title. So, any honors Henry would give Mary would probably actually be awarded to her husband.

 

[Fabius Maximus]

Does anyone have ideas on how (a living) Cromwell would influence Henry’s later reign? For example, we’re talking about how Jane might push the English Reformation in a more conservative direction, but what would the Lord Chancellor have to say about that? And whoever her children end up marrying (or at least betrothed to while their father lives) would reflect English foreign policy as much as anything, which Cromwell will have thoughts on? And what else is there?

The impression I got when I studied the period (ages ago) was that Cromwell generally tried to faithfully carry out the King's policies, rather than deliberately trying to undermine ideas he didn't like. So whilst he'd doubtless try and steer Henry in certain directions, he probably wouldn't be a major independent factor in English policy.

Also, consider that Mary would be married when Elizabeth got her title. So, any honors Henry would give Mary would probably actually be awarded to her husband.

I guess that would be quite possible, if Henry wanted to avoid rewarding Mary herself without making himself look like too much of a jerk to the rest of Europe.

 

[HortenseMancini]

So as far as Mary and Elizabeth's titles, I highly doubt that Elizabeth would be given any kind of title before her marriage, which didn't take place until 1551, which is after HVIII's death. So...crisis averted, Mary and Henry have some minor title while Elizabeth and Robert are Marquess and Marchioness of Pembroke.

 

[FalconHonour]

So as far as Mary and Elizabeth's titles, I highly doubt that Elizabeth would be given any kind of title before her marriage, which didn't take place until 1551, which is after HVIII's death. So...crisis averted, Mary and Henry have some minor title while Elizabeth and Robert are Marquess and Marchioness of Pembroke.

Yes, with Robert having the male form and Elizabeth having the female. I know my tree says the other way around, but I was thinking of Anne being Marquess in her own right at the time and got it twisted in my head. 😝

 

[JaniceTheMannis]

I think people are underestimating Jane's power in this TL. She has done something that no other queen has done for Henry: She has given him a legitimate son. Not only one son, but she has given him two additional sons. She becomes tremendously powerful, and she can throw her support behind 1) Returning England to the Vatican and 2) Legitimizing Mary. Henry will definitely have small affairs, but Jane's position as Queen is unshakable. Before delivering Edward, she walked on eggshells around Henry in fear that she'd be killed or replaced, but no longer. And she's not the timid dormouse most historians portray her as: Even Chapuys, who was in her favor, called her proud, and Jane dismissed several ladies for not adhering to her strict how-many-pearls-on-a-bodice rule she made up, and she threw out women who wore Anne Boleyn's favored hoods. I like to imagine that Jane will live into her 70s as a powerful queen mother.

Now, I really don't think England can return to the Vatican (at least during Henry's rule), but Jane can influence her son to be Catholic. Jane can handpick Edward's tutors and teachers and ensure that they are good Catholics; when in the OTL, the closet Protestant Catherine Parr did. Edward was very intelligent, rigid, and passionate. In the OTL, his zeal was directed towards Protestantism. It was under Edward VI's reign that Protestant England became guaranteed: He forbade Mass, the Eucharist, and heavily persecuted Catholics. , but Jane could shape him so that he's as fervent a Catholic as Mary. In this TL, I think Edward would essentially maintain all Catholic traditions but retain his title as head of the Church of England and marry a Catholic princess.

The only reason Jane became queen was her conspiracy with Chapuys (who was Catherine of Aragon's BFF and #1 fan) and Catherine's old friends, who schooled her on how to seduce the king and make him want her. After Edward's birth, it's guaranteed that Jane will persuade Henry to legitimize Mary.

In 1538, Spain and France signed a pact of alliance and the Pope excommunicated Henry, so he is very anxious of being cornered by two great Catholic powers. He'd use his newly legitimized daughter to get a way in with one of these countries. At this time, Mary is only 21 and plenty young enough to have children. The newly legitimized princess is now Henry's only legitimate daughter and has ties to Spain and the Emperor. No way she's marrying locally, a mere English lord.

Henry would either throw in with France or Spain and offer his adult daughter to protect England's interests. Cromwell will beg Henry to marry Mary to a Protestant, such as the brother of the King of Denmark (who is Lutheran). Or, Duke William of Cleves, the brother of Anna of Cleves.

