WI: Isabella died in 1516, and Ferdinand died in 1504?

Castile and Aragon were united into the Kingdom of Spain by a marriage between the Castilian Isabella I and the Aragonese Ferdinand II, with the two acting as joint-rulers (Isabella and Castile on paper being the dominant figure). IOTL, Isabella died in 1504 and Ferdinand in 1516. What if their death dates had been swapped?
 
Does much change? I mean, Isabel might've been the dominant figure, but it's not as though she can marry again and try for a male heir. However, considering that Juana (AFAIR) was never queen regnant of Aragon, her son was immediately proclaimed king there instead of his mother, I could see Isabel attempting to hold control of the Aragonese kingdom (after all, she despised Fernando's bastards, particularly Alfonso, archbishop of Saragossa) as regent for her grandson. OTOH, she might be far more cunning in dealing with Philipp of Burgundy than her widower was (speaking of, does he still die in 1506?) since it's gonna be more difficult for Philipp to push his wife's claim in a country that doesn't allow female rulers against the widow of the last king acting as "caretaker/regent" for her grandson (who's also his son).
 
Philip died of fever while in Castille as King, so his death as OTL is butterflied.

He'll still travel to Spain in order to at least influence his King son.
 
In what basis are we assuming Isabel was the dominant party of the couple? Were a talking about a society where gender equality was not exactly a main issue. As it stands, Ferdinand was the commander of the pro-Isabel armies during the castilian civil war. He played a great role designing the marriage-alliances system that created fhe Habsburg inheritance, not by chance Machiaveli's "The Prince" had Ferdinand in mind. After Isabel died Ferdinand played the temporally the role of.Regent of Castile, and was a heavy weight in castilian politics until his death. Without his tacit support, Philip the handsome would have things a bit harder, since Juana counted.with the support of the Third State and sectors of the low nobility...I'm not sure if the aragonese Cortes and nobility would have tolerated so much meddling by Isabel if Ferdinand had died before her, even more considering the lack of precedent with.female.rulers in the Crown of Aragon and the salic law there, which opens interesting possible scenarios with the propossed POD. Or maybe her relentless will would have been enough, no idea. I guess she would have been more supportive of her daughter, what Juana inherited Castile from Isabel, not from Ferdinand. She would have faced a harder challenge to take possesion of the aragonese crown due the aforementioned questions about women there....
 
Ferdinand developed a very strong dislike for his Habsburg son-in-law, which greatly complicated early 16th century diplomacy (by forcing allies to choose between Philip and Ferdinand).

Avoiding Ferdinand's feud with Philip (or cutting it short) also likely means that Catherine of Aragon marries Henry VIII earlier; OTL Henry VII had sided with Philip against Ferdinand, which complicated marriage negotiations, since he held a grudge (and Henry VII didn't help matters with his quibbling over the dowry). If Catherine marries Henry a few years earlier, she has a better chance of having a son (or at least another daughter).

Ferdinand predeceasing Isabella also avoids Ferdinand's remarriage, which threatened to split the two kingdoms and complicated matters in that way. It also means Gonzalo de Cordoba is still in Naples (he was close to Isabella, but Ferdinand never trusted him), which means the Spanish have a more talented general in command should the Italian Wars flare up again (as they did in 1508 OTL), although he was getting on in years.
 
Wasn't part of the reason that Harry dithered about remarrying Catherine also, in part, due to the fact that once Isabel died, her market value decreased? And as to Aragon, they have no precedent (AFAIK) to argue against a king's widow serving as regent for an underage child of her blood (here it would simply be Charles V/Ferdinand I instead of her son). And not only that, Isabel is a known quantity as opposed to Philipp (who's not only foreign but he has no claim to the thhrone, except through his wife - who from what I've read, could be extremely strong-willed and stubborn).
 
Found this info on the relationships between Juana & Isabel as well as about Isabel & Philipp

In the period 1497-1500, Juana's elder siblings, Juan and Isabel, and Isabel's baby son, all died, leaving Juana as heiress of Spain, Mexico, Peru and the Caribbean islands. Therefor, Juana and Philip were requested to visit Spain. After the birth of another daughter in 1501, they finally set out, leaving their children behind in Flanders. They met the French King in Blois, and didn't arrive in Spain until early 1502. In Burgos they watched a bull fight. On arrival in Toledo, Juana threw herself in her father's arms, and hugged and kissed him.
isabel1_castile.jpg
Queen Isabella I (to the right) , however, was too devout and too self-disciplined to feel much sympathy for either her overwrought daughter or her pleasure-loving son-in-law. Due to her mother's chilly treatment, Juana's nervousness increased. Cheerful Philip found the grim court life in Spain both tedious and trying. The sequence of religious services seemed endless, and the summer heat blazed like a furnace. To his abhorrence, the Spaniards either kept their women hidden or used formidable chaperones. Philip got the measles, too. Once he was recovered he wanted to leave as soon as possible, but Juana was pregnant again. After a violent quarrel in December 1502, Philip left Juana behind. When she learned of it, she went berserk. Juana wanted to ride after him immediately, but her mother had her locked up in castle La Mota (below). Juana lapsed into brooding silences, knowing that Philip, back in Flanders, would surround himself with buxom beauties.

