WI Hitler is able to break the British/American alliance?

Probably ASB but fun scenario to think about.

So let's say Hitler in fall/winter of 45 is able to pull off a devastating victory to the Western Allies and also their miracle weapons are little more miraculous thus splitting the two allies and bringing a peace in the West.

Germany then transfers all their forces to the East how much longer does this delay the war? Stalin was paranoid to all hell about peace talks between the West and Germany if a Peace is reached between them does that send him over the edge and he makes peace with Germany?

I guess flipping the tables lets say Germany and Russia make a separate peace also at well anytime.. does this effectively end the war in the West? I know Churchill said nothing but unconditional surrender but would the loss of life be too much? I remember reading that one of the reasons why the Wallies didn't go for Berlin is that causalities would be more than 100k and they figured it was too much.
 
I think that Stalin would perceive a separate peace to be a precursor to the West uniting with Germany against him. Hence, he would want to crush Germany as quickly as possible to seize industry and strategic depth.
 
I think that Stalin would perceive a separate peace to be a precursor to the West uniting with Germany against him. Hence, he would want to crush Germany as quickly as possible to seize industry and strategic depth.

Exactly.

But to play with the OP, let's say the big POD is Battle of the Bulge is a major victory for the Germans (miracle after miracle happens) and ASBs take the Wallies out of the war.

The USSR wins by the end of 1945. Millions more dead. Germany will fight for every inch of soil and will have the Rhur intact, which prolongs the agony. The USSR might have the IS3 online, while the Germans might have some more night vision and aircraft, but no fuel for them. Every major German city, just like OTL against the Russians, becomes a clusterF.
 
The Battle of the Bulge doesn't take the western allies out of the war, the Germans don't have the forces to both encircle the front-line forces and push deep into the rear lines, they can do only one or the other.
 
fall winter of 45? more like fall winter 44/45

I am going to preface this with .. <cough> asb..

okay now that i have cleared my throat...

<cough>
damn throat <cough
>

okay lets play..

nope.. earlier.. the germans manage to stop D-Day at the beaches or there abouts.. its a total disaster for the western allies ...
<cough>Carpet bomb, anthrax, <cough>

so england sues for some form of status quo peace.. IE leave england alone. The USA turns its attention to Japan..

Western forces leave the mainland as part of the deal .. its a perfect deal and world for the germans in the west.<cough>

okay what happens..

The germans are forced to throw everything EAST.. and i mean EVERYTHING.. the USA continues to arm the soviets .. even more so... planes, tanks, trucks, guns, canon, cats, dogs, hamsters.

The soviets by this time are a juggernaut and roll to the Atlantic, Germany is a horrific wasteland with not many Germans...

USA turns everything against the Japanese. I would also think more development time would go into the bomb.. atlantic fleet would be pulled to the pacific, air wings also transferred. Japan would be pounded into the dirt and if they held out long enough .. nuked into the dirt as well. if the bomb becomes available before the Soviets reach berlin.. i could see it or other german cities glassed as well.
 
The germans are forced to throw everything EAST.. and i mean EVERYTHING.. the USA continues to arm the soviets .. even more so... planes, tanks, trucks, guns, canon, cats, dogs, hamsters.

Fear the Guards Shock Hamsters, fear them :D

Otherwise yes, some scenario in which the Soviet Union just keeps rolling west, its takes them longer as they are facing more stuff but there is nothing much stopping them barring "miracle" weapons in a Germany choked with mustard gas.
 
Probably ASB but fun scenario to think about.

So let's say Hitler in fall/winter of 45 is able to pull off a devastating victory to the Western Allies and also their miracle weapons are little more miraculous thus splitting the two allies and bringing a peace in the West.

Germany then transfers all their forces to the East how much longer does this delay the war? Stalin was paranoid to all hell about peace talks between the West and Germany if a Peace is reached between them does that send him over the edge and he makes peace with Germany?

I guess flipping the tables lets say Germany and Russia make a separate peace also at well anytime.. does this effectively end the war in the West? I know Churchill said nothing but unconditional surrender but would the loss of life be too much? I remember reading that one of the reasons why the Wallies didn't go for Berlin is that causalities would be more than 100k and they figured it was too much.

"unconditional surrender"?

Churchill never said anything of the sort - it was Roosevelt who dropped that particular bomb during a press conference in Terhan with out having even discussed it with Winston (who was sat next to him at the time).

Churchill haunted by teh losses of WW1 was desperate for any strategy that reduced loss of life among the Commonwealth - hence his Med strategy.

As for defeating the Wallies in 1945?

Not possible.
 
"unconditional surrender"?

Churchill never said anything of the sort - it was Roosevelt who dropped that particular bomb during a press conference in Terhan with out having even discussed it with Winston (who was sat next to him at the time).

Churchill haunted by teh losses of WW1 was desperate for any strategy that reduced loss of life among the Commonwealth - hence his Med strategy.

As for defeating the Wallies in 1945?

Not possible.

Well the task of defeating the Wallies (OK say in winter 1944/45) would require weapons break-throughs beyond the A-bomb.
They would be pretty effective against the Soviets as well I presume?
Its a hard scenario to take seriously. You'll need (lots of) nerve gas and bioweapons for this. With the Germans being vaccinated (there is an Anthrax vaccine... For cattle...). In that case maybe the deterrent could work against the British (tricky....)
 
Splitting the Brits and the Americans? Really?

OK.
PoD sometime during WWI.
Hitler meets a cute Communist girl who convinces him that Germany's defeat is due to the Bloated Plutocrats and Capitalists, and if the Pure Volk had been allowed to blah, blah, blah.

So... Great Depression hits. Germany goes Communist under Hitler.
France goes Communist under ???
WWII is the Franco-German Comintern against the Capitalist West.

The US doesn't want to get involved in Europe, and ends up fighting a Pacific War against Japan.

Relations between the US and UK are frosty for decades later.


---
If you want OUR WWII, have fun. But it's not going to happen.
 

Deleted member 1487

"unconditional surrender"?

Churchill never said anything of the sort - it was Roosevelt who dropped that particular bomb during a press conference in Terhan with out having even discussed it with Winston (who was sat next to him at the time).

Churchill haunted by teh losses of WW1 was desperate for any strategy that reduced loss of life among the Commonwealth - hence his Med strategy.

As for defeating the Wallies in 1945?

Not possible.
What? The Brits told Canarais that unconditional surrender was the only option:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilhelm_Canaris#World_War_II
After 1942, Canaris visited Spain frequently and was probably in contact with British agents from Gibraltar. In 1943, while in occupied France, Canaris is said to have made contact with British agents. He was conducted blindfolded to the Convent of the Nuns of the Passion of our Blessed Lord, 127 Rue de la Santé, where he met the local head of the British Intelligence Services, code name "Jade Amicol", in reality Colonel Claude Olivier. Canaris wanted to know the terms for peace if Germany got rid of Hitler. Churchill's reply, sent to him two weeks later, was simple: "Unconditional surrender".[13]
 
Well, clearly the Nazis win the war since they obviously have divine backing, which is pretty much what would be required for the OP to result.

The USSR wins by the end of 1945.

Probably no later then OTL, honestly. The Germans just don't have the capacity to properly slow or stop the juggernaut the Red Army has become by '45 and once Berlin falls, German resistance on the whole is just going to collapse.
 
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