Chapuys wants Mary to make a marriage to help the Emperor-- maybe Dom Luis of Portugal, one of the King of Hungary's sons, or the Duke of Savoy's son. This is what Mary would prefer. She identified more with her Spanish mother than with her English mother, and she wanted to marry one of her Spanish cousins. Mary isn't Queen of England, so the Emperor wouldn't marry her to his own son Philip II.

OR. This is a very, very fun idea. Let's say Mary is legitimized in 1538, a year after Edward's birth. In 1541 in the OTL, King Francis I of France and Norfolk were negotiating for one of Henry's daughters to marry his second son, Henry, Duke of Orleans; the Duke was married, but Francis was confident that he could dissolve the marriage since Catherine de Medici seemed barren at the time (and she wouldn't have a child for the first 10+ years of her marriage). The negotiations fizzled out since Henry refused to legitimize either of his daughters. In this TL, the 22-year-old Princess Mary Tudor could marry the French king's son. When the Dauphin dies before siring a son, Princess Mary will become the Queen of France. Since she is still very young and she is much happier, she could have children. In the OTL, she started trying to have children at 38 and she had suffered deep depression under Edward VI's reign as he brutally suppressed her Catholic faith. Mary never wanted to be a queen regnant, and I can see her very happy in France, even if she'd at first be cold to her husband, since the Valois are the enemy of her maternal relatives, the Hapsburgs. She'd support her husband's persecution of the Protestants.

Jane won't lift a finger to help Elizabeth. She ignored Elizabeth and fawned over Mary. Without a Catherine Parr to champion her, Elizabeth probably won't amount to much. Henry'd probably try to use Elizabeth in the international marriage game, but she is A) a bastard and B) behind her 3 legitimate brothers and sister in the succession, so few kings or princes would want her. In the OTL, Henry tried to marry her off to a Denmark prince, but the King of Denmark scoffed that he wouldn't marry his brother to a bastard, leaving Henry baffled. She'd probably marry a local English nobleman. Robert Dudley won't be the Earl of Warwick, since his 2 older brothers will live. Despite her bastardy, Elizabeth is a king's daughter and will be well-dowered and a prize for any local Englishman. It's possible that Jane will convince Henry to give Elizabeth as a "prize" for one of her Seymour relatives, so Elizabeth might end up marrying Thomas Seymour, since Edward is associated with scandal after his incestuous, cuckolding wife.

Jane Grey lacks importance. Henry has 3 healthy sons and 2 daughters, one of whom is a bastard but still is before Jane in the succession. She will lead a happy, if unremarkable life as a Protestant scholar. Her ambitious parents the Grey will no doubt marry her off, but she won't be the 9 day queen.

Who will Edward marry? Well, perhaps Mary, Queen of Scots. But if Mary Tudor DID marry King Henry II of France, the French wouldn't be so eager to snatch the infant queen away for their Dauphin (assuming Mary has a son by this time). Or, if Mary doesn't marry Henry II, then Edward could marry Elizabeth de Valois as he was betrothed to in the OTL. He could always marry one of Emperor Ferdinand's daughters or granddaughters.

Honestly, the marriages of Henry and Jane's sons depend too much on whether Edward will stick to Protestantism or Catholicism. If Protestant, German princesses from the Protestant League are most promising (still, at least Edward or his next brother will try to marry the Queen of Scots), since there'd be a religious conflict in Protestant/Catholic marriages.

 

[kasumigenx]

I think people are underestimating Jane's power in this TL. She has done something that no other queen has done for Henry: She has given him a legitimate son. Not only one son, but she has given him two additional sons. She becomes tremendously powerful, and she can throw her support behind 1) Returning England to the Vatican and 2) Legitimizing Mary. Henry will definitely have small affairs, but Jane's position as Queen is unshakable. Before delivering Edward, she walked on eggshells around Henry in fear that she'd be killed or replaced, but no longer. And she's not the timid dormouse most historians portray her as: Even Chapuys, who was in her favor, called her proud, and Jane dismissed several ladies for not adhering to her strict how-many-pearls-on-a-bodice rule she made up, and she threw out women who wore Anne Boleyn's favored hoods. I like to imagine that Jane will live into her 70s as a powerful queen mother.

