WI Greater Yugoslavia and (bigger) Little Entente

trurle

Banned
I think a larger Yugoslavia would likely be on opposite sides from the Little Entente.

I agree. IOTL the Yugoslavian position was quite ambiguous. I write recently some wikipedia pages related to Italian divisions of WWII, and there is an indications what several groups in Yugoslavia already supported Axis (Chetnics and Croatians being most prominent). Throw Bulgarians into the Yugoslavian mix, and Greater Yugoslavia will partition Czech together with Hungary and Germany.
 
I agree. IOTL the Yugoslavian position was quite ambiguous. I write recently some wikipedia pages related to Italian divisions of WWII, and there is an indications what several groups in Yugoslavia already supported Axis (Chetnics and Croatians being most prominent). Throw Bulgarians into the Yugoslavian mix, and Greater Yugoslavia will partition Czech together with Hungary and Germany.

do think that Greater Yugoslavia would preempt or contest Italian invasion of Albania.

possible Italy stays neutral while belligerent Yugoslavia moves into Greece and joins Axis?
 
do think that Greater Yugoslavia would preempt or contest Italian invasion of Albania.

possible Italy stays neutral while belligerent Yugoslavia moves into Greece and joins Axis?

That's a very interesting ramification, even more if this alt-Yugoslavia becomes fascist and Nazi Germany strengthens its ties with it - allowing it to abandon Italy as an ally.
 
I agree. IOTL the Yugoslavian position was quite ambiguous. I write recently some wikipedia pages related to Italian divisions of WWII, and there is an indications what several groups in Yugoslavia already supported Axis (Chetnics and Croatians being most prominent). Throw Bulgarians into the Yugoslavian mix, and Greater Yugoslavia will partition Czech together with Hungary and Germany.

Even greater Yougoslavoa would have common interests in keepinh Hungary as is. There was this land called Voivodina in which Hungary was interested. Secondly Yugoslavia and Czechoslovakia don't even share border. Plus there were historicaly good relations between Czech and Slovaks and Serbs, Croats as well as Bulgarians.

If Little Entente would be influenced by Bulgaria joining Yougoslavoa it would be through Romania where Bulgaria was interested in regaining Dobrudja I believe.
 
That's a very interesting ramification, even more if this alt-Yugoslavia becomes fascist and Nazi Germany strengthens its ties with it - allowing it to abandon Italy as an ally.

judging from Italian invasion of Greece, Yugoslavia could defeat an earlier invasion of Albania?
 
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what if the Bulgarian coup of 1934 had been successful in proposed unification with Yugoslavia?
The coup had no such aim at all. An unification between Bulgaria and Yugoslavia is utterly impossible in this period, especially under a nationalist military government. I wonder where you got the idea that such a plan existed.
 
what if the Bulgarian coup of 1934 had been successful in proposed unification with Yugoslavia?

The coup had no such aim at all. An unification between Bulgaria and Yugoslavia is utterly impossible in this period, especially under a nationalist military government. I wonder where you got the idea that such a plan existed.

got the idea it was at least proposed by some elements of coup from Wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bulgarian_coup_d'état_of_1934

and the idea that it was not likely successful from bio of Tsar Boris Crown of Thorns

hence the "what if" to seek further opinions and information, thanks for the post, it adds exactly zero to the conversation.
 
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I agree. IOTL the Yugoslavian position was quite ambiguous. I write recently some wikipedia pages related to Italian divisions of WWII, and there is an indications what several groups in Yugoslavia already supported Axis (Chetnics and Croatians being most prominent). Throw Bulgarians into the Yugoslavian mix, and Greater Yugoslavia will partition Czech together with Hungary and Germany.

The Chetniks were not "pro-Axis". They were formed as the national resistance to the Axis invasion, and did quite a bit of fighting. The Chetniks were largely ethnic Serbian, and it was the anti-Axis attitude of the Serbs which provoked the 1941 German invasion. The Germans offered a reward for the capture of the Chetnik leader Mihajlovic.

However, the Communists formed the Partisans (only after the Axis invasion of the USSR). Some of the people the Partisans killed as alleged Axis collaborators were only political conservatives. The Partisans also showed no scruples about provoking Axis reprisals if those reprisals were directed against Chetnik supporters. This led to clashes between Partisans and Chetniks, and to some Chetniks cooperating with the Germans (though never Mihajlovic).

Another kernel in the nut was the animosity between the Croatian Ustashe and Italy, which seized Dalmatia, previously part of Croatia. The Ustashe were known to murder Italian officers traveling alone. The Ustashe also murdered many ethnic Serbs. Italy, for its part, provided arms to Chetniks for use against the Ustashe.

But the Partisans were opposed to Italy, and denounced this de facto alliance.

The Croatian Ustashe were explicitly allied with the Axis, being awarded a puppet state of their own. But as noted, this state was truncated by Italy, and the Croats were rather sawed off about that. They continued the Axis alliance, but only because it was the only path to any sort of independence for them.
 
judging from Italian invasion of Greece, Yugoslavia could defeat an earlier invasion of Albania?

Possibly. Also the Yugoslavs probably egage in occasional air raids and amphibious attacks, although not too many- they lac the infrastructure for it.
 
do think that Greater Yugoslavia would preempt or contest Italian invasion of Albania.

The operative word is: try.
If this Yugoslavia don't engage in a serious (and costly) program of rearmament their armed forces are not in any shape to fight against Italy...expecially in 1939 when Benny will take the occasion to finally get rid of this big neighbour, so all her capacity will be devoted to a single objective instead of being wasted in various front like OTL.
Better remember that Italy, for all his fault is still one of the Great Power while Yugoslavia and Bulgaria are very minor power with armed forces with a even more outdated equipment than the italians and less industrial capacity, at least in OTL.
Not counting the fact that Yugoslavia at the moment is just a fancy name for Greater Serbia and add Bulgaria while on a side it will be very tempting, also mean bring a comparative strong ethnic group that can compete with the Serbians for the leadership of the nation.

possible Italy stays neutral while belligerent Yugoslavia moves into Greece and joins Axis?

POssible, i don't see Italy and Greater Yugoslavia on the same side for more than a couple of seconds, so if something go wrong between Benny and Adolf Germany can court Yugoslavia to secure her south flank.
Belgrade/Sofia can see this as an occasion to unite more the country in a national struggle...and acquire some piece of land that had really desired for a long time.
 
Not counting the fact that Yugoslavia at the moment is just a fancy name for Greater Serbia and add Bulgaria while on a side it will be very tempting, also mean bring a comparative strong ethnic group that can compete with the Serbians for the leadership of the nation.

POssible, i don't see Italy and Greater Yugoslavia on the same side for more than a couple of seconds, so if something go wrong between Benny and Adolf Germany can court Yugoslavia to secure her south flank.
Belgrade/Sofia can see this as an occasion to unite more the country in a national struggle...and acquire some piece of land that had really desired for a long time.

thought Serbia and Bulgaria, despite their conflicts might have more affinity than with Croats and Bosnians? both being Eastern Orthodox countries?

If Germany and Hungary had cleaved off Croatia per OTL into independent state (had at least putative plan at one point to regain old Austria-Hungary borders)
 
thought Serbia and Bulgaria, despite their conflicts might have more affinity than with Croats and Bosnians? both being Eastern Orthodox countries?

They will both want to be the head honcho and neither will accept very lightly a subordinate position...and this will trump everything else.
 
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