The Spanish Sovereigns hoped that Juana's wild moods and lamentations were due to her pregnancy, but after little Ferdinand's birth in March 1503, Juana grew more frenzied than ever. She yelled at the servants and cursed the clerics. She wanted to return to her husband as soon as possible, but she couldn't leave, because hostilities had broken out between Spain and France. Queen Isabella I, fearing Philip's influence, insisted that Juana remained in Spain for a time in order to prepare for Queenship. On a cold November night Juana fled, half-clad, from the castle. When the city gate closed before her, she threw herself against the iron bars, while screaming and hurling abuses until exhaustion overtook her. She fought off all efforts to protect her against the bitter wind. She even threatened the bishop with death and torture for keeping her locked up. When her mother arrived, Juana insulted her with foul language.
 
It's going to be funny when Juana goes mad and Phillip has to deal with every single parliament of the Aragonese Crown. Because, unless there's some attempt to put Fernando, the son of Federico I of Naples, as king of Aragon, Juana is going to get the crown.
 
Juana wasn't, it seems, really mad. As seen in that Kellan Sullivan has kindly provided, she was more overly emotional and jealous rather than insane. Wanting your husband to stop cheating and to leave your mother's grip is not an emotion anyone can say is crazy. She also was never really called any form of "mad" in communications until it was convenient for her husband and later father, then her son. In this situation, we might actually see a much more liberated Juana, if just because her mother will try and have her be a worthy successor. That probably won't go the way Isabella wants, bear in mind that Juana is still somewhat rash and prone to tantrums (not signs of madness, but of an overindulgent upbringing), but it will actively increase Juana as a political figure in her own right and actually might lead to her remarrying if she so chooses to, as being in a more independent and significant position after her husband's death (if not butterflied) and thus not so fixed on her obsession with him.
 
To our eyes, she wasn't mad. To her husband and father she was. It was a way to get rid of her. They used the familiar background and the madness of her grandmother.

The question is. Would Isabel allow his son-in-law to do so?
 
To our eyes, she wasn't mad. To her husband and father she was. It was a way to get rid of her. They used the familiar background and the madness of her grandmother.

The question is. Would Isabel allow his son-in-law to do so?

Nope. Isabella might not have been thrilled that her least malleable daughter ended up her heir, but she certainly liked her more than said daughter's arrogant and narcissistic husband. The Queen of Castille wasn't a woman to suffer a man like that without good reason, and if her daughter outranks him, which she will as Queen of Aragon, then Isabella is not going to let him try and weasel his way to Regent for a man Juana. Isabella herself went through melancholy periods, so she'd most likely use herself as an example of how it won't be a problem.
 
In the period 1497-1500, Juana's elder siblings, Juan and Isabel, and Isabel's baby son, all died, leaving Juana as heiress of Spain, Mexico, Peru and the Caribbean islands.

Nitpicking, but in 1500 Spain did not rule Mexico or Peru. That would be a couple of decades in the future.
 
Nah Philip was brought up in the Burgundian Court, which was a lot more lively than the courts in Spain, just see @Kellan Sullivan's quote about how Philip felt about them. Yes, he like Ferdinand and Maximilian of Austria had mistresses, but Ferdinand's dislike went deeper than that. Arrogant and narcissistic seems Charles the Bold like qualities, but OTOH the dukes of Burgundy were wealthy and weren't shy to show that, which wasn't the 'Spanish' way of doing things. Juana/Johanna/Jeanne was extremely jealous and Philip being in a court which almost encouraged their liege to have mistresses, wasn't a perfect fit.
 