Now, I really don't think England can return to the Vatican (at least during Henry's rule), but Jane can influence her son to be Catholic. Jane can handpick Edward's tutors and teachers and ensure that they are good Catholics; when in the OTL, the closet Protestant Catherine Parr did. Edward was very intelligent, rigid, and passionate. In the OTL, his zeal was directed towards Protestantism. It was under Edward VI's reign that Protestant England became guaranteed: He forbade Mass, the Eucharist, and heavily persecuted Catholics. , but Jane could shape him so that he's as fervent a Catholic as Mary. In this TL, I think Edward would essentially maintain all Catholic traditions but retain his title as head of the Church of England and marry a Catholic princess.

The only reason Jane became queen was her conspiracy with Chapuys (who was Catherine of Aragon's BFF and #1 fan) and Catherine's old friends, who schooled her on how to seduce the king and make him want her. After Edward's birth, it's guaranteed that Jane will persuade Henry to legitimize Mary.

In 1538, Spain and France signed a pact of alliance and the Pope excommunicated Henry, so he is very anxious of being cornered by two great Catholic powers. He'd use his newly legitimized daughter to get a way in with one of these countries. At this time, Mary is only 21 and plenty young enough to have children. The newly legitimized princess is now Henry's only legitimate daughter and has ties to Spain and the Emperor. No way she's marrying locally, a mere English lord.

Henry would either throw in with France or Spain and offer his adult daughter to protect England's interests. Cromwell will beg Henry to marry Mary to a Protestant, such as the brother of the King of Denmark (who is Lutheran). Or, Duke William of Cleves, the brother of Anna of Cleves.

Chapuys wants Mary to make a marriage to help the Emperor-- maybe Dom Luis of Portugal, one of the King of Hungary's sons, or the Duke of Savoy's son. This is what Mary would prefer. She identified more with her Spanish mother than with her English mother, and she wanted to marry one of her Spanish cousins. Mary isn't Queen of England, so the Emperor wouldn't marry her to his own son Philip II.

OR. This is a very, very fun idea. Let's say Mary is legitimized in 1538, a year after Edward's birth. In 1541 in the OTL, King Francis I of France and Norfolk were negotiating for one of Henry's daughters to marry his second son, Henry, Duke of Orleans; the Duke was married, but Francis was confident that he could dissolve the marriage since Catherine de Medici seemed barren at the time (and she wouldn't have a child for the first 10+ years of her marriage). The negotiations fizzled out since Henry refused to legitimize either of his daughters. In this TL, the 22-year-old Princess Mary Tudor could marry the French king's son. When the Dauphin dies before siring a son, Princess Mary will become the Queen of France. Since she is still very young and she is much happier, she could have children. In the OTL, she started trying to have children at 38 and she had suffered deep depression under Edward VI's reign as he brutally suppressed her Catholic faith. Mary never wanted to be a queen regnant, and I can see her very happy in France, even if she'd at first be cold to her husband, since the Valois are the enemy of her maternal relatives, the Hapsburgs. She'd support her husband's persecution of the Protestants.

Jane won't lift a finger to help Elizabeth. She ignored Elizabeth and fawned over Mary. Without a Catherine Parr to champion her, Elizabeth probably won't amount to much. Henry'd probably try to use Elizabeth in the international marriage game, but she is A) a bastard and B) behind her 3 legitimate brothers and sister in the succession, so few kings or princes would want her. In the OTL, Henry tried to marry her off to a Denmark prince, but the King of Denmark scoffed that he wouldn't marry his brother to a bastard, leaving Henry baffled. She'd probably marry a local English nobleman. Robert Dudley won't be the Earl of Warwick, since his 2 older brothers will live. Despite her bastardy, Elizabeth is a king's daughter and will be well-dowered and a prize for any local Englishman. It's possible that Jane will convince Henry to give Elizabeth as a "prize" for one of her Seymour relatives, so Elizabeth might end up marrying Thomas Seymour, since Edward is associated with scandal after his incestuous, cuckolding wife.

