WI Gemany double crossed the USSR?

Suppose that during the Nazi-Soviet negotiations late in 1940, Adolf, eager to knock Britain out of the war, agreed to Stalin's terms for joining the Axis? That is, he withdrew troops from Finland and let the Soviets take the dardenelles and Persian gulf. Of course, in real life, as Shirer wrote, the Soviet demands were too great for Adolf to be willing to consider.
But what if he agreed to those terms, and got Britain out of the war in 6 months? He still could've attacked the USSR in mid '41 to try to crush it or force it to give up much of its gains.
 
how the heck were the soviets going to take all of that?

Honestly, the soviets attacking the Persian gulf is only going to make matters worse.

So lets play.

Germans leave finland..
Soviets invade turkey ( now an allied member automatically)
Soviets invade Persia.. ( india and the stan's will be up in arms )

now the germans turn around and invade? they will make momentum .. but the soviets will already have some real experience if they are still active in the Persian gulf which I would suspect to be the case. Persia is mountains and desert. Anatolia is mountains and more mountains and lots of people who don't want to be under soviet control. ( that includes the Christian groups as well )

I'm not sure the Soviets could knock the turks out in under a year.


So England has issues.. they are not going to just give in as long as the USA is supplying material

the US would not be supply material to the soviets in this TL.. and even at that .. the US might be looking to the Japanese more favorably, as might the British.

Net gain ... 0 .. if the germans then double cross the soviets, its game over, if they don't , eventually the soviets are bound to think it a good idea to go west.



so let's play this along even further. neither the soviets nor the germans were close to the bomb. so lets say that by 45 the US gets it first still. war ends. this is a period in history that has very very short time frames for victory for the germans or others. once the bomb is in play it doesn't matter.

so at the end of the day what you have by 46-47 is:
1. no Nazi Germany
2. no soviet union

a fair amount more dead in all probability depending on when the germans stab the soviets in the back .. or if they do at all, once in the fight they may have no choice but to sink or swim together
 

SsgtC

Banned
How goes Germany get Britain out of the war within 6 months, even with Soviet help?
I didn't think they can. Even with the Soviets, they don't have the Naval or Air Power to invade Britain or cut the supply lines to the UK from the US. I also think we're likely to see the US and UK be alot more accommodating to Japan.
 
Keep in mind, Hitler had to pay for a lot of the stuff from the Soviets with military equipment. I also imagine that in the case of an invasion, suothwards, the Soviets will send a lot of the stuff they were exporting to support their armies. Or not. Depends how much they care, and how overt they are.
 
I didn't think they can. Even with the Soviets, they don't have the Naval or Air Power to invade Britain or cut the supply lines to the UK from the US.

Well, wouldn't Russia joining the Axis cause the British to despair of winning the war? Their only hope was to get the US to join them but if Russia joins the Axis first, I'd imagine the US would be more reluctant to go to war. The USSR might not be able to invade Britain or help much at sea, but it could threaten British possessions in the Near and Middle East. The British had their hands full already fighting the reich. In any event a widespread perception that the Axis appears virtually unbeatable might cause Britain to seek peace. Adolf, remember, didn't insist on conquering Britain just getting it to lay off.
 
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