In what basis are we assuming Isabel was the dominant party of the couple? Were a talking about a society where gender equality was not exactly a main issue. As it stands, Ferdinand was the commander of the pro-Isabel armies during the castilian civil war. He played a great role designing the marriage-alliances system that created fhe Habsburg inheritance, not by chance Machiaveli's "The Prince" had Ferdinand in mind. After Isabel died Ferdinand played the temporally the role of.Regent of Castile, and was a heavy weight in castilian politics until his death. Without his tacit support, Philip the handsome would have things a bit harder, since Juana counted.with the support of the Third State and sectors of the low nobility...I'm not sure if the aragonese Cortes and nobility would have tolerated so much meddling by Isabel if Ferdinand had died before her, even more considering the lack of precedent with.female.rulers in the Crown of Aragon and the salic law there, which opens interesting possible scenarios with the propossed POD. Or maybe her relentless will would have been enough, no idea. I guess she would have been more supportive of her daughter, what Juana inherited Castile from Isabel, not from Ferdinand. She would have faced a harder challenge to take possesion of the aragonese crown due the aforementioned questions about women there....

Yes, the Castillians and Aragonese were male-dominated. However; it should be noted that in 1469, the 18-year-old Isabel was able to negotiate a VERY favorable marriage treaty with John II of Aragon in which not only were she and John II's only son Ferdinand to be each considered the SOLE monarch of their respective inherited nations but that Ferdinand himself was to live in Castille with her NOT the usual deal of a princess having to move to her pre-arranged husband's domain. Not only that but they were to each maintain personal control of whatever territory each state individually conquered (which would impact two continents for well over a century after their deaths with Castille alone being the ruler of the New World with only Castillians legally able to venture there ). And keep in mind that she did these negotiations in secret while her half-brother Henry IV (the King of Castille) was trying to marry her off to his Portuguese brother-in-law and up to the very moment the marriage happened and was consummated, there was a real risk of capture, imprisonment to both her and her bridegroom who had had to sneak into Castille disguised as a shepherd. Even after her death and he was the de facto ruler of Castille via exploiting their detained daughter and minor grandson's sovereignty, the Castillian Cortes still termed him 'the Catalan'. Yes, he had quite a few mistresses and known nonmarital offspring (and Isabel, having seen for herself what befell hedonistic women at her half-brother's court, was shrewd enough to not have a whisper of scandal before or after her marriage) but that doesn't mean that Ferdinand had any real ruling power while living in his wife's kingdom (and it was a bit tricky for him to rule Aragon long-distance only visiting his actual kingdom a few times before his 1st wife's death).
 
In this scenario, I can't see Juana being an effective ruler of Aragon (and/or Castile upon Isabella's death). In OTL, if Juana were as practical as her mother, she would have tolerated Philip's infidelities and ruled Castile as queen regent with strictly delegated powers given to her husband. In TTL, Juana would likely allow Philip to rule Aragon ( and eventually Castile) with very little restrictions from her. Isabella would be put in a position of trying to prepare Castile for the rule of a couple who clearly not suited for to be effective rulers. In a twisted sort of way, OTL's Charles V (and his numerous realms) was fortunate to have not been raised by his parents. In TTL, Charles might still be formidable enough a ruler to clean up his parents' mess in Spain. Philip would likely make Charles the regent of the Netherlands in TTL. In TTL, Philip's difficulties in Spain would likely affect his ability to deal with what would be inevitable conflicts with France.
 
This may be a crazy idea, but if Ferdinand dies first, then does Ferdinand, Duke of Calabria have the possibility of becoming king in Barcelona (and maybe marrying Catherine of Arsgon)?

He has a small chance for King of Barcelona, but no chance for Catherine of Aragon. With Isabella still alive Henry VII of England will marry his son much earlier to Henry VIII of England. He may, however, marry Germaine de Foix earlier and have children with her.
 
Nope. Isabella might not have been thrilled that her least malleable daughter ended up her heir, but she certainly liked her more than said daughter's arrogant and narcissistic husband. The Queen of Castille wasn't a woman to suffer a man like that without good reason, and if her daughter outranks him, which she will as Queen of Aragon, then Isabella is not going to let him try and weasel his way to Regent for a man Juana. Isabella herself went through melancholy periods, so she'd most likely use herself as an example of how it won't be a problem.

Then the situation would be quite "funny". Let's imagine that Phillip still goes his way, Juana's temper flares because of that and Phillip tries to put her out of his way. Isabel would not allow it, of course, and then you havethe Aragonese parliaments also standing on their way. And, as Juan II learnt too well, the Catalan parliament was neither easy to deal with nor to appease, even with a party of followes on his side, something that I wonder how the hell Phillip is going to "buy" one. And with whom.
 
He has a small chance for King of Barcelona, but no chance for Catherine of Aragon. With Isabella still alive Henry VII of England will marry his son much earlier to Henry VIII of England. He may, however, marry Germaine de Foix earlier and have children with her.
I'd forgotten about Germaine de Foix. That adds interesting possibilities.
 
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