Jane Grey lacks importance. Henry has 3 healthy sons and 2 daughters, one of whom is a bastard but still is before Jane in the succession. She will lead a happy, if unremarkable life as a Protestant scholar. Her ambitious parents the Grey will no doubt marry her off, but she won't be the 9 day queen.

Who will Edward marry? Well, perhaps Mary, Queen of Scots. But if Mary Tudor DID marry King Henry II of France, the French wouldn't be so eager to snatch the infant queen away for their Dauphin (assuming Mary has a son by this time). Or, if Mary doesn't marry Henry II, then Edward could marry Elizabeth de Valois as he was betrothed to in the OTL. He could always marry one of Emperor Ferdinand's daughters or granddaughters.

Honestly, the marriages of Henry and Jane's sons depend too much on whether Edward will stick to Protestantism or Catholicism. If Protestant, German princesses from the Protestant League are most promising (still, at least Edward or his next brother will try to marry the Queen of Scots), since there'd be a religious conflict in Protestant/Catholic marriages.

interesting for a tl...

 

[dragonstoned]

I think people are underestimating Jane's power in this TL. She has done something that no other queen has done for Henry: She has given him a legitimate son. Not only one son, but she has given him two additional sons. She becomes tremendously powerful, and she can throw her support behind 1) Returning England to the Vatican and 2) Legitimizing Mary. Henry will definitely have small affairs, but Jane's position as Queen is unshakable. Before delivering Edward, she walked on eggshells around Henry in fear that she'd be killed or replaced, but no longer. And she's not the timid dormouse most historians portray her as: Even Chapuys, who was in her favor, called her proud, and Jane dismissed several ladies for not adhering to her strict how-many-pearls-on-a-bodice rule she made up, and she threw out women who wore Anne Boleyn's favored hoods. I like to imagine that Jane will live into her 70s as a powerful queen mother.

Now, I really don't think England can return to the Vatican (at least during Henry's rule), but Jane can influence her son to be Catholic. Jane can handpick Edward's tutors and teachers and ensure that they are good Catholics; when in the OTL, the closet Protestant Catherine Parr did. Edward was very intelligent, rigid, and passionate. In the OTL, his zeal was directed towards Protestantism. It was under Edward VI's reign that Protestant England became guaranteed: He forbade Mass, the Eucharist, and heavily persecuted Catholics. , but Jane could shape him so that he's as fervent a Catholic as Mary. In this TL, I think Edward would essentially maintain all Catholic traditions but retain his title as head of the Church of England and marry a Catholic princess.

The only reason Jane became queen was her conspiracy with Chapuys (who was Catherine of Aragon's BFF and #1 fan) and Catherine's old friends, who schooled her on how to seduce the king and make him want her. After Edward's birth, it's guaranteed that Jane will persuade Henry to legitimize Mary.

In 1538, Spain and France signed a pact of alliance and the Pope excommunicated Henry, so he is very anxious of being cornered by two great Catholic powers. He'd use his newly legitimized daughter to get a way in with one of these countries. At this time, Mary is only 21 and plenty young enough to have children. The newly legitimized princess is now Henry's only legitimate daughter and has ties to Spain and the Emperor. No way she's marrying locally, a mere English lord.

Henry would either throw in with France or Spain and offer his adult daughter to protect England's interests. Cromwell will beg Henry to marry Mary to a Protestant, such as the brother of the King of Denmark (who is Lutheran). Or, Duke William of Cleves, the brother of Anna of Cleves.

Chapuys wants Mary to make a marriage to help the Emperor-- maybe Dom Luis of Portugal, one of the King of Hungary's sons, or the Duke of Savoy's son. This is what Mary would prefer. She identified more with her Spanish mother than with her English mother, and she wanted to marry one of her Spanish cousins. Mary isn't Queen of England, so the Emperor wouldn't marry her to his own son Philip II.

