WI: George Alexandrovich instead of Nicholas as Tsar

In this scenario, Grand Duke George Alexandrovich's sickness is butterflied away while Nicholas died pre-1894, making the former the successor to Alexander III.

How would George rule as Tsar? What would be his regnal name? And how would his rule affect Russia?
 
Last edited:
To butterflying away his sickness, have Nicholas die young like their brother Alexander. Meaning the Grand Duke George Alexandrovich is the only heir to his father Alexander III meaning the imperial family would want him healthy.

What would be his imperial name? Tsar George is ok for him.
How would he rule as Tsar? Kindly he was a mummy boy so won't go into ww1 all guns blazing and one with his subjects
And how would his rule affect Russia? We would most likely see a peaceful reform of a constitutional monarchy.
 
To butterflying away his sickness, have Nicholas die young like their brother Alexander. Meaning the Grand Duke George Alexandrovich is the only heir to his father Alexander III meaning the imperial family would want him healthy.

What would be his imperial name? Tsar George is ok for him.
How would he rule as Tsar? Kindly he was a mummy boy so won't go into ww1 all guns blazing and one with his subjects
And how would his rule affect Russia? We would most likely see a peaceful reform of a constitutional monarchy.

Georgie wasn't the only heir if Nicky dies (or is disinherited (someone proposed once that his parents play hardball about their choice of bride for him, he refuses, and enters a monastery instead)), there was their younger brother, Mikhail ("Misha" a.k.a. "Flopsy" to Olga Alexandrovna).

However, George wasn't a mommy's boy, Marie Feodorovna and Queen Alexandra had the same (almost) possessive relationships with their sons. However, Marie's was offset by her disciplinarian attitude, while Alix wasn't. That said, I think George staying close to his mother's side had (at least) something to do with him being sickly. Besides, I don't know of a lot of momma's boys who are allowed to have motorbikes:D.
 

LordKalvert

Banned
He's got to do better than Nicky

Hopefully, he finds a nice Russian Princess to marry and doesn't spend all his time in Hesse Darmstadt

Do not think there is any peaceful turn to a constitutional monarchy- George would be inclined to keep his powers like any Emperor, King, dictator or whatever. No revolts, no compromise
 
Last edited:
To butterflying away his sickness, have Nicholas die young like their brother Alexander. Meaning the Grand Duke George Alexandrovich is the only heir to his father Alexander III meaning the imperial family would want him healthy.
Coddling a future monarch can hardly end well.
 
He's got to do better than Nicky

Hopefully, he finds a nice Russian Princess to marry and doesn't spend all his time in Hesse Darmstadt

Do not think there is any peaceful turn to a constitutional monarchy- George would be inclined to keep his powers like any Emperor, King, dictator or whatever. No revolts, no compromise


1) Well, if we take it that he was reportedly smarter than Nicky, then yes.

2) A Russian princess would disqualify him immediately from the line of succession. If you mean a Russian Grand Duchess, then that might work - except that it might be seen as a bit of a waste for a potential alliance (and I'm not sure which one might be considered). That said, the most likely matches are Hélène d'Orléans or Margaret of Prussia.

3) Can't comment, since I don't know what George's political views were.
 

LordKalvert

Banned
2) A Russian princess would disqualify him immediately from the line of succession. If you mean a Russian Grand Duchess, then that might work - except that it might be seen as a bit of a waste for a potential alliance (and I'm not sure which one might be considered). That said, the most likely matches are Hélène d'Orléans or Margaret of Prussia.


Are you sure on that? Tsars had Russian wives before Peter the Great marries his kid off to a German

Of course, if he waits until he's Tsar he can change the rules

The long trips to Hesse Darmstadt were one of the great problems of Nicholas' reign Would have done much better to spend more time in Russia

Okay found it- there might be some Princesses he could have married but his father may have indulged him as long as she was decent- like a descendant of Gedeminis

Not sure if it excludes HIM or just his offspring
 
Last edited:
Are you sure on that? Tsars had Russian wives before Peter the Great marries his kid off to a German

Of course, if he waits until he's Tsar he can change the rules

The long trips to Hesse Darmstadt were one of the great problems of Nicholas' reign Would have done much better to spend more time in Russia
The Pauline Laws are written practically as a middle finger to Peter the Great tho (but mostly to Catherine the Great especially).

So no, it would be not negotiable. This isnt the age of Peter where any random peasant girl could become Empress.
 
Last edited:

LordKalvert

Banned
The Pauline Laws are written practically as a middle finger to Peter the Great tho (but mostly to Catherine the Great especially).

So no, it would be not negotiable. This isnt the age of Peter where any random peasant girl could become Empress.

