WI: Islamophobic George W. Bush?

No, he just launched the invasion of afghanistan which killed 200,000 people, then the invasion of iraq which killed over a million people. Thats not islamophobic at all.

That was his intention. He was just bad at conducting invasions and occupations.

Thats simply bush covering his political ass.

Covering his political ass by opposing religious bigotry in 2002? He was still popular back then.
 
Using that logic, FDR was Christophobic for getting Europeans killed in WW2.
This. Bush invaded Afghanistan because they were harboring Al-Qaeda and Iraq because they tried to assasinate his father.
The political class only looks at doing Iraq and many even Afghanistan today as hot headed today years and years after the worst terrorist attack on America killing more then Pearl Harbor.

Frankly we could have leveled several nations from the air with the full support of the US public in 2001. Bush if anything was taking heat at the time for under reacting especially when Bin Laden got out of Tora Bora and we didn't try ground troops or tactical nukes there which Putin had given the green light to.

Bush 43 was hesitant as was Bush 41 as a leader, but an Iraqi invasion of Kuwait can't be compared with thousands of dead Americans in Washington and New York nor can it be compared to Cold War American and Soviet **** waving.
"9/11, therefore we must invade Iraq" was definitely hot-headed. Hussein had no connection to Al-Qaeda. Invading Iraq because of 9/11 was like if FDR invaded Brazil in response to Pearl Harbor.
 
This. Bush invaded Afghanistan because they were harboring Al-Qaeda and Iraq because they tried to assasinate his father.

"9/11, therefore we must invade Iraq" was definitely hot-headed. Hussein had no connection to Al-Qaeda. Invading Iraq because of 9/11 was like if FDR invaded Brazil in response to Pearl Harbor.
That was not the reason given. Saddam was apparently keeping UN inspectors from certain areas (I think where they were working on missiles, but he'll if I know) and Bush had been fed information by his Vice a president, members of his cabinet, plus the heads of the intelligence agencies telling about WMDs. That same information fed to him being used to whip the U.S. into a fervor where I do not recall I single article or political cartoon (I read a lot back then) actually suggesting Saddam did not have WMDs. Everyone was fooled, but they all claimed Bush to be the jester.
 
I find it very hard to believe some of the things I read in this thread. Bush was not a suicidal idiot, Adolf Hitler, or an absolute monarch. He did not have the power to unilaterally invade the entire Muslim world on a lark.

He wouldn't have. I suspect if Junior was an Islamophobe- we'd probably see more emphasis in Afghanistan on getting rid of Bin Laden at all cost- the Afghans would hate us, their casualties would be much higher, but Bin Laden would have been dead earlier.

Iraq would have happened, would have been a decapitation strike against Saddam, probably a repeat of Gulf War I. No nationbuilding or attempt to make Iraq stable.

Bush cruises to an easier re-election in 2004.

Iran would have been attacked as well, or would have rolled over knowing the US would be willing to use total war on Iran. Russia would not put Iran under its nuclear umbrella. If Iran isn't attacked, Saudi Arabia would be , as Bush would implicate the Saudi monarchy (truthfully) as responsible for 9/11 and Americans would accept it. the US might try to colonize the oil for themselves.

that said, terrorist attacks against Americans do vastly spike, an antifada happens against Israel, but this would further reinforce anti-Islamic feelings among Americans (even most Democrats)

The economic crisis happens, but I suspect Hillary's hawkishness allows her to barely edge out Obama (or Obama fades early and Edwards is the challenger on a proto-Bernie platform) and she wins in 2008 vs McCain (who does not pick Palin)

America will suffer a long-term cost in tarnished international reputation, but Islamophobia does well in Eastern Europe, and will probably be stronger than OTL even in Europe. Islamic states will need China as a friend, they might unite.

Folks are underestimating how popular Islamophobia was in America after 9/11, and some of that feeling still exists. People would have accepted a nuke being used in retaliation, even if there is no way Junior would do that.
 
That was not the reason given. Saddam was apparently keeping UN inspectors from certain areas (I think where they were working on missiles, but he'll if I know) and Bush had been fed information by his Vice a president, members of his cabinet, plus the heads of the intelligence agencies telling about WMDs. That same information fed to him being used to whip the U.S. into a fervor where I do not recall I single article or political cartoon (I read a lot back then) actually suggesting Saddam did not have WMDs. Everyone was fooled, but they all claimed Bush to be the jester.