OR. This is a very, very fun idea. Let's say Mary is legitimized in 1538, a year after Edward's birth. In 1541 in the OTL, King Francis I of France and Norfolk were negotiating for one of Henry's daughters to marry his second son, Henry, Duke of Orleans; the Duke was married, but Francis was confident that he could dissolve the marriage since Catherine de Medici seemed barren at the time (and she wouldn't have a child for the first 10+ years of her marriage). The negotiations fizzled out since Henry refused to legitimize either of his daughters. In this TL, the 22-year-old Princess Mary Tudor could marry the French king's son. When the Dauphin dies before siring a son, Princess Mary will become the Queen of France. Since she is still very young and she is much happier, she could have children. In the OTL, she started trying to have children at 38 and she had suffered deep depression under Edward VI's reign as he brutally suppressed her Catholic faith. Mary never wanted to be a queen regnant, and I can see her very happy in France, even if she'd at first be cold to her husband, since the Valois are the enemy of her maternal relatives, the Hapsburgs. She'd support her husband's persecution of the Protestants.

Jane won't lift a finger to help Elizabeth. She ignored Elizabeth and fawned over Mary. Without a Catherine Parr to champion her, Elizabeth probably won't amount to much. Henry'd probably try to use Elizabeth in the international marriage game, but she is A) a bastard and B) behind her 3 legitimate brothers and sister in the succession, so few kings or princes would want her. In the OTL, Henry tried to marry her off to a Denmark prince, but the King of Denmark scoffed that he wouldn't marry his brother to a bastard, leaving Henry baffled. She'd probably marry a local English nobleman. Robert Dudley won't be the Earl of Warwick, since his 2 older brothers will live. Despite her bastardy, Elizabeth is a king's daughter and will be well-dowered and a prize for any local Englishman. It's possible that Jane will convince Henry to give Elizabeth as a "prize" for one of her Seymour relatives, so Elizabeth might end up marrying Thomas Seymour, since Edward is associated with scandal after his incestuous, cuckolding wife.

Jane Grey lacks importance. Henry has 3 healthy sons and 2 daughters, one of whom is a bastard but still is before Jane in the succession. She will lead a happy, if unremarkable life as a Protestant scholar. Her ambitious parents the Grey will no doubt marry her off, but she won't be the 9 day queen.

Who will Edward marry? Well, perhaps Mary, Queen of Scots. But if Mary Tudor DID marry King Henry II of France, the French wouldn't be so eager to snatch the infant queen away for their Dauphin (assuming Mary has a son by this time). Or, if Mary doesn't marry Henry II, then Edward could marry Elizabeth de Valois as he was betrothed to in the OTL. He could always marry one of Emperor Ferdinand's daughters or granddaughters.

Honestly, the marriages of Henry and Jane's sons depend too much on whether Edward will stick to Protestantism or Catholicism. If Protestant, German princesses from the Protestant League are most promising (still, at least Edward or his next brother will try to marry the Queen of Scots), since there'd be a religious conflict in Protestant/Catholic marriages.

This new vision of Queen Jane is rather interesting, I have to agree that she's too often underestimated. There are practically zero TLs featuring a surviving Jane Seymour and I would definitely like to read this one.

 

[VVD0D95]

This new vision of Queen Jane is rather interesting, I have to agree that she's too often underestimated. There are practically zero TLs featuring a surviving Jane Seymour and I would definitely like to read this one.

Where did she lean religiously I’ve never been able to find anything definitive

 

[dragonstoned]

Where did she lean religiously I’ve never been able to find anything definitive

I'm not certain myself, but judging by her positive impression on Chapuys and the fact that in 1536 she asked for pardon for the participants in the Pilgrimage of Grace, I believe she either Catholic or a Catholic sympathizer.

 

[BlueFlowwer]

If Mary marries Beja then their son maybe can become king of Portugal after Sebastian kicks the bucket?

 

[VVD0D95]

I'm not certain myself, but judging by her positive impression on Chapuys and the fact that in 1536 she asked for pardon for the participants in the Pilgrimage of Grace, I believe she either Catholic or a Catholic sympathizer.

I’ll keep that in mind

 

[isabella]

If Mary marries Beja then their son maybe can become king of Portugal after Sebastian kicks the bucket?

Only if the line of John III is fully extinct (as was in OTL). If any heir of Maria Manuela is still alive Beja has no right to claim the Crown of Portugal