I looked them up I was surprised how restrictive they were. That would be a major part of the Romanov problems. Too much foreign influence at the top (Empress Marie never forgot Denmark).

I wan't thinking peasant- more like from a decent but unexceptional family like the Tsars of old married Someone who wouldn't be scandalous just Russian who understood the country. I don't think Alexandra ever did

Lucky for George, he would have been only 23 when he took the throne So changing the rules would have been possible- that was Franz Ferdinand's plan till he got caught
 
I looked them up I was surprised how restrictive they were. That would be a major part of the Romanov problems. Too much foreign influence at the top (Empress Marie never forgot Denmark).

I wan't thinking peasant- more like from a decent but unexceptional family like the Tsars of old married Someone who wouldn't be scandalous just Russian who understood the country. I don't think Alexandra ever did

Lucky for George, he would have been only 23 when he took the throne So changing the rules would have been possible- that was Franz Ferdinand's plan till he got caught
Oh the peasant girl was referring to Peter the Great, who actually did marry a peasant for his wife (who would become the future Catherine I).

Still, the 'unequal marriage' along with the blatant political favoritism (or image of such that would result) would be something to be concerned about. There would definitely be backlash of sort in the Imperial court.

On the bright side, no hemophilia.

Well actually Alexei would still have hemophilia if he's born, but he would merely be nephew to the Tsar rather than heir apparent.
 
No Nicky, means Alexandra most likely doesn't go to Russia, ergo, no Alexei (or no OTL Alexei, rather. Since Alexandra is likely to have sons by her alt-husband who might suffer from haemophilia).

As to Marie never forgetting Denmark, I don't think that's entirely true. She certainly never forgot her family in Denmark, but she never tried to force the constitutional monarchy (as in Denmark and in England) idea onto Russia. Therefore, I don't think that George will marry a Russian aristocrat just because she understands Russia. And also, the aristocrats were (by that point) some so alienated from their estates due to the bubble life they had in St. Petersburg, I don't think it would do much good. Also, the problem with marrying into one aristocratic family is that you get every other aristocratic family ranging themselves against them due to the general rapaciousness.

AFAIK, Alexander II was planning to set the Pauline Laws aside (or some such) when trying to marry his morganatic wife equally. The Imperial Family was vehemently against it, and his morganatic wife was Dolgorukov (one of the oldest families in Tsarist Russia), so I'm not sure if George will be able to make any headway when the chief opponent is likely to be his mother (who was also ringleader of the opposition to Princess Dolgorukova).
 

LordKalvert

Banned
No Nicky, means Alexandra most likely doesn't go to Russia, ergo, no Alexei (or no OTL Alexei, rather. Since Alexandra is likely to have sons by her alt-husband who might suffer from haemophilia).

As to Marie never forgetting Denmark, I don't think that's entirely true. She certainly never forgot her family in Denmark, but she never tried to force the constitutional monarchy (as in Denmark and in England) idea onto Russia. Therefore, I don't think that George will marry a Russian aristocrat just because she understands Russia. And also, the aristocrats were (by that point) some so alienated from their estates due to the bubble life they had in St. Petersburg, I don't think it would do much good. Also, the problem with marrying into one aristocratic family is that you get every other aristocratic family ranging themselves against them due to the general rapaciousness.

AFAIK, Alexander II was planning to set the Pauline Laws aside (or some such) when trying to marry his morganatic wife equally. The Imperial Family was vehemently against it, and his morganatic wife was Dolgorukov (one of the oldest families in Tsarist Russia), so I'm not sure if George will be able to make any headway when the chief opponent is likely to be his mother (who was also ringleader of the opposition to Princess Dolgorukova).


Empress Marie's innate hostility towards Prussia (just like her sister Queen Alexandra in England) came from her Danish days.

Marrying one aristocratic family might create jealousies with the rest or it might tell the rest what is possible in the future. Tsars has always done it before Peter.

The opposition to Princess Dolgorukova, I thought, was that her children would represent a new line that could threaten the old. Like what happens with Peter the Great
 

LordKalvert

Banned
Oh the peasant girl was referring to Peter the Great, who actually did marry a peasant for his wife (who would become the future Catherine I).

Still, the 'unequal marriage' along with the blatant political favoritism (or image of such that would result) would be something to be concerned about. There would definitely be backlash of sort in the Imperial court.

On the bright side, no hemophilia.

Well actually Alexei would still have hemophilia if he's born, but he would merely be nephew to the Tsar rather than heir apparent.

I knew the Peasant girl you were talking about but I was thinking along the lines of the pre Peterine marriages. There would be some risks and benefits.

Alexandra was a good wife and bad Empress.

But this is just wild speculation- who knows whom he would have found
 
Top