It didn't magically start in 2002, Saddam kicked out the inspectors repeatedly which was a violation of the caese fire and would go on TV and demand his right to unconventional weapons. The US was not in a legal state of peace with Iraq after the Gulf War so we had years of.

IMG_1062.jpg~original


Sometimes it would change up with Saddam doing other things like trying to blow up say Bush 41 then a military built up and then heavy bombing. It wasn't always over the NFZ or weapons.

Add to that after 911 Saddam decided to fully embrace the inner idiot and put up posters like this around Iraq in 2001 and had his country celebrate the attack. Suddenly you have in Americans minds a terror sponser who kicked the weapons inspectors out and is telling the world he has a right to unconventional weapons.

It's why I have little doubt Iraq was going to happen after 911 in some form, but not necessarily how it did happen and when. The most unpopular thing was tying to nation build, attacking Iraq was very popular in America, but the US doing more then just blow stuff up was not and was never a given.

An anti-Islamic President would just have continued bombing Iraq only more like Linebacker 2.0 on Iraqi cities after 911. An anti-Muslim President might have grabbed the Southern Iraqi oil fields too and left the rest to rot.
 
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the poster complaining about the deaths in Afghanistan reminds me of those people who leave out Unit 731 and the Bataan Death March when discussing how Japan was an "innocent" that the Allies fought for no good reason. They don't ackn that if we hadn't gone in, AQ would still be using Afghanistan as a base to plan more September 11s.
 
He wouldn't have. I suspect if Junior was an Islamophobe- we'd probably see more emphasis in Afghanistan on getting rid of Bin Laden at all cost- the Afghans would hate us, their casualties would be much higher, but Bin Laden would have been dead earlier.

Iraq would have happened, would have been a decapitation strike against Saddam, probably a repeat of Gulf War I. No nationbuilding or attempt to make Iraq stable.

Bush cruises to an easier re-election in 2004.

Iran would have been attacked as well, or would have rolled over knowing the US would be willing to use total war on Iran. Russia would not put Iran under its nuclear umbrella. If Iran isn't attacked, Saudi Arabia would be , as Bush would implicate the Saudi monarchy (truthfully) as responsible for 9/11 and Americans would accept it. the US might try to colonize the oil for themselves.

that said, terrorist attacks against Americans do vastly spike, an antifada happens against Israel, but this would further reinforce anti-Islamic feelings among Americans (even most Democrats)

The economic crisis happens, but I suspect Hillary's hawkishness allows her to barely edge out Obama (or Obama fades early and Edwards is the challenger on a proto-Bernie platform) and she wins in 2008 vs McCain (who does not pick Palin)

America will suffer a long-term cost in tarnished international reputation, but Islamophobia does well in Eastern Europe, and will probably be stronger than OTL even in Europe. Islamic states will need China as a friend, they might unite.

Folks are underestimating how popular Islamophobia was in America after 9/11, and some of that feeling still exists. People would have accepted a nuke being used in retaliation, even if there is no way Junior would do that.

Again, why does this happen? Why does Dubya go literally insane? Why is the target selection so random? Bush bombs SAUDI ARABIA!!! (because reasons) but leaves Libya, the country that has actual WMDs, a history of sponsoring terrorism against America, and an unstable, very unfriendly leadership free? Why does Dubya contradict all his neocon ideas about "stepping stones to democracy" and "lighting the torch of freedom" and not try to build democracy in Iraq? Why does this not turn Americans off against adventuristic militarism even worse than IOTL, somehow making Hillary's hawkishness into an *asset*?

I think you're way overestimating how popular Islamophobia was, or at least its ability to completely hijack the brains of those in power. What this proposes (taking the oil, implied very harsh treatment of civilians in Afghanistan, etc.) violates the Geneva Conventions in a very, very public way and makes no strategic sense.

You say George W. Bush is doing this but the person you're describing is not acting like him. He wasn't a great POTUS but he did have actual reasons and internal logic for the things he did even if they turned out to be wrong.

This entire thread is Bush Derangement Syndrome gone wild.
 
The question wasn't the POD, it was what would happen if he was Islamophobic. That's what I was answering.
I don't think he